Making Paddocks from scratch

poiuytrewq

Well-Known Member
Joined
3 April 2008
Messages
20,029
Location
Cotswolds
Visit site
Currently the space is arable, not sure what exactly but we plan to fence and grass a few paddocks off for my horses.
Question is when would you seed the area and how long am I looking at for the grass to become established enough to graze without ruining it?
In a way its probably going to be taken out of my hands as I obviously need to rely on people with the right gear for the job but in an ideal world?
Also is there any sort of seed I should be pushing for? It will be grazed by good doers!
 

Meowy Catkin

Meow!
Joined
19 July 2010
Messages
22,635
Visit site
You don't want rye grass then. You can get grass seed mixes that are rye free and suitable for horses.

Someone near me grass seeded a paddock and they only put sheep on it the first year and horses on it the following year.
 

kobi

Well-Known Member
Joined
17 September 2013
Messages
185
Visit site
If you seed in the spring then take hay off it at the end of the summer you should then be ok. As faracat said make sure you plant horse specific seed mix with no rye. You might need planning permission to convert from arable to horse use. Check with your council.
 

Honey08

Waffled a lot!
Joined
7 June 2010
Messages
19,570
Location
north west
Visit site
It does take quite a while to establish a grass field. Ideally it needs a good 18 months or longer. Hopefully there will be a good grass verge around the arable bits already that you can use initially to graze on.

I'd plan a hardstanding turnout area by the yard gate too if possible, they're worth their weight in gold in bad weather (mine are on ours as we speak).
 

poiuytrewq

Well-Known Member
Joined
3 April 2008
Messages
20,029
Location
Cotswolds
Visit site
Oh god, really!?! I wasn't expecting it to take that long! (impatient me!) I'm not actually sure if there are strips round it currently but think possibly not :(
Will definitely bear in mind the Rye grass business, thanks for that tip.

I will also look into the hardstanding area, that's something I had hoped might be an option anyway, not just for winter but I have a Shetland pony so it would be ideal for restricting his grass.

Might have to look for grazing to rent for a while longer then in reality.
:'( Boo!
 

poiuytrewq

Well-Known Member
Joined
3 April 2008
Messages
20,029
Location
Cotswolds
Visit site
On second thoughts I could maybe use one in a trash paddock type way whilst the others are becoming established and feed hay out there. Seeding that one next spring?!
 

sport horse

Well-Known Member
Joined
23 January 2002
Messages
2,026
Visit site
If you are lucky and can get it seeded this spring you should, with a decent spring/summer be able to take a hay/haylage cut off it this year. If the weather is then dry you could lightly graze it until the autumn. The very worst thing you could do in the first two years is to allow it to get poached. The roots of the newly seeded grass will not be established and deep enough to cope. As for grass seed I would talk to an agricultural seed specialist (most farmers will know one locally) and they will advise you the best mix of seeds for your requirements.
 

poiuytrewq

Well-Known Member
Joined
3 April 2008
Messages
20,029
Location
Cotswolds
Visit site
I could cry!
We are about to move house and I'd wanted for the first time in my life to have horses at home but its looking like that may not be the case now.
Luckily my daughters best friend's family run a huge grass seed company so I can have a word with them, Id forgotten them!
 

JillA

Well-Known Member
Joined
1 May 2007
Messages
8,166
Location
Shropshire
Visit site
If you don't leave it long enough the grass roots won't be established and it will be pulled out by grazing, really does need at least a year. Autumn is the best time, when the ground is warm and moist enough for decent germination, then you could graze after you have taken a cut of hay the following summer.
It is false economy to graze it too soon, you will be wasting all the money you spent on expensive seed.
 

Honey08

Waffled a lot!
Joined
7 June 2010
Messages
19,570
Location
north west
Visit site
Do your plan B. Seed one field, leave it, then have a trash paddock that you feed hay on for a year or 18 months, then seed the trash paddock in a year or two.
 

