Lung Biopsy

[Cheshire Chestnut]

Has anyone's horse ever had a lung biopsy?

How were they and were they ok afterwards?

Worried sick here and need to know people have had success at these. The vet explained they are a last resort and don't like to do them as they carry a variety of complications.

 

[Cheshire Chestnut]

No one?

 

[fatpiggy]

Can't help I'm afraid. Since you are in Cheshire, could you ring Ashbrook or Leahurst and see if anyone there can advise? Take a look at the website horseadvice.com too. Its an American site run by a vet and is a mine of information via the forum boards. You have to be a paid up member to post and read the articles, but you can read the boards for free. They are quite often a bit ahead of us with techniques etc in the US. I highly recommend becoming a member though, its a few dollars a month and is a really good resource - you can post messages directly to the vet there too.

 

[Cheshire Chestnut]

Thank you for your reply. I will have a look at that site and see if I can find any advice

He's currently at Leahurst now, that's where he will be having the biopsy. Obviously the vet wouldn't do it if it wasn't needed but he did say he's a last resort test and he was hoping the other tests were fruitful enough not have to do it, however it doesn't seem that way

 

[MileAMinute]

Nothing constructive to add but thinking of you and Geezer! x

 

[fatpiggy]

Thank you for your reply. I will have a look at that site and see if I can find any advice

He's currently at Leahurst now, that's where he will be having the biopsy. Obviously the vet wouldn't do it if it wasn't needed but he did say he's a last resort test and he was hoping the other tests were fruitful enough not have to do it, however it doesn't seem that way

Well at least he is in very good hands. May I ask what is wrong/they think might be wrong with him?

 

[Cheshire Chestnut]

Well at least he is in very good hands. May I ask what is wrong/they think might be wrong with him?

Sorry for the delay. Yes of course, it started out as COPD/RAO but was treated for that and his last lung washes came back clear but was still coughing. He then got referred to Leahurst by my vet and they did chest X-rays, ultrasounds and also a deep lung endoscope. None of them came back with anything screamingly obvious other than the things they already knew and showing abnormalities in his lungs. So they did a lung biopsy (where they go in his side and through his ribs). I was hoping to have the full results today but unfortunately that hasn't happened so I'm still waiting. I did speak to the vet today and she said they're expecting it to be fibrosis of the lung. It's incurable. The full result tomorrow will determine how progressed it is and if it's even manageable with drugs. I will be taking him home tomorrow, back to where he belongs. I get married in 3 weeks, this feels like a complete nightmare - I'm in bits.

I'm utterly heartbroken. He's 8 years old and he's my life. I can't imagine my future without him in it, I was meant to look after him until he was an old man.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

I really feel for you, having lost 3 horses under the age of 12 myself - all to different causes.

And I am sorry to say that I have no good news for you. I have no experience of fibrosis of the lung in horses but my father has it, it took ages to get a diagnosis and he has been told that it is progressive and there is no effective drug treatment. Dad is on oxygen for a minimum of 16 hrs per day, I can't imagine that a horse could be treated in that way. He is almost 88 and this condition has totally changed the way he lives his life - he used to be very active until about 2 yrs ago and now he spends most of his time sitting in a chair, watching TV.

I hope the vets can give you some hope but think that you need to prepare yourself to make a decision in the near future.
I'm sorry this has come at what should be a super happy time for you. Do let us know what the vets say.

 

[Cheshire Chestnut]

I really feel for you, having lost 3 horses under the age of 12 myself - all to different causes.

And I am sorry to say that I have no good news for you. I have no experience of fibrosis of the lung in horses but my father has it, it took ages to get a diagnosis and he has been told that it is progressive and there is no effective drug treatment. Dad is on oxygen for a minimum of 16 hrs per day, I can't imagine that a horse could be treated in that way. He is almost 88 and this condition has totally changed the way he lives his life - he used to be very active until about 2 yrs ago and now he spends most of his time sitting in a chair, watching TV.

I hope the vets can give you some hope but think that you need to prepare yourself to make a decision in the near future.
I'm sorry this has come at what should be a super happy time for you. Do let us know what the vets say.

Thank you and I'm so sorry to hear about your dad. It must be such a sad time for you to see him like that

Suppose that's where, as hard as it seems, the choice to give your horse a dignified and pain free end is a blessing. I'd never ever want him to suffer. He looks well at the moment and so full of life still, I know with this condition that won't last for long and I'd always want him to feel happy as he can - never deteriorate or become a shadow of himself.

God I just don't want tomorrow to arrive, I keep thinking back over last summer how well and fit he was, how much I didn't truly appreciate how much I loved him and how much I'll miss him if he can't be here any longer

 

[fatpiggy]

Thank you and I'm so sorry to hear about your dad. It must be such a sad time for you to see him like that

Suppose that's where, as hard as it seems, the choice to give your horse a dignified and pain free end is a blessing. I'd never ever want him to suffer. He looks well at the moment and so full of life still, I know with this condition that won't last for long and I'd always want him to feel happy as he can - never deteriorate or become a shadow of himself.

