Loosing hope which treeless saddle?!

Which treeless saddle?

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Leg12

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HEEELP!
TIA for reading...

I would like to buy a treeless/flexible/softer tree saddle (this is definitely the way I want to go) and have been indecisively 'ummming' and 'arrrhing' for a couple years as to which one whilst I save the funds.

Looking ideally for a secure, deep seat, maybe dressagey position, (twist like a normal saddle) saddle for long, sometimes, challenging, hacking, schooling and potentially maybe competing one day...which wont cause pressure points under the stirrup bars etc.
I have probably obsessively researched every treeless/flexible saddle on the face of the planet loool but any information I have gained is useless unless I can get my hands on pressure tests, how the internal components are composed/function and how other people have gotten on with them (this is nigh on impossible!).

So I ask you lovely horse and hound forum people what saddle do you have, what activities do you do, and how do you get on with it?

I have considered:
-Heather Moffett Flexee/ Flexee Finale
-Startrekk saddles
-Sensation
-Trekker
-Ghost...not sure about these
etc...

Finally...some incidental background info...the main reason that I have not made a decision yet (and incidentally not put Solutions Saddle on the above list) is because I do not want to make another expensive mistake as I bought a Solution Smart GP which cost me a fortune, was pants (also the expensive fitting never seemed to made the saddle fit the horse correctly in the first place) and caused horrendous pressure points which were a kick in the teeth as the whole reason I went and forked out the extra £s for the Solution was that it was not supposed to do this when compared to other similar saddles! Also their customer service was disappointing.

Many thanks in advance for any info and happy new year all! :) xxx
 
I can't really help because we bought 3 Solution saddles between 4 horses and 2 riders. I x GP, 1 x dressage and 1 x show saddle. We really like them and so do the horses, who are all built very differently, although all about 16hh. We use different arrangements of shims, so that the saddles fit the different horses correctly. We found the customer service excellent but I suppose that it depends who who you speak to/deal with.
 
Have a look at Better Saddles. They retail several makes and are very experienced at fitting treeless saddles. Some are more suitable than others depending on your horse's shape and there is a trial option. If you are not too far they can also come with several saddles for you to try just like a conventional saddle fitter.
 
Solution did not work for me with the new ones with the narrow gullet, gave my horse a lumpy wither.

What did work was the old fashioned Ansur, either they dressage with no gullet at all, or the other ones with a nice wide gullet that come in both GP and Deessage.. It is a long story but the Ansur are what the Solution was developed from (think they bought the right to make them in this country - the Ansur is still made in America) but then they improved them and re-branded the Solution.

The wider gullet is much easier to fit.



You can still get the old fashioned ones on ebay.

ETA - just had a look on ebay, sadly no old fashioned ones branded Ansur in England, this one is from USA... https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ansur-treeless-saddle/292254894827?hash=item440bbfcaeb:g:AEcAAOSw4QVZu1uc

The older Solutions ones were exactly the same, but were called the Classic (no gullet) or Carlton (wide gullet) same as the Ansur. It was as they developed the design that the names changed.

I bought a old Ansur on Ebay, £1000, and it has done BE eventing to 100, hunting and team chasing as well as BS to Newcomers, BD to NOV. They are the saddle most like a tree'ed one. I do agree with the more modern designs though, they did not suit the same horse that was wearing the older ones, so I have not upgraded! (happily I had one on trial).
 
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Could not recommend my Trekker saddle enough. I needed a deep, secure saddle for my mare, something that woul be super comfy for my hacks which are often up and down steep hills and sometimes over tricky terrain. I needed something which would help me to sit some pretty big spooks, as my mare used to lack a lot of confidence. I love this saddle, it does everything I need, and is so comfortable. It is really easy to adjust if your horse gains or loses weight and you need to make it wider or narrower, plus the little arch at the front which is the adjusting mechanism makes a perfect emergency grab bar for those omg moments.I also love the wintec Webber stirrup leathers which are really easy to use, and I find much better if you need to get on and off during hacks. If you are interested I would recommend Louise at equine whispers, they have a Facebook page too.
 
You need to try the Heather Moffets for fit as one does not fit every horse but others in the range will fit that type. I like these saddles though. I have used barefoot but they did not suit me or the horse I had at the time. I bought an Ansur, one of the last imported when they were selling in this country, it fit both the horse and the husband but only got used three times before both stopped riding for health reasons. It now sits in my tackroom unloved as he has a longer leg than me and it does not fit me.

