Making it mandatory to muzzle dogs in public

Luci07

Luci07

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There was a thread posted on FB from a paper which is trying to run a campaign to have ALL staffords muzzled in public. They printed an awful picture of a dog snarling which clearly was not a stafford either.

Anyway the postive was that (last time I looked) over 79% of people were against and were sensibly saying that action should be taken against OWNERS and not blaming the breed.

But.. what really REALLY shocked me was the amount of "mothers with children" on the board... who were stating that all dogs should be muzzled.. because they don't want their children bitten when the child goes upto the dog.

So no prizes for guessing but I did register and put my penniesworth on and was pretty strong in my choice of words. I pointed out that no parent or ANY individual should EVER routinely approach a strange dog without asking the owner. Appreciate its a different matter if said dog goes over (i.e owners responsiblility) but I was really taken aback that these women, routinely felt it was absolutely fine to let their children wander over to strange dogs.

It is something I feel strongly about. My first rescue staff was rehomed to me because I had no children. She was completely terrified of them (having been burnt and abused by the 7 - 10 year old brigade). Yet if I was out, and children would come over - I would tell the parents that my dog was scared and to keep their children away (said dog would be cowering behind me shaking) and it was laughable how the parents would just nod and carry on ignoring their children. We left one lunch party early as while my dog was tied next to me (happily), one of the children was actually trying to creep behind me to get to my dog, despite being told off (by me). Should also point out that child had not been expected at said party as I would not have brought my dog with me.

What are your experiences with parents and children? and their assumptions about your dogs?
 
My best one was when I had to leave Henry outside a shop for a minute while I went to beg some change for a car park (they had got rid of the nice little ticket man in favour of a machine in between my visits and I only had foldy money with me - and too hot and sunny to leave him in the car) and I came out to find a toddler playing with Henry, watched by his father. I was incredulous, to say the least!:eek:
 
I went to a horse auction last week, was busy looking at the horses, turned round to see a girl of about 4 holding my JRT in her arms (still attached to her lead!) luckily she didn't mind (lazy thing loves being picked up) but her parents were no-where in sight!
 
How ridiculous! There are things to take out of this though. From a dog owners perspective we will never be safe from stupid parents allowing their kids to come up to strange dogs, equally there will always be stupid dog owners who allow dogs roam and take dogs out with a potential to harm without muzzling. However even though I'm no staff fan as such it has balls all to do with the breed of dog. It's down to the individual dog. I do think its important for all dog owners to err on the side of caution and think of a worse case scenerio in order to be responsible. For example my lurcher has the potential if approached by a child or even an adult to bite them if they bumble straight in to fuss her. So in public if with my other dogs she is always muzzled (this being because with 4 dogs I have more chance of lapsing in concentration, loosing one for some reason, one of the others taking my attention for the crucial split second etc. And I definately err on the side of caution by choosing to muzzle, she has never damaged anyone or anything whilst out walking but I dont want to take uneccessary risk. The reason I started muzzling was dogs in the area approaching us when walking and not under control, with 4 dogs it wouldnt have taken much for me to make a wrong move and her to have bitten one of them even though I believe I would not be at fault in this scenerio its not worth the risk, the same would apply to kids although we dont have many roaming kids around here! If shes out with just me I will happily walk her anywhere including through town, with no muzzle and she will talk to kids nicely but she has my full attention to not allow a mistake to happen.
That was long winded but its about BOTH parties being responsible and naff all to do with a breed of dog. I bet if my lurcher was tied outside a shop like Henry then the same would happen and shes NOT safe (so I wouldnt do it but as an example!) If a friendly staff was outside the shop then the father prob wouldnt have allowed the child near. Thats wrong on so many levels.
 
When I was a kid I was always made to ask if I wanted to say hello to another dog. I still do it with new dogs. For example yesterday a little puppy jumped up at me at work, I asked if they were friendly / if I should ignore them (my own dog jumps up and I hate people fussing her for doing it!)
B loves kids, she is brilliant with my toddler god daughter she just licks her to death. I encourage children to give her a fuss but always tell them to ask the dogs owner first because not all dogs like to be fussed.
If I pass a dog tied up outside a shop I give them a wide berth, regardless of breed, because I don't know them nor them me.

IMO parents need to take more responsibility for their kids and teach them manners, if we have our dogs under control why should children be allowed to roam free and do whatever they like?
 
