MOD land.... permits...... how to get the price down!!!

[merlinsquest]

As title really.....

I would like to know if anyone uses the MOD land in Farnham or Minley or anywhere else in the country, and if they think that it is unfair that horse riders are the only users that have to pay.

Dog walkers, ramblers, mountain bikers etc can all use the land for free..... why are horse riders penalised.

I would have to get £10m insurance to get a permit but the other users dont have to get anything.

I asked the warden today, if Merlin was attacked by a dog or got injured in a cattle grid, spooked by the cows/soldiers etc.... who would be accountable. His answer was to say that I could claim off of my own insurance!!!!

So I am insuring myself for others to be able to harm me and can claim off of MY insurance..... surely this isnt right!!!

The permit for Farnham is £95 per year..... plus the extra it costs for the high public liability part of the insurance. I cannot understand why it is so high. As long as I can prove that I have sufficient insurance to cover anyone I may injure (unlikely as it is) then why cant there just be an admin fee of about £20 to cover the paperwork.

Why do we accept being screwed out of money just because we are horse owners.

I realise there wont be huge amounts of people who this will affect, so please leave a reply if you can and it applies. I am in the process of trying to get this made a fairer charge and need all the help I can get.

Thank you...... and a huge slice of cake for getting this far!!!

 

[Rowreach]

Not sure that this reply will be much use, except to say that I agree with you ...

but until a few years ago I lived near where you are, and the Forestry Commission introduced a permit system for riders (FC land backed onto mine) and I refused to get one - this didn't become a problem, since I was moving anyway, but I imagine it would have done had I stayed.

Where I live now, I pay a permit fee of £70/year to ride in Department of Agriculture forests (there are about 5 of them accessible from here, one close by that I use frequently). They provide beautiful off-road riding which is clean and mud-free all year round, so I don't really mind paying for the privelege. However, I strongly resent the fact that walkers, cyclists and the bald-headed people from the local religious sect who sit cross-legged on the little bridges over the running streams and pray, pay nothing.

Riders have to have PL insurance (BHS Gold membership is sufficient) whereas, as you point out, nobody else does, and I have wondered in the past where they would stand if a horse or rider were injured as a result of something one of them did.

However, when I raised it with the DoA people, the response was sort of, if you don't like it, don't ride here, so I now just write the cheque every year and thank my lucky stars I don't have to ride on the road.

Do you think my insurance would cover me if I gallop over a meditating cross-legged bald person who is blocking the path?

 

[carthorse]

I feel for you but wish we had somewhere to ride ,the forestry comm. near us do not allow riding .
If you need third party insurance then BSJA supporters club give the highest and very cheap at £29 to cover you for all your horses.

 

[dieseldog]

[ QUOTE ]
I feel for you but wish we had somewhere to ride ,the forestry comm. near us do not allow riding .
If you need third party insurance then BSJA supporters club give the highest and very cheap at £29 to cover you for all your horses.

[/ QUOTE ]

What was the excess? Is it the same as the normal BSJA insurance which is £1000?

 

[YorkshireLass]

Sounds reasonable to me! £95 a year is less than £10 a month! £2.50 a week! Bargain!

You have to pay so that no legal right of way for horses is established.

You also have to pay, because unlike mountain bikers or dog walkers horses churn up the land and are very hard going on made up tracks, all of which have to be maintained.

As far as the insurance goes, you would be mad to take a horse out in public without that level of PL cover. It only takes your horse to cause a serious accident and chances are the final bill will be far in excess of 10 million.

 

[merlinsquest]

Thanks for the replies so far......

I do agree that I am lucky to have the choice but cant see why it has to be sooooo expensive. And why I am one of the minority who has to pay for it!!!

YorkshireLass.... I agree that it isnt going to break the bank, but the principle is still there, why do we have to pay when others dont..... surely they are establishing a right of way with their bikes and dog/dogless walking.

Also in this instance the ground is not able to be churned up as it is all hard stoney ground

..... Infact the bikers and dog walkers are the only ones who can leave the paths as there are holes, stumps and humungous cows everywhere else. There are only a handful of places that you can actually go faster than a walk!!! There is precious little maintenance either, the only thing they have done is to put in cattle grids all over the place ( I constantly worry if I were to fall off, would he be found with snapped legs.... so try very hard not to fall off

) And the gates are right beside the grids with not an inch to spare!!!

I also agree that you need to have a high amount of cover, which I do already....... but why should I have to claim off of my insurance for anything that goes wrong, whether or not I am to blame. There have been several dog attacks over there in the last few months, and to my knowledge none of the dogs were insured!!!!

So in effect it is better than nothing, but no where near as nice as Frensham common which is well maintained, sandy, beautiful and FREE!!! I just have to trailer there

 

[Orangehorse]

Carthorse - I see you are in the West Midlands. Where can't you ride in the Forestry Commission wood. You can ride (with a permit) on Cannock Chase and Wyre Forest. I think Mortimer Forest is free to riders, and there are other smaller woods as well.

There is one thing to be borne in mind with Forestry Commission.
The FC may manage the forest, but they don't necessarily own it.
That is why some FC forests do not allow riders, or charge a permit fee, etc. it is becuase of who owns it and what arrangements that want to make. It is a common misconception that all FC forests are nationally owned.

Another thing is that all these walkers and cyclists bring in about 94% of the income from visitors, from sales at the shops and cafes. Riders' permits bring in 6% of FC revenue.

 

[Hornby]

I see your point, MQ but I wish we had something similar in Lancashire (near Blackpool), very few bridleways and no off road riding unless you pay each time (and the one near me is muddy, only 5 miles long in a circle, no gates to keep the horses off the roads and £5 a time!).

 

[merlinsquest]

Maybe I'm not so badly off then

 

[Boltonrider]

Something to be considered...and I hope nobody here ever needs to go down the this line.

If you buy a permit or pay to use land, effectively the owner of that land AND the permit issuer, have a legal obligation to provide certain things.
This includes keeping the land safe and clear from danger to the permit holders/users...also covers maintenance.
The list is long, v long.

However.....if an accident was to incur upon the land for which you hold a permit to use.....there are some liabilities placed upon the land owner.
In theory you could get involved in a incident with a non insured person, and seek some recompense from the land owners!!
It's not straight forward, but as it's already happened and is now statute thru the courts, it can and will be allowed to happen again!