God I just don't want tomorrow to arrive, I keep thinking back over last summer how well and fit he was, how much I didn't truly appreciate how much I loved him and how much I'll miss him if he can't be here any longer

Oh dear, I feel your pain too as my father also died of fibrosis of the lung aged only 69. Its an autoimmune disease and most times you never know what triggered it. Has the vet suggested steriods?

 

[Cheshire Chestnut]

Oh dear, I feel your pain too as my father also died of fibrosis of the lung aged only 69. Its an autoimmune disease and most times you never know what triggered it. Has the vet suggested steriods?

So sorry to hear about your dad

Yes they suggested it but the dosage would be that high that it would trigger lami. He's a higher risk pony to lami already by being a Welsh D and a tendency to be overweight no matter how much of diet he's on. It's literally a no win situation.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

Fingers crossed that you get a different diagnosis today but if fibrosis is found, perhaps you can talk to the vets about management which will allow you to keep him a while longer, even if he isn't fit to be ridden for long. I imagine a dust-free environment and feed would help.
Good luck and as you say, at least you can make a decision which allows him to go with dignity, while he is still enjoying life, so try to take some comfort from that, if it is necessary.

 

[JillA]

So sorry you find yourself in this situation - we do invest so much emotionally in these special horses. I hope they find something treatable - he is in the best hands

 

[Cheshire Chestnut]

Thank you to you both. I didn't sleep at all last night, I nodded off at around 5:30am and my OH came in from his night shift at 6:30am. Results will be in around 2pm today, I feel sick

 

[fatpiggy]

I forgot to add - I did alot of research about the condition before my dad was even diagnosed because unfortunately I worked out what was wrong with him months before the consultant gave him the diagnosis. In the UK they seem to just give up with human cases whereas in the US they are really proactive. The major thing I found at that the most important thing is exercise. You need to keep the body working as efficiently as possible so a fit body needs far less oxygen than an unfit one. As your boy seems perfectly healthy and fine in himself at the moment, cough excepted, then keep working him. You might not be able to do explosive activities like galloping or jumping but steady hillwork, long hacks at a slower pace will benefit him. I know what it is like to live with a horse that might not see tomorrow so my best advice is live for today. If he is ok today, then that is all that matters. Let's face it, look how many had grand plans for their young horses only to come down to find a fatal/total loss of use field injury. You are feeling really stressed at the moment because your upcoming wedding is taking all your energy, and this is such an extra burden but try not to feel completely dispondent. Worry only what you can do something about and not what you can't.

 

[racebuddy]

Pm u x

 

[Piaffe123]

Have you had any news? I'm crossing everything for you that it's been good news for you xxx

 

[Cheshire Chestnut]

Essay alert: Ok so had his results and although they aren't good, there's a bit of temporary relief in them.

Basically it is the worst case scenario in the fact he has fibrosis of his lungs, where lung tissue has died and will never regrow. It is a degenerative condition and it will get worse. The biopsy was clear for any kind of viruses and infections which is good. Basically the fibrosis is incurable and will continue to get worse due to chronic inflammation in his lower lung. The top third of his lungs and trachea are looking good and that's been down to the steroids via his nebuliser. Unfortunately horses can't be told or trained to breathe deeper when having the neb so the medicine is never going to get deep enough. The steroids needed orally to combat the lower lung would be too strong for his size and weight and would lead to lami quite quickly or kidney problems. However I literally have no other choice than to try it for 2 weeks initially. It's the only thing that could save him. The vet said we owe him that at least and I have to agree - his will to fight is too strong to give up on him without giving him a chance. I suppose because there's no known results as of yet, no one can advise in the probability of it working/not working so we will just have to see. If we can reduce the inflammation, this will stop it slow down the fibrosis.

If it does work, it will in no way be a cure. The damage that's already there will remain but the inflammation that's causing it to turn into fibrosis will hopefully be stopped by this drug. That's the plan anyway. It's going to hard work, he cannot go on grass because of the risk of lami with this drug but the yard owner said he can go in a huge stable by itself (but still in proximity of other horses) and the vet said he'd be allowed to have a strip of grass sectioned off so he can wonder in and out and have a bit of fresh air and a nibble of some grass. I'll have to keep him on special dust free flaked bedding and he's only allowed soaked hay. He's allowed to be ridden as soon as his stitches come out next week and as long as I don't hammer him, he can work as normal

I know the results are far from ideal but considering I thought I'd have to say goodbye to him, even a few weeks seems like a blessing. It means I can look forward to my wedding in 3 weeks knowing my pony will be back home and happy, where he belongs and I'll be doing everything I can to make him pull through xx

 

[meesha]

Sounds like good news, lovely that you can take him home and keep working him, fingers crossed the treatment works. Congrats on the wedding, hope your stress levels have now reduced slightly.

 

[Cheshire Chestnut]

Sounds like good news, lovely that you can take him home and keep working him, fingers crossed the treatment works. Congrats on the wedding, hope your stress levels have now reduced slightly.

Thank you, they would have done had I not been for my final dress fitting today and somehow managed to stain my dress with grease - think it was moisturiser Been reassured it will come off in a full clean. Arrrgh!

 

[Piaffe123]

That does sound reassuring, as you say you can focus on your wedding for now and try your best with him.

Hope the big day goes well xxx