I've noticed its normally the children with dogs in the family that ask if they can stroke Yellow Dog, otherwise they just launch on him. Luckily he's fine and won't do anything. I'm sure its got worse in recent years tho - when I had Bear it was quite rare for someone not to ask which was fortunate coz she was blind in one eye and sometimes snapped if approached suddenly on that side.

Parents do seem to have an irrational fear of dogs tho, its something Ive noticed since my sisters and my friends have started 'producing'. With most of them all the dog has to do is make a noise and the parents are accusing the dog of growling/being aggressive :confused:
 
this is probably a little off topic.. but I hate it when people come up to Lola, I'll be trying to keep her on the floor and teaching her not to nibble and people will encourage her up and hold her paws up as Im trying to hold her down! and Ive even had a woman put her hand in her mouth and say 'aww shes teething, you should let her chew your hands!'. Im far too polite for my own good sometimes!

I dont think it should be mandatory, but I do think if your dog is known to be snappy you should muzzle him/her. Just to prevent any accidents ...its not worth the dogs life :)
 
All of mine go the over way - i.e overly friendly and make a concerted effort to mug any human in sight for a cuddle. I have absolutely no concerns that any of my current 3 would bite a human (tongue in the mouth is another matter) but it was an issue with my previous dog so one I am well aware of.

So heres another question for you lot - do you think its human nature to assume the worst of the animal rather than actually consider the animal is shaped BECAUSE of how the human behaved? Now I know there are exceptions but think we would all agree, a truly "rogue" animal is pretty rare but what do you think of the blanket response that a eg, Staffords/Dobies/GSD's will always attack etc etc
 
See I actually may agree with this if it were ALL DOGS, not just all Staffords. I think if every single solitary dog had to be muzzled in public there would be masses less dog/people bites, problems etc etc. However you simply can not make this sort of sweeping rule breed specific!!
 
I and my brother & sisters were also taught to ask before approaching a strange dog, but as toddlers ,mum always had us on reins, maybe kids need that today rather than dogs being muzzled.

I rarely get approached with my dogs purely because they are big and intimidating but have been asked by parents if their children can pet them and am happy to oblige, but tell children not to put their faces close to the dogs and always tell the children why.
 
I am the other way around, if I see a kid looking shy but they 'want' to come over, I invited them over for gentle pats. My last two bitches converted hundreds of people who thought GSDs were all man-stopping maniacs into realising, they could be quite nice, actually and there are a lot of people out there who still say 'I hate Alsatians, I am scared of them - except Nancy' etc etc etc.

I do remember last year at an open day a family asked if their kids could pat B and I was delighted and the little boy came straight over and grabbed B's ear, which was sore at the time, the look on his face! But he did not react at all.
I am so, so insistent that ALL people of whatever age ask before they pet, let their kids pet, or let their dogs come up to my dog and I always ask too.

In a way, it was the way I was reared and also because one of the biggest *******ings I ever got in my life from a police dog handler after I just stuck my hand out towards his dog suddenly when I was a kid - stupid, considering our force WELCOMED fighters and biters back in the day.
I think as mentioned in another post, it would be safer to assume that ALL dogs are capable of biting and ask their owners to stroke, rather than that they are all safe and pile on in there and risk it, and to NEVER approach an unaccompanied dog (for young people).

I am a bit concerned about how hyper-protective *some* parents are these days, their kids must be so wrapped in cotton wool :( when they are more in danger in their own homes and people from their own family circle than they are out in the big bad world.
Jeez I used to be out in the fields, most of the time on my own, all day, making mud pie, getting bitten and trodden on by horses, stung by bees, kids these days etc etc etc...
 
Dobiegirl said:
I and my brother & sisters were also taught to ask before approaching a strange dog, but as toddlers ,mum always had us on reins, maybe kids need that today rather than dogs being muzzled.

I rarely get approached with my dogs purely because they are big and intimidating but have been asked by parents if their children can pet them and am happy to oblige, but tell children not to put their faces close to the dogs and always tell the children why.
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Absolutely - we should start a petition for children to be kept on leads.
 
