Missing horses on loan. Come on H and H. Help fight this!

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dozzie

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This is happening all the time and the loanees have no leg to stand on.Horses are being sold on without passports or with new passports and the police say it is a civil matter. They cant deal with it. Why should it be down to MHOL to deal with this? Come on. You are the press so lets put a bit of "press"ure on to sort this out!

MHOL do a damned good job but they shouldnt have to!
 
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Thank you, yes we do need some one to highlight this growing trend in taking horses on loan and selling them, there is a Crown Court case coming up on the 10th August for one person who sold horses on loan which we helped recover, she is being charged with theft. Some police forces do treat it as theft and others as civil, if someone you lent your horse to can't give it back because they sold it to me it's theft under the 1968 act, they meant to "permanently deprive" you of your horse. If anyone wants help we will do everything we can to get your horse back and assist the police, unfortunately as in our most recent case, the person who sold a horse on loan to her only received a police caution, but watch this space ;-)
 
I have just posted a prev post re this id should be presented if genuine ie passport /driving licence /utility bills and bank statement s it is awful proof of id should be presented there seem to be gangs/individuals who are making cash out of peoples misery
 
thinlizzy said:
I have just posted a prev post re this id should be presented if genuine ie passport /driving licence /utility bills and bank statement s it is awful proof of id should be presented there seem to be gangs/individuals who are making cash out of peoples misery
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So true, individuals and chains of people who pass these horses about. Our latest case seemed so nice and trustworthy but everything she says are lies.

If you are putting your horse on loan, make sure its freezemarked, ANYONE can read a freezemark, make sure you have lots pf photos especially of unusual markings, ask to see a utility bill so they can prove where they live and also a photo id so they can prove who they are, ie driving licence, if they can't provide these DONT loan your horse, I recently hired a car and had to provide all this. Have a loan agreement signed and witnessed by both parties, make sure it has the wording, THIS HORSE REMAINS THE PROPERTY OF ....... AND MUST NOT BE SOLD OR LOANED, this was the wording in one case which the police had to act on after first deciding it was a civil matter, then it became a criminal matter.

Associate yourself on NED Online with the passport and you can mark your horses passport with Out on Loan, it will flag the system if someone tries to change it, also tell your microchip company and freezemark company.

Visit regularly, ask for photos, if it's the other side of the country then try and find a relative of friend who can visit your horse occasionally.

If it feels wrong go with your gut instinct and don't let them take your horse, make a note of vehicle registrations, makes and models. What the loanee looks like, try and get a photo of them with your horse. if they are genuine they won't mind.

I know horses have to be loaned out and there are plenty of people wanting loan horses, it shouldn't put you off but there are lots of people out there making big money from this.
Some horses loaned as companions only have sold for £6000!!!

Our website was accused of putting people off loaning out horses, that is the last thing we would ever want, if your all security measures are covered with your loan agreement you won't be needing us.

We will help anyone, there are only a few of us on the team but we have a high success rate in getting horses back, but we need more convictions because these people are just going out again and getting more horses and profiting from them.

Missing Horses on Loan was started because of Lady and Gwen who went missing, they were brought by a gang that work together, They also went through a sales ring, despite being freezemarked!Unfortunately they were also sent to slaughter despite being freezemarked!

There are so many loop holes and so many mistakes with the current passport system, and these people know that, don't become a victim to them, they are living the dream surrounded by lots of horses they don't care about, they just see £££££, they don't care where your beloved horse goes so long as they get their money!

The common factor in all these cases has been the loanee is moving house, an illness, someone just died, computer died, lost their phone lost a baby, its's just a delaying tactic, too long a delay get in your car!
 