My answer is to try out the saddles before shelling out the cash. What looks right on paper could be all wrong in practice.
 
I've got a Ghost for my very tricky to fit cob. It was literally the only thing we could get to fit him. Its very comfortable and I have the more traditional looking one which is cut in a similar shape to a dressage saddle. It wouldn't have been my first choice as I'm not a huge treeless fan, but its very good quality for the money and the horse goes well in it and that's all that really matter :)
 
I have Heather Moffat Vogues, a GP and a dressage, I think they are Mark 2s. If I had any money right now I'd be looking at a Flexee Finale for definite (bought my vogue 7 years ago before Flexees were a thing... husband's dressage vogue is even older).

I can't fault them although they do take a big of getting used to with not having the twist of a trees saddle. But I school and hack for hours in mine. Have galloped on the beach and done small jumps in it too without it moving. And had physios out while the horses have been in work under these saddles and never had a problem with pressure points under the stirrup bars.

The only thing I would hesitate to do in the vogue is jump big jumps but I wouldn't rule it out completely. I would definitely investigate a Flexee for jumping though.
 
I like the Flexee although I do not like their customer service! I have bought several used now as they didn't respond after sending all the pictures for remote "fitting" and I just could not get a response to buy a new saddle! There are NO fitters who will come to us before anyone jumps on that - that's one piece of information I did manage to get from them.
Torsion, one of the originals, seem to be out of fashion and overtaken by Barefoot although they are a better saddle imo. But if you want a more traditional feel I'd recommend the Flexee.
 
Before my OH's horse mostly ate it i had the same Trekker as MDB, in fact it was a saddle we discussed at length as i had one for my tricky Arab, i was really happy that she liked hers as much as i had liked mine( sobs) it's an amazing saddle for serious hacking and spooky/young horses, i agree with everything she has written including talking to Louise as she sells Ghost as well and is really helpful. I have a Barefoot Cherokee classic for the moment and i really like it, especially for hacking, lovely deep seat but i don't think it would work for you although i would definitely look at the Lexington and it's one i would really like to try myself . Startrek are very similar to Trekker but more expensive and i'm not convinced better. I like the look of the Ghosts but i'm not sure of the wither clearance , certainly not enough for either of mine . The Sensations look amazing but i can't afford one!
 
Because I sometimes show, I found a treeless that looks just like a normal GP saddle with knee rolls. You can still get them second hand. Freedom Holistic saddles. There is a specialist website where several come up for sale, but i got mine very cheaply from preloved. Lovely buffalo leather, you do need the tbar stirrup leathers though. I ride everything in it, and weight 12.5 stone, and never see the slightest mark on the horses backs. I also trialled a Solution saddle, and hated it. I got acute leg cramp after 30 mins hack, and the panels did not appear even on inspection. It was a lot of money too.
 
I have a Heather Moffat Fhoenix it’s the model before the vogue. I like it as it has a point strap and is a very stable saddle. I feel the girthing placement in the Vauge would not suit my horse as much. It’s a comfortable, supportive saddle which suits both me and my horse. Over the years he has had a few saddles, wish I’d found it sooner. You could do anything in this saddle, you do need to let it warm to the horse but once it’s there’s it doesn’t move at all.
 
ok, so I have tried-on wide ponies.

Barefoot Cheyenne-didnt like it, couldn't get it to be very stable, wide seat (no twist). size 2 was blooming huge, looked daft on pony

Ghost Firenze-did like it, stable, well designed, very light, standard size blooming huge, looked daft on pony. pony didn't seemed to mind it (he's stoic) but didn't like the pad so used a polypod riser and standard saddlecloth. felt stable but thought that the poles would get annoying on longer distances. If I were to try another, I'd try one without them.

Dartmoor Treefree-my favourite so far. stable, standard size still too huge but looked less daft on pony (they are shorter), well made and one I would consider buying new and am thinking about a trial with the Tor Ryder.

I did used to ride a horse in an old ansur years ago and found it hideous, as did the pony as she got bad to mount (not my pony).

I saw a flexee the other day in the flesh and was offered a trial with it but it was more than I'd want to spend for the quality of if tbh. looked quite smart from a distance though.
 