Obviously it's crazy to suggest that all dogs of a certain breed should be muzzled. However, I do agree with Vizlak about muzzling dogs known to be 'snappy' or known to be at risk of snapping. I have a friend with a dog who has snapped at children, more than once, and yet she walks her dog off-lead and unmuzzled. This dog
hasn't ever caused any serious injury, thankfully, but clearly has the potential to should a child run up to her without warning... Whilst I understand that it must be really emotionally hard to muzzle your dog, I cannot understand why you wouldn't do so if there was even a small chance that a child might get hurt :(

Slightly pointless post really, Vislak's comments just made me think.
 
Katie_A said:
Obviously it's crazy to suggest that all dogs of a certain breed should be muzzled. However, I do agree with Vizlak about muzzling dogs known to be 'snappy' or known to be at risk of snapping. I have a friend with a dog who has snapped at children, more than once, and yet she walks her dog off-lead and unmuzzled. This dog
hasn't ever caused any serious injury, thankfully, but clearly has the potential to should a child run up to her without warning... Whilst I understand that it must be really emotionally hard to muzzle your dog, I cannot understand why you wouldn't do so if there was even a small chance that a child might get hurt :(

Slightly pointless post really, Vislak's comments just made me think.
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Because with EVERY dog there is a "small" chance a child may get hurt- you can not predict a dog or childs reaction every single time!
 
in general pople ask if betty is friendly before launching in to pat her... breed prejudice... :rolleyes::p but that i am greatfull for! :D

i always say yes she's friendly. and they give her a pat and thats that. although one woman was a total iiiiidot and stuck her face in betty's and stared at her... betty didnt like that!

i think its responsible to muzzle your dog in public if you know it is sometimes snappy etc.

my friend used to muzzle her soft as soft could be dalmatian if she had him at the country day/fair etc... not because he was snappy... but because he was just the right height for stealing kiddies ice creams and burgers... and he was always thinking about his tummy! that is just responsible and sensible. :)

if the stafford is to be muzzled then so too should all dogs out in public. we need to end all this bloody BSL! :mad:
 
I do not agree that just staffies should be muzzled- is this a government ploy to try and crack down on youths in urban areas with status dogs? Especially as the police seem unable to disperse these gangs when they are loitering!

I have three dogs, a v soppey lab, a mini JRT and a working collie. All are amazing with humans and other dogs and my daughter respects them greatly. But I have been in two seperate situations where she was in danger.

The first being at the game fair, my daughter was 1 and she eating a carrot (v boring mum!) and a lab x tried to take the carrot out of her hand and it bit her fingers, causing them to bleed. She was shocked and so was I. Luckily I had a friend with me who saw what happened and gave the dogs owners what for, it may have been an accident but if you feel that your dog in any way many cause harm to anyone (human or other animal) then leave it at home.

The second being at a cricket club, where a weimeraner (sp) was roaming around the club grounds and my daughter was playing on a blanket with a noisey animal toy, the dog was obviously uncomfortable with the noise and he went for her.

I also hate people approaching our dogs when on long walks etc, I trust all of them but who does the buck fall with if someone gets bitten... the owner and we, as dog lovers, should take every precaution to not allow this to happen. However, muzzling is not the answer, educating people is. It is far to easy to own a pet these days.
 
Well it doesn't really matter, does it, poor Lennox was muzzled every time he was out, as a precaution, and he is being PTS after almost 18 months of stagnation in a kennel block, despite never biting another dog or human being.
 
There's a simple answer. Bring back Dog Licences, and the cost should be £100 per year, per dog.

I accept that that's the most awful sweeping statement, and there will be the elderly, and the infirm, who simply can't afford it, BUT it would certainly cut down on those who churn out these puppies, without a second's thought as to their futures.

The days when these often unsuitable puppies, spew out from the breeders, land in the laps of idiots, and then end up in the care, of those who care, must be curtailed.

OK, so it's a sweeping statement, but surely, enough is enough. Dumping the unwanted, upon the well intentioned, is wrong.

CC, poor Lennox, if I had the room, and or the inclination,....... but then I could fill my home with the waifs. :o

Alec.
 
The only dog I've been close to being bitten by was a chihuahua in its owners arms.

Do you think they make muzzles that small :rolleyes:

Totally ridiculous idea.

Your more at risk of people than you ever are of dogs.
 
As I have said before I think Licences should be brought back(£100) is way too much but every dog should be compulsary chipped. The revenue for this could pay for extra dog wardens with scanners who could seize every dog not micro chipped and the owner fined. Now I know in the beginning there would be an influx of dogs going into rescue but it would eventually level out and would discourage impulse buying.Whilst they are at it all breeders have to chip their puppies and no breeder to microchip more than x number per year. This would help get rid of puppy farms and whilst Im not saying this is a perfect system with a bit of minor tweaking could be more than workable.
 