HaffiesRock

Well-Known Member
Joined
26 August 2011
Messages
4,468
Visit site
The farmer I rent my land from is about to make more paddocks. They were used for pigs over the summer so completely trashed. They ploughed them about 6 weeks ago, will seed them in spring and they will be let out as grazing in spring next year. You really do need to give it time or it will be ruined really quickly.
 

popsdosh

Well-Known Member
Joined
7 November 2008
Messages
6,388
Visit site
I suggest you talk to Ian at cotswold seeds who will be local and best advise you on what you need to do. I dont see any reason in your part of the world you cannot be grazing in a controlled way late next summer. Having said that spring seeding of grass would not be my first choice as a dry spell can cause havoc . We always establish grass in the autumn but you really dont have that option but be prepared for it to fail!
Another tip is if it get dry enough which it may if you are on the brash get it power harrowed and levelled asap and leave it to stand and settle for several weeks and then repeat. The biggest issue following arable with grass is the land settles very uneven once you put the seed in unless you have done this 3 or 4 times
 
Last edited:

DuckToller

Well-Known Member
Joined
5 December 2007
Messages
3,012
Location
Home Counties
Visit site
If one is a shetland, it won't do as much damage as a large heavy horse with shoes, so I think a trash paddock and one seeded would work very well.

When you plan your paddocks, try to fence so that they radiate away from the stabling area, with both fields having access to the stabling/yard area, rather than having one field near home and one further away. Horses hate being shut in a far field away from the safety of their stables, and tend to fence walk a lot more. Not sure I have explained it very well but you probably know that anyway!
 

PeterNatt

Well-Known Member
Joined
15 July 2003
Messages
4,671
Location
London and Hertfordshire
s68.photobucket.com
If agricultural you will require planning permission for change of use from agricultural to equine. (Use a local land agent/surveyor to get this for you).
Get the soil analysed for any deficiencies and treat accordingly.
Put drainage in the field.
Use specialist equine grass seed.
Use a specialist grassland specialist to prepare and seed your field.
Fertilise.
Cut and collect the grass once it starts growing to thicken it up several times.
Harrow and Roll at least once a year.
Avoid putting horses on it for 3 years until it becomes well established.
Once the horses are on it pick up all the poos each day as otherwise they will kill off grass under them.
Treat Ragwort as it appears.
 

popsdosh

Well-Known Member
Joined
7 November 2008
Messages
6,388
Visit site
Dont know where the planning permission bit comes from.
Its not nescessary when for private use as the grass growing on the land is considered an agricultural operation. You can even put up mobile field shelters but not fix them in any way.This is an extract from a question and answer in Horse and hound.

Regarding the feeding of hay to your horse over the winter, the need for planning permission for change of use does not revolve solely on whether hay is fed. The use of land for grazing horses does not require planning permission provided the majority of the animal’s food is obtained from the land. This is considered to be an agricultural use of the land. However, if the grazing is part of a commercial activity, such as livery, this will require planning permission.
Read more at http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/hors...sion-for-my-paddock-97071#lwHMDmGvL7KFcI6x.99
 
Last edited:

MillionDollar

Well-Known Member
Joined
20 June 2006
Messages
7,938
Location
The Best Shire
Visit site
You want a good pasture mix suitable for horses, which you can ask for when buying. Do not graze it for at least 2 years! If you do you'll soon regret it. The roots need to become established and unfortunately that takes time.
 

popsdosh

Well-Known Member
Joined
7 November 2008
Messages
6,388
Visit site
You want a good pasture mix suitable for horses, which you can ask for when buying. Do not graze it for at least 2 years! If you do you'll soon regret it. The roots need to become established and unfortunately that takes time.

Light grazing under the correct conditions will encourage rooting quicker than not grazing ! Sheep can be very useful for this. I certainly would look to be grazing within a few months.
 

Dry Rot

Well-Known Member
Joined
31 May 2010
Messages
5,847
Location
Scotland
Visit site
I think I'm ging to start a new thread, "What should I feed my horse?" What breed? But is that really relevant?:)

My first question to the OP would be what is your soil type? Almost as important as the breed of horse in my opening paragraph! :D

I reseeded a couple of acres last year. The soil is very sandy, so my choice was Meadow Fescue and Cocksfoot. Due to the usual Highland cock up, the sheep did not appear to graze it down in the autumn so I strip grazed it behind an electric fence with ponies. It will get a dose of 20:10:10 in the spring, then we'll see. I suspect it will survive OK as I doubt it has read the book.

