Menage maintenance - YO or livery responsibility?

zoeshiloh

Well-Known Member
Joined
23 January 2006
Messages
2,771
Location
Suffolk
Today I was told that there will soon be a rota in place for the liveries to rake (by hand) the 65 x 25m menage. It is expected for one livery to rake the entire school once a week, and take it in turns, so it will work out each person will do it once a month.

The YO has a tractor-pulled harrow and set of rolls, but only wants to use these once a month (not sure why) so has said we have to keep it looking good in between.

I replied that I pay my livery, to include school maintenance, and that I don't think it is up to us to have to rake the entire school by hand. I don't mind raking in corners, or jump take off/landing, and we already clear away jumps and pick up after our horses (normal procedure).

The other liveries have said I am unreasonable not wanting to hand rake the whole school. Am I being unreasonable, or would you expect this sort of maintenance to be included in your livery cost?
 

Serephin

Well-Known Member
Joined
5 April 2007
Messages
2,153
we pay a fiver a month for school maintenance - so I wouldn't expect to do anything. At a previous yard the YO would do the school quite regularly and it was included in livery price.

I think it is a bit off to expect liveries to hand rake the entire school TBH - especially as they have the means to do it - doesn't take long in a tractor does it!
 

arwenplusone

Well-Known Member
Joined
25 January 2007
Messages
6,160
Location
York
I'm with you - the facilities are the responsibility of the YO. It is what you pay for.

I leave the arena how i find it with regards to poo, jumps & poles etc. I don't expect to have to rake it, the same way as I don't expect to have to mend the fencing or fertilize the grass.
 

zoeshiloh

Well-Known Member
Joined
23 January 2006
Messages
2,771
Location
Suffolk
Livery went up by £20 pcm when school was put in, apparently to cover ongoing maintenance etc. I wouldn't mind tractor-harrowing for them, but think its something about saving on diesel... Not sure how much diesel is used up harrowing a school???
 

Stateside

Well-Known Member
Joined
14 October 2008
Messages
372
Location
UFOs landing site
Tell him to take a running jump..are you expected to paint your stable inside & out repair the roof etc. you pay for a service . just dont do it. pay your bill in full and on time each month/week and ignore the request.Ask him if you are covererd on his insurance if you are injured while doing this task.as you are not an employee.
 

teresagarsden

Well-Known Member
Joined
28 January 2009
Messages
786
Location
upNorth
Sounds like YO is being a little mean when they have the means to do the same job in mins.
are there lots of horses at the yard? why would the school need diong that regular.
I used to harrow and roll our old school twice a week and we had 15 horses and sometimes used for turnout.
what if you had a shoulder injury/ back problem doing that sort of exercise would make it worse.....
Teresa
 

hadfos

Well-Known Member
Joined
8 June 2005
Messages
8,775
Our YO sees to the maintenance of our arena...ALL she asks is that liveries put away jumps etc after use and pick up their horses poo(completely reasonable to ask this but amazing how many of them dont),maybe we should punish them with a rake
lol
sorry...on a serious note...no not your responsibility,you pay for the facilities etc in your livery!
I would be telling him were to get off

heard some crazy rules but that is unbelievable
 

hadfos

Well-Known Member
Joined
8 June 2005
Messages
8,775
[ QUOTE ]
Livery went up by £20 pcm when school was put in, apparently to cover ongoing maintenance etc. I wouldn't mind tractor-harrowing for them, but think its something about saving on diesel... Not sure how much diesel is used up harrowing a school???

[/ QUOTE ]
You have answered ya own question there

Ya livery went up by £20 to cover it...tell him to piss off
 

geraldgiraffe

Well-Known Member
Joined
10 January 2009
Messages
72
Location
up a gumtree
Just as a matter of interest - are you on full livery or DIY? I wouldn't expect to have to hand rake the school on either if it was made clear, as you said, that school maintenance was part of the livery, just a bit worried that my yard might suddenly start doing the same thing!!
 