Shady said:
Before my OH's horse mostly ate it i had the same Trekker as MDB, in fact it was a saddle we discussed at length as i had one for my tricky Arab, i was really happy that she liked hers as much as i had liked mine( sobs) it's an amazing saddle for serious hacking and spooky/young horses, i agree with everything she has written including talking to Louise as she sells Ghost as well and is really helpful. I have a Barefoot Cherokee classic for the moment and i really like it, especially for hacking, lovely deep seat but i don't think it would work for you although i would definitely look at the Lexington and it's one i would really like to try myself . Startrek are very similar to Trekker but more expensive and i'm not convinced better. I like the look of the Ghosts but i'm not sure of the wither clearance , certainly not enough for either of mine . The Sensations look amazing but i can't afford one!
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Your OH's horse ate your Trekker saddle???
 
Pearlsacarolsinger said:
I can't really help because we bought 3 Solution saddles between 4 horses and 2 riders. I x GP, 1 x dressage and 1 x show saddle. We really like them and so do the horses, who are all built very differently, although all about 16hh. We use different arrangements of shims, so that the saddles fit the different horses correctly. We found the customer service excellent but I suppose that it depends who who you speak to/deal with.
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Pearlsacarolsinger Many thanks for your reply you don't find you get dry patches under the stirrup bars with the Solutions which models (the pro sports or the smart etc?) did you buy? You find you can do a lot in them with no pressure issues?
 
MotherOfChickens said:
ok, so I have tried-on wide ponies.

Barefoot Cheyenne-didnt like it, couldn't get it to be very stable, wide seat (no twist). size 2 was blooming huge, looked daft on pony

Ghost Firenze-did like it, stable, well designed, very light, standard size blooming huge, looked daft on pony. pony didn't seemed to mind it (he's stoic) but didn't like the pad so used a polypod riser and standard saddlecloth. felt stable but thought that the poles would get annoying on longer distances. If I were to try another, I'd try one without them.

Dartmoor Treefree-my favourite so far. stable, standard size still too huge but looked less daft on pony (they are shorter), well made and one I would consider buying new and am thinking about a trial with the Tor Ryder.

I did used to ride a horse in an old ansur years ago and found it hideous, as did the pony as she got bad to mount (not my pony).

I saw a flexee the other day in the flesh and was offered a trial with it but it was more than I'd want to spend for the quality of if tbh. looked quite smart from a distance though.
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MotherOfChickens and Sukistokes2 in regards to HM saddles... Did you have any dry pressure patch problems with any of these under stirrup bars or pommel/cantle? I had a Secondhand Tree Free Western and had bad pressure issues with that, it was an older model, but it did look very nice. I don't live hugely far away from heather moffett so a flexee would be the easiest to get hold of and although she seems nice (met her only a couple times) I have heard bad things about their customer service and very mixed reviews from people with the saddles and pressure point issues with the older ones. I liked the idea of them when I first heard of them as they seemed reasonable priced for what they were only about £350-£600 but now they seem a bit on the expensive side and don't look that aesthetically pretty...However even with all of that the finale is what I was leaning towards if only as I said HM doesn't live that far away so if i had problems with it can easily go back to her maybe? Sukistokes2 good to know that they are stable as I would like to be able to get on from a low log/hedge etc out hacking if i needed to. Ideally I would hope that they were good as that would solve my problem loool.
 
cundlegreen said:
Because I sometimes show, I found a treeless that looks just like a normal GP saddle with knee rolls. You can still get them second hand. Freedom Holistic saddles. There is a specialist website where several come up for sale, but i got mine very cheaply from preloved. Lovely buffalo leather, you do need the tbar stirrup leathers though. I ride everything in it, and weight 12.5 stone, and never see the slightest mark on the horses backs. I also trialled a Solution saddle, and hated it. I got acute leg cramp after 30 mins hack, and the panels did not appear even on inspection. It was a lot of money too.
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cundlegreen Thank you I have not heard of those I shall go google them :) ! You find them ok for longer hacks?Do you know whats inside them like a flexible tree or foam layers etc? Thank you for mentioning weights as often i find it frustrating as a lot of very positive the reviews for treeless are from below average weight/size riders, nothing wrong with that, but is not helpful for me personally (as it makes sense that they would have less issues with pressure spots and dry patches then someone heavier) to determine if the saddle would be appropriate for me.
Glad its not just me who thinks they are extortionately expensive! I was really very angry and disappointed with my Solution, the build and leather quality were so poor for the money, it didn't look like it cost nearly £2000!! But I don't want to sell it until I have found something else that would do instead.
 