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digger66 said:
Is there a central register of horse loans? Where you could check on an animal before you buy it. If not perhaps that is what HH could do.
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NED Online, the owner must associate with the passport and flag the horse as "Out on Loan"
 
Every sympathy happened to us. Only way forward is to freezemark. Because you can just have a passport re-issued, literally that easily, ours now has two! And the police are shocking, they lost our files, sent someone who didn't know what a 'bay' or 'gelding' was to re-take the statement, was recovered through farmkey not the police and they have since said they will not persue the person responsible despite the fact he is known to the police because it was only a petty crime (did not use this word but word to that effect, don't remember what it was) we think it might be because they had lost the original statements and loan agreement when they lost the file. But this is all two common. Although we have had plenty of ponies put out on loan and this has only happened once. So a one in twenty or so loans is not bad but shouldn't happen.
 
MHOL said:
NED Online, the owner must associate with the passport and flag the horse as "Out on Loan"
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i can't do that because wetherbys don't update there horses on there, so although i have paid for a change of ownership they haven't updated it there end (even though they have set me my passport back) so i can't associate myself with my animal.
 
I totally agree with Dozzie......
Lets get Katie & Ali batman & robin suits!!! They are super heros and are the ONLY system that worked for me when Tim was stolen. I didnt know were to go to, who to turn to etc etc, lodgged it with police, ned, Stolen Horse Register etc etc and if is wasnt for MHOL who knew just what to do i dont think that my big lad would be home now.
I owe them both a total debt of gratitude and think that H & H should honour them by giving them new landrovers etc etc etc (Ali is on foot at the moment) also by making them advisors to the goverment on horse laws coz the current law aint worth squat!!!
XXXXXXXXXTHANK YOUXXXXXXXXXX my life lines
 
Well H and H could flag up to the passport agencies the issue of not updating with NED.

They could have a section in their loaning part of the mag free to MHOL! To advertise the horses that are missing.

They could also have a section stating the necessary clause in the loan agreement and advice to people loaning re the amount of identification that should be required. They have a bit about internet scams so why not loaning scams too.
 
The trouble is the total APATHY of the majority of the british horse owning public.

The attitude is "it'll never happen to me" so no-one wants to get involved.
The same with the terrible conditions Horses and Ponies endure day after day at Sales/Markets around Britain.

I will help out if I can. PM me some details.

And I agree 100% about the passport fiasco..another thing HH could get behind if they really put their collective minds to it..
When "dodgy" dealers were PIO's when the scheme first came out, and low end markets such as the now, thankfully, closed down Southall issuing "on the day" what was the point of passports?

TBH there is an awful lot Nag n Dog could get their teeth into about the "underbelly" of the Horse World, but for some reason, their journo's do seem to be a little "tame".
 
Agree MHOL do a great job, would be good if H & H could get behind them. I think it has been suggested before that they give free space to advertise missing/stolen horses but they obviously haven't offered it yet. They are, I imagine, the leading horse magazine, would be nice to see them dig a little deeper into some of the goings on in the horse world.
 
Agree that MHOL do a very necessary job, what a pity the police don't take horse theft in all its forms more seriously. I can't see the difference (in their eyes) between horse theft and car theft, surely the monetary values are often similar.
I am pleased to say that none of our horses have ever gone missing *touch wood* but know that it must be a horrible experience. I live near Holmfirth and can easily go to the Saturday market (often do) so if any-one wants me to look for a freezemark or anything, I'm more than willing. In light of the lack of any sort of official search body perhaps a network of knowledgeable amateurs would be useful.
 
I think it has been suggested before that they give free space to advertise missing/stolen horses but they obviously haven't offered it yet.

We have offered free listings to people outside of the US and Canada. So far there have been few takers. Our site has over a million hits a month and many are from other countries than the United States.

We take theft and all its forms seriously. Look at the site listings. All horses in red listings have been recovered which usually runs 42-48% on the site.

We do not forward emails. We do require a report to be filed through our website so that we have all the details. Once the requirements are in we can give a free webpage and a printable flyer available on that page.

Google us. You will see that we are the real deal.

Hope this helps.
 
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