I am tempted to try an acre or two as above but without sowing any seed at all. In theory, it should revert to native grasses, i.e. those best suited to the soil type rather than to produce the maximum yield of beef or lamb, and I would expect to have to spray out broad leaved leaves.

The OP says the grazing is for native ponies, so beware of "grazing mixtures for horses" as you are likely to find they are rocket fuel varieties for race horses, not basic maintenance mixtures for your natives.
 

Auslander

Well-Known Member
Joined
13 November 2010
Messages
12,780
Location
Berkshire
Visit site
Dont know where the planning permission bit comes from.
Its not nescessary when for private use as the grass growing on the land is considered an agricultural operation. You can even put up mobile field shelters but not fix them in any way.This is an extract from a question and answer in Horse and hound.

Regarding the feeding of hay to your horse over the winter, the need for planning permission for change of use does not revolve solely on whether hay is fed. The use of land for grazing horses does not require planning permission provided the majority of the animal’s food is obtained from the land. This is considered to be an agricultural use of the land. However, if the grazing is part of a commercial activity, such as livery, this will require planning permission.
Read more at http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/hors...sion-for-my-paddock-97071#lwHMDmGvL7KFcI6x.99

We had to apply for planning permission for a change of use from agricultural to equine. It's important to at least check as different councils seem to do things differently.
Without it, we were technically not permitted to feed the horses anything but the grass growing on the property - so no hay, no hard feed - not so much as a polo!
 

popsdosh

Well-Known Member
Joined
7 November 2008
Messages
6,388
Visit site
Your Local council were acting well outside government guidelines on this. All around here are fine until you start putting a school or stables in,They even allow exercising on paddocks and jumps which are limited to 28 days annually but as they told me whos counting. I was told by them this is what the guidelines suggest is reasonable they did not look on the supplementary feeding as being unreasonable either! I think you were unlucky
In future they should have a policy document on their planning website covering this!
 
Last edited:

OWLIE185

Well-Known Member
Joined
21 June 2005
Messages
3,535
Visit site
Popsdosh do not rely on your interpretation of the article in Horse and Hounds as being gospel as it is not.
I am afraid that if you have recreational horses then you do need to obtain planning permission for change of use from agricultural to equestrian.
If you don't then one happy day you may find that you are at the receiving end of an enforcement notice.
 

JillA

Well-Known Member
Joined
1 May 2007
Messages
8,166
Location
Shropshire
Visit site
I agree with Owlie185 but the way to resolve it is an off the record chat to your local planners - much better than having to apply retrospectively as they can be a bit funny about that.
 

popsdosh

Well-Known Member
Joined
7 November 2008
Messages
6,388
Visit site
Popsdosh do not rely on your interpretation of the article in Horse and Hounds as being gospel as it is not.
I am afraid that if you have recreational horses then you do need to obtain planning permission for change of use from agricultural to equestrian.
If you don't then one happy day you may find that you are at the receiving end of an enforcement notice.

I have read the national guidance and guidance from councils around where I live. Of course it pays to check locally how they intepret the regs but generally land grazed by horses does not need a change of use unless it is for commercial use ie.livery. As somebody else implied maybe planning aplications are being used as a cash cow
 

Dry Rot

Well-Known Member
Joined
31 May 2010
Messages
5,847
Location
Scotland
Visit site
My ponies are bred for meat so they are agricultural. (Agricultural is defined as being bred for meat, hides, hair, or wool, or for working the land).

Is it my fault some damn fools keep trying to ride them?

But, to be serious, some draught breeds have always been considered to be agricultural. A clever lawyer once advised me that I can state my intentions to be whatever I want, I can always change my mind later. So, if not for meat, for cultivating the land. They are just still in training and the plough arrives next week…..
 
Top