Leg12 said:
MotherOfChickens and Sukistokes2 in regards to HM saddles... Did you have any dry pressure patch problems with any of these under stirrup bars or pommel/cantle? I had a Secondhand Tree Free Western and had bad pressure issues with that, it was an older model, but it did look very nice. I don't live hugely far away from heather moffett so a flexee would be the easiest to get hold of and although she seems nice (met her only a couple times) I have heard bad things about their customer service and very mixed reviews from people with the saddles and pressure point issues with the older ones. I liked the idea of them when I first heard of them as they seemed reasonable priced for what they were only about £350-£600 but now they seem a bit on the expensive side and don't look that aesthetically pretty...However even with all of that the finale is what I was leaning towards if only as I said HM doesn't live that far away so if i had problems with it can easily go back to her maybe? Sukistokes2 good to know that they are stable as I would like to be able to get on from a low log/hedge etc out hacking if i needed to. Ideally I would hope that they were good as that would solve my problem loool.
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tbh if I were to go for a HM saddle, I would either want to go for one of the older ones (the St Merryns or suberpanel) or possibly a Vogue as I have friends who have had them for a long time and rate them-and I did like the Vogue when I rode in it. I didn't ride in the FlexEE so I can't comment on it. I had no issues with the Dartmoor but neither did I do tonnes in it-if I were to want to buy, I'd wait for better weather and have a trial period with it. Treefree are very nice to deal with-very helpful.
 
Shady said:
Before my OH's horse mostly ate it i had the same Trekker as MDB, in fact it was a saddle we discussed at length as i had one for my tricky Arab, i was really happy that she liked hers as much as i had liked mine( sobs) it's an amazing saddle for serious hacking and spooky/young horses, i agree with everything she has written including talking to Louise as she sells Ghost as well and is really helpful. I have a Barefoot Cherokee classic for the moment and i really like it, especially for hacking, lovely deep seat but i don't think it would work for you although i would definitely look at the Lexington and it's one i would really like to try myself . Startrek are very similar to Trekker but more expensive and i'm not convinced better. I like the look of the Ghosts but i'm not sure of the wither clearance , certainly not enough for either of mine . The Sensations look amazing but i can't afford one!
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Thanks Shady this is interesting. Oh nooo your saddle :O ?!! Who is MDB? (Is it someone else who has posted on this? I haven't read most of the posts as am struggle to keep up with them (very pleased at the many replies tho :) !! )! Please excuse my rubbishness at dealing posts as im sure everyone can tell I am really struggling to work all this forum stuff properly lol and type the replies to the right people in the right place loooool so please bear with if i don't catch on quickly :) )

I was interested in the Trekkers as seem to have a good endurance following which made me think they may withstand more rising trot and use with less pressure problems? I would be evry grateful to hear more about your experiences with them? With both, the Trekker and the Barefoot, you had no problems with pressure under stirrup bars or pommel/cantle/seat bones etc and you found it stable and secure? How deep was the seat and does it have a 'normal' saddle style twist? I could do with something that can handle spooks and high jinks as we have one stretch of lane which can be tricky as we get the odd crazy local or delivery driver who thinks they are Lewis Hamilton round the bends :/ which is ridiculous as many young mothers from the not too far away estate walk their pushchairs up and down it. Definitely read a lot of reviews of the Ghosts causing pressure patches and being perched which with spooky horse doesn't sound ideal so not sure about those? I can't find any info about how the Startrek functions and how its constructed and reduces the pressure from the stirrup bars. However they look really smart and seem to have a nice deep seat which is appealing. I liked the idea of the Sensations but not sure how comfortable/ secure for your leg the hard use stirrup setting would be and that is what caught my eye, they don't seem to have a very deep seat option either? 'Scuse the massive essay loool!
 
planete said:
Have a look at Better Saddles. They retail several makes and are very experienced at fitting treeless saddles. Some are more suitable than others depending on your horse's shape and there is a trial option. If you are not too far they can also come with several saddles for you to try just like a conventional saddle fitter.
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thank you :) i have seen their website but i will look again and see how far away they are :)
 
Red-1 said:
Solution did not work for me with the new ones with the narrow gullet, gave my horse a lumpy wither.

What did work was the old fashioned Ansur, either they dressage with no gullet at all, or the other ones with a nice wide gullet that come in both GP and Deessage.. It is a long story but the Ansur are what the Solution was developed from (think they bought the right to make them in this country - the Ansur is still made in America) but then they improved them and re-branded the Solution.

The wider gullet is much easier to fit.



You can still get the old fashioned ones on ebay.