I find it quite shocking when out & about to see just how many parents either are not supervising their young kids or seem to let them do as they please and generally have no respect for other people when in a public place.

Not that many children or their parents are polite enough to ask if they can stroke my dogs before approaching them and we've had a few instances where a kid has ran up & patted them or stuck their face on my dogs head before i had chance to stop them, thankfully my dogs are tolerant but it is worrying.

Muzzling a breed or dogs in general may reduce bites, although often the attacks on kids that make the news are in their own or another's home where it wouldn't be muzzled. I certainly wouldn't like to see it become mandatory for a breed as it would no doubt others would get added to the list and expect it would have an even more negative effect on views towards dogs as pets. I don't know how you'd make parents & dog owners more responsible for their charges though.
 
Alec Swan said:
There's a simple answer. Bring back Dog Licences, and the cost should be £100 per year, per dog.

I accept that that's the most awful sweeping statement, and there will be the elderly, and the infirm, who simply can't afford it, BUT it would certainly cut down on those who churn out these puppies, without a second's thought as to their futures.

The days when these often unsuitable puppies, spew out from the breeders, land in the laps of idiots, and then end up in the care, of those who care, must be curtailed.

OK, so it's a sweeping statement, but surely, enough is enough. Dumping the unwanted, upon the well intentioned, is wrong.

CC, poor Lennox, if I had the room, and or the inclination,....... but then I could fill my home with the waifs. :o

Alec.
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Its irresponible owners which are the problem, They clearly will not obtain a dog license so that would solve nothing and penalise genuine responsible dog owners - I have 10 dogs! That would be £1000 a year, ridiculous!
 
We often went to London Zoo and it was before they had those new enclosures and I was off under the barrier and about to put my hand through the bars to stroke the very friendly lion:eek: so with 4 kids, mum and dad always had me on reins.

Do any of you remember the poem when Stanley got eaten by the lion:D it was always read by Stanley Hollaway, it always had a special resonance for me.:D
 
Luci07 said:
But.. what really REALLY shocked me was the amount of "mothers with children" on the board... who were stating that all dogs should be muzzled.. because they don't want their children bitten when the child goes upto the dog.

So no prizes for guessing but I did register and put my penniesworth on and was pretty strong in my choice of words. I pointed out that no parent or ANY individual should EVER routinely approach a strange dog without asking the owner. Appreciate its a different matter if said dog goes over (i.e owners responsiblility) but I was really taken aback that these women, routinely felt it was absolutely fine to let their children wander over to strange dogs.

What are your experiences with parents and children? and their assumptions about your dogs?
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OMG:eek::eek::eek: Even I as a grown-up do not go up to strange dogs even as a dog owner. I'm very wary of strange dogs as been bitten by one that came behind me on a walk a nipped my leg while owner was oblivious to what was going on.

Like OP said a dog may be ok with adults but not child.

Some people in this case should not have children :mad:
 
Wasn't it Albert and the Lion? My mums partner breeding gSDs back in the 70s used to recite that brilliantly. :D Some of these posts have just reminded me of my reins, I can remember them vividly, pink leather with a kitten on the front. :o
Anyhoo, back to the topic, I posted the other week how annoying it was that parents let their children dive in to stroke Pickle, who can be a bit puppy nippy, and yet pulled them away from Evie, who adores children. Oh and I used to have a chihuahua who had many bites to his name, he was an evil little s*d.
I don't think mandatory muzzling is the answer, but somehow dogs owners must be made more responsible, and I just wish there was some way of licensing and controlling ALL people who breed dogs. The responsible ones already have some form of control through the KC, and the ABS scheme does now insist pups are all identified, but pups produced by these breeders are sadly in the minority.
 
Dobiegirl said:
We often went to London Zoo and it was before they had those new enclosures and I was off under the barrier and about to put my hand through the bars to stroke the very friendly lion:eek: so with 4 kids, mum and dad always had me on reins.

Do any of you remember the poem when Stanley got eaten by the lion:D it was always read by Stanley Hollaway, it always had a special resonance for me.:D
Click to expand...

Oh indeed was`nt "we did`nt have a boy to feed lions" somewhere in it?:D
 
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