Modicate/Modecate? Long-term sedative - anyone used?

[BeckyD]

I just rang the vets and asked for another 5 tubes of sedalin, which Ronnie is getting through a tube every couple of days. And it's me paying, not the insurance company. Vets were a bit

at the amount, and suggested modicate (sp?). My vet is hopefully going to call me back later to discuss it, but do any of you know anything about it?

This is a bit of a nutter horse who, to be honest, is little affected by sedatives in general (he still tries to kill me - I'm not joking - on 3 units of sedalin). ACP seemed to work but was withdrawn by EU.

 

[TarrSteps]

As with resperidine, it works well for some, not so much for others. They *seem* to be much more commonly used in North America, although I've now met a couple of vets who use either/or here so maybe it's more a case of people not admitting to it as much.

I will say I like it much better than daily doses of things like ACP and Valium as it seems to chill the horse out more than actively sedate it and has less affect on co-ordination etc. I also really don't see the problem for horses on stall rest that aren't coping. Absolutely, there are risks (as with ANY medication) but then there are risks to horses going bonkers, too. No perfect world and all that.

If you do proceed with the discussion, make sure you notify your vet about any supplements etc your horse is on and discuss your management protocol. I find the best approach is multi-pronged.

 

[CrazyMare]

How big is he? 3ml of sedalin (which is ACP in a different format) has no effect on my 13hander. She has 6ml to be clipped and 4-5ml to be turned out after box rest and 3ml a time to be ridden after box rest.

 

[BeckyD]

He's a LW 16hh, about 450kg. Maybe he just needs more then. I was advised to stop at 4 units (which does knock him out to the point of falling over, until things get exciting, then he just snaps out of it and is back to normal/fire-breathing mode).

The ACP worked so much better, apparently that's common, but sedalin works much better on some horses than others.

 

[BeckyD]

Any idea why it works better on some than others? He's not a great one for sedalin, but ACP worked a treat.

Ok thanks for the discussion points, I shall make sure I mention them. Thankfully my vet is well aware of Ronnie's less-then-angelic demeanour.

 

[CrazyMare]

Ah the coming round quickly is a trait with sedalin/ACP - as soon as there is any adrenaline in the system, the effect of the ACP is wiped out.

I'm not sure why you are trying to sedate him but its important to keep the area quiet while you are using it to help prevent the sudden 'coming to'

 

[BeckyD]

The problem is I need to use it to reduce the bucking/rearing/aggression both whilst in his stable, plus being led out. He'a actually going for me, in a rather nasty way when I'm leading him, so I'm (tonight) going to try riding instead of leading (this has vet seal of approval).

I was thinking of the modecate as an alternative to sedalin to take the edge off him. Haven't heard from my own vet yet.

 

[proudwilliam]

Modecate a depot drug {Intra muscular injection)was normally given to humans as a slow release drug for psychotic systems mostly schizophrenia, Risperidone is a relative new drug for psychotic patients used in Autism, dementia and behavioral disorders They both have terrible side efffects. ???? Have they been tested as being safe for horses!!!!!!

 

[Steeleydan]

Why dont you speak to your vet about an injection of Raiklin, it lasts about 2 weeks and really calms a sharpe horse down and takes the edge off doesnt make them look dopey like sedalin/acp.

 

[ccooxxyy]

As Proudwilliam says modecate is an anti psychotic drug often used for schizophrenia, however i have a friend who is a vet that often will prescribe this drug for headshakers and has had great results from it, however i'm sure this is probably anecdotal!! I haven't head it being used as a mild sedative.It is also untracable in blood so woud not be found on a drugs test.......

 

[TarrSteps]

Absolutely not true it doesn't test! It's definitely on the controlled drug list and competition horses get caught for both it and resperidine, semi-regularly, especially in the US where it's a standard test.

It's DEFINITELY not allowable for competition horses!

 

[TayloredEq]

I have dealt with clients horses who have been on modicate.

The side effects of modicate are that the horse can be known to shake its head about and go round the box a little manically. I was told that if the horse should have this sort or reaction then the horses needs to be given the human drug for Parkinsons to act as an antedote.

In answer to someone elses question No the drug has not been licensed for horses.

Modicate has been widely used in racing for a while, especially in America. One of the vets I spoke to about Modicate said that they had only heard about 1 instance of a horse suffering side effects from the drug. The side effects also commonly occur when the drug is overdosed.

One horse had been on box rest for weeks and needed to be walked out in hand. He was regularly bolting and dragging his owner behind him (even with 2 people leading him from a chifney). On the modicate he was much more manageable and his given his tendon injury more of a chance to heal.

Another horse had to be box rested due to damage to his suspensories. He would regularly buck in the box at feed time. Modicate stopped this and again allowed the suspensories more of a chance to heal.

I have also used the drug on my own horse. He is a horse who has lots of issues and is difficult to keep weight on. He needed to box rest and I knew that he would not stay in happily. On the modicate he was happy for the other horses to go out and he could be left on his own. He also chilled out and put weight on.

The quantity is dependent on each horse and in my experiences 1 injection can last between 1 week and 3 weeks. It tends to take between 24 and 48 hours to take effect. I have known horses that it has had no effect on.

My vets also told me that if I needed to use other sedatives on top of the modicate then I should use half the does I normally would.

I hope this has been of some help. I'm sure that your vet will give you the full picture and help you make the best decision for your horse.

 

[BeckyD]