ETA - just had a look on ebay, sadly no old fashioned ones branded Ansur in England, this one is from USA... https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ansur-treeless-saddle/292254894827?hash=item440bbfcaeb:g:AEcAAOSw4QVZu1uc

The older Solutions ones were exactly the same, but were called the Classic (no gullet) or Carlton (wide gullet) same as the Ansur. It was as they developed the design that the names changed.

I bought a old Ansur on Ebay, £1000, and it has done BE eventing to 100, hunting and team chasing as well as BS to Newcomers, BD to NOV. They are the saddle most like a tree'ed one. I do agree with the more modern designs though, they did not suit the same horse that was wearing the older ones, so I have not upgraded! (happily I had one on trial).
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red-1 thank you, although i was aware of Ansur, it is interesting to hear that you have done so much harder riding with it and interesting to hear that the more modern ones didn't suit, have you stuck with your original Ansur or bought a new Ansur etc? Solutions seem to be like marmite! The difference being that I rather liked marmite loooool! From what everyone has said trialing a couple saddles looks to be the way to go.
 
MDB said:
Could not recommend my Trekker saddle enough. I needed a deep, secure saddle for my mare, something that woul be super comfy for my hacks which are often up and down steep hills and sometimes over tricky terrain. I needed something which would help me to sit some pretty big spooks, as my mare used to lack a lot of confidence. I love this saddle, it does everything I need, and is so comfortable. It is really easy to adjust if your horse gains or loses weight and you need to make it wider or narrower, plus the little arch at the front which is the adjusting mechanism makes a perfect emergency grab bar for those omg moments.I also love the wintec Webber stirrup leathers which are really easy to use, and I find much better if you need to get on and off during hacks. If you are interested I would recommend Louise at equine whispers, they have a Facebook page too.
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Ah is see what the other persons comment was about now... that sounds like the perfect saddle! Do you know how its constructed inside and have you have any pressure dry patch problems under the stirrup bars/pommel/cantle/seat bones? How is the twist is it like that of a normal saddle as it sort of looks like it does not have much of one? Which model of trekker do you have? Also does the solid front part in anyway impede the shoulder movement? Although I am after a secure, deep seat dressagey style, I am curious as to whether you can you jump in a Trekker? Jumped in my Solution GP and nearly lost the saddle under the horse and that was with a tight fancy fairfax girth and everything! Thank you that rings a bell I think I have perused the website but I shall have a look and see if i can find the facebook page.
 
rabatsa said:
You need to try the Heather Moffets for fit as one does not fit every horse but others in the range will fit that type. I like these saddles though. I have used barefoot but they did not suit me or the horse I had at the time. I bought an Ansur, one of the last imported when they were selling in this country, it fit both the horse and the husband but only got used three times before both stopped riding for health reasons. It now sits in my tackroom unloved as he has a longer leg than me and it does not fit me.

My answer is to try out the saddles before shelling out the cash. What looks right on paper could be all wrong in practice.
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Sounds like a good plan and wise advice :) :) I will try my best to try some I just would like to narrow it down so i don't spend lots of money on trialing different ones
 
Leo Walker said:
I've got a Ghost for my very tricky to fit cob. It was literally the only thing we could get to fit him. Its very comfortable and I have the more traditional looking one which is cut in a similar shape to a dressage saddle. It wouldn't have been my first choice as I'm not a huge treeless fan, but its very good quality for the money and the horse goes well in it and that's all that really matter :)
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If you don't mind me asking what sort of stuff do you do in it and how far do you hack in it, how secure do you find it for spooks etc, do you find it perched? Do you get any pressure dry patches under the stirrups/pommel/cantle/seat bones? Thanks for the info :)
 
PapaverFollis said:
I have Heather Moffat Vogues, a GP and a dressage, I think they are Mark 2s. If I had any money right now I'd be looking at a Flexee Finale for definite (bought my vogue 7 years ago before Flexees were a thing... husband's dressage vogue is even older).

I can't fault them although they do take a big of getting used to with not having the twist of a trees saddle. But I school and hack for hours in mine. Have galloped on the beach and done small jumps in it too without it moving. And had physios out while the horses have been in work under these saddles and never had a problem with pressure points under the stirrup bars.

The only thing I would hesitate to do in the vogue is jump big jumps but I wouldn't rule it out completely. I would definitely investigate a Flexee for jumping though.
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Thank you definitely food for thought as this would be the easiest option for me :) :) ...and you've never had any dry patches at all, even with lots of rising trot work or long hacks?
 
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