Tiffany

Well-Known Member
Joined
25 October 2007
Messages
6,923
Location
Derbyshire
On previous yard YO did it but we could borrow quad to pull gate if we wanted to di it in between times.
Where I am now YOs do it


If there was a problem with equipment I wouldn't mind giving a hand with everyone else but I certainly wouldn't be happy doing it on my own by hand on a rota.
 

cellie

Well-Known Member
Joined
22 September 2007
Messages
4,944
You sound like you have my old yo.He put up diy livery decreased my paddock and told us all to rake manage.I moved to new yard we take it in turns but use lawnmower sized tractor.
One of the older women was really ill after raking the school and we all made a point of discussing it with him .His decision was to close the yard.Stand your ground maybe you should discuss insurance if you injure your back raking the school.
 

diggerbez

Well-Known Member
Joined
31 March 2008
Messages
8,053
QR YO job methinks....i kicked off on my yard because they moved the wheelbarrow that lived by the menage- for years we poo picked after our horses but just into the wheelbarrow and YM would empty once a week or whatever. then she got lazy and the YO moved the barrow and now we have to take our own barrow round everytime we need to poo pick arena. i just think that i pay my livery for jobs like this to be done?! also things like forking muck heap are a YO/YM job IMHO (nb my yard is full and DIY livery- if it was all DIY then i guess i might feel differently)
 

miss_c

Well-Known Member
Joined
22 October 2008
Messages
6,092
Location
Near Bristol
We have to remove any poo from the school and put away jumps/poles if we use them, but that's it re maintenance. The school doesn't get levelled every single week, but if you have a lesson and you want it done then you just have to put a note in the book and our lovely YO will do it. I would certainly not be impressed with being asked to rake it by hand! Our school is rather large, and very deep! You pay your money, tell him where to stick it and raise the question of insurance as others have suggested.

Off topic - I've been wondering for ages, what does QR mean?
 

diggerbez

Well-Known Member
Joined
31 March 2008
Messages
8,053
[ QUOTE ]
We have to remove any poo from the school and put away jumps/poles if we use them, but that's it re maintenance. The school doesn't get levelled every single week, but if you have a lesson and you want it done then you just have to put a note in the book and our lovely YO will do it. I would certainly not be impressed with being asked to rake it by hand! Our school is rather large, and very deep! You pay your money, tell him where to stick it and raise the question of insurance as others have suggested.

Off topic - I've been wondering for ages, what does QR mean?

[/ QUOTE ]

QR means that you've used the Quick Reply button (i.e. might not have read thru all the other replies/not replying to anyone in particular)
 

Bosworth

Well-Known Member
Joined
10 February 2006
Messages
5,245
Location
devon
I am a yard owner - and I level the arena at least three times a week. Thats why I bought an arena leveller!! hand raking is never as good and takes forever. It takes me about 10 mins to do the arena tops!! Ok ours is only 20 X40 but its such a quick job with the tractor and leveller. I insist the liveries remove the jumps and remove their poo every time they use the arena but I would definitely not expect them to hand rake it. I always level it before lessons if I have booked them in for liveries and if someone is having a horse vetted as a flat school makes such a difference. I also level it after I have lunged as I hate schooling in an arena that has been lunged in.
 

Pearlsasinger

Well-Known Member
Joined
20 February 2009
Messages
38,888
Location
W. Yorks
I can't believe some of the things that livery CUSTOMERS are being asked to do.
Our horses live at home now but when we were at DIY livery the YO maintained all fences/ fields (including harrowing) filled all water baths in the fields daily/ fertilised as necessary and killed weeds as necessary. There was a schooling field but no arena at that time but I'm sure that now that they have one the YO will be the one who maintains it.
It seems reasonable to me to ask liveries to poo pick after themselves in the arena, so that it is fit for others to use.
I wonder what some YO's think they are being paid for

I certainly wouldn't be doing jobs which the YO is getting paid for or which improve the YO's assets, except in an emergency.
 

Tia

Well-Known Member
Joined
21 January 2004
Messages
26,100
I expect the 20 pounds a month increase was to pay for the school, rather than the maintenance, however no I don't think you should be expected to rake it out, surely that is the YOs job?

PS. I wouldn't do it.
 

gekko

Well-Known Member
Joined
23 January 2009
Messages
351
Location
Next door to Hell, South Australia
All depends on the agreement you have with your YO.. If they are charging you for the services, they should do them...but maybe you are paying a price that include you doing a little.
Each deal is different.
We have one paddock here that is "leased" on a flat rate per week...for their money they get fences maintained and water to the trough...everything else is their problem. Other horses are here on a $x per horse per week for everything basis and others are on a $x per week per horse + wormers +farrier + vet etc.. For the horses that are not just a "leased paddock" I do everything.

They ALL get acess to arena, jumps, X country course, crush and roundyard etc and all that is expected is that they are left as found....but we are the main users of those facilities..
 

summertoots

Well-Known Member
Joined
10 February 2007
Messages
598
I can't get over how little some schools get harrowed. Our school is in constant use, its rare to get it to yourself, but it is huge with a great surface so can cope with heavy use.
But we harrow at least once a day. The clients don't harrow it as they are not covered by insurance to drive the quad. But it is a quick job and we don't mind nipping in and leveling it off for them, especialy if they are having a lesson. The only things we ask them to do is clear equipment after use, pick up poo, and pick out feet going both in and out. We have a poo scoop and skip by the school and hoof picks hanging by the gate.
 

Three

Well-Known Member
Joined
30 April 2007
Messages
3,427
Location
The royal county
I'm with you entirely - YO should be responsible. Our rent went up by £5 a week when the school was resurfaced to cover the cost and ongoing maintenance.

However, on our yard it is done irregularly at best. In fact my friend and I ended up digging out the corners and pulling the harrow round between us once just so the surface was ridable.


Well, it was rideabe if one were training for a dune laden desert crossing I suppose!

It also desperately needs another delivery of rubber onto it. The sand is now so compacted that it freezes, floods etc regularly and has no give.

Oh, and we have rats burrowing under one side which means holes open up over their runs intermittently.


The positive side is that the cob does a decent test on any surface he's faced with - they're all better than at home!
 

Toby_Zaphod

Well-Known Member
Joined
8 August 2005
Messages
9,056
Location
Midlands
To hand rake a 60 x 25 mtr school is ridiculous. It would take forever & I dare say some liveries wouldn't be fit enougth to do it. A YO cannot abandon his responsibilities for maintaining the facilities as yours seems to have done, you pay him livery & that should incliude maintainance.
I am on a DIY yard, the YO isn't horsey at all but wants to do the best she can for them. We have a quad bike & harow & I level the menege at least 3 times a week. It only takes about 15/20 minutes each time & a cup full of fuel.
Your YO is lazy & mean.
[ QUOTE ]
The other liveries have said I am unreasonable not wanting to hand rake the whole school

[/ QUOTE ] What planet are they on? or are they all that daft!
 

zoeshiloh

Well-Known Member
Joined
23 January 2006
Messages
2,771
Location
Suffolk
Well, the main livery who wants a perfectly flat school for her horse, and the one who had a go at me for not wanting to do it, left all the jumps out last night, didn't rake over take off/landings and left two piles of poo in the school!

I already end up mending fencing (YO says she'll do it, but never gets done so I always end up doing it) and over winter I was without light in my stable for over a month because light socket broke, and they were apparently waiting for an electrician to sort it out. In the end my dad had to do it!

Would move yards but no nice DIY livery yards around here with any spaces
 

2diamondlova

Well-Known Member
Joined
6 January 2009
Messages
308
Location
Berkshire
i wouldnt want to pay for school matinence but have to maintain it myself
i think that if they really wan you to help they should atleast reduce the price of the livery <- like take of the matinence part
sorry if that makes no sense haha
 

Paint it Lucky

Well-Known Member
Joined
19 March 2007
Messages
3,587
Location
Surrey
I would move. If th yard owner makes unreasonable requests like racking the school then I dread to think what else she might except from you and what other things she can't be bothered to do herself. 25 by 60 is a big school, I haveto rake a 20 by 20 school quite often and that is bl**dy hard work and takes ages (mind you the surface is cr*p). Poo picking and jump clearing are fair enough but raking by hand when they have a perfectly good machine to do it with is just rediculous. Seriously from the other things you've said i would leave this yard, it sounds highly unprofessional and i can see them not wanting to take responsibilty for anything which could lead to all sorts of problems should something go wrong. I have worked for people/been at yards like this in the past and they are far more trouble than they are worth.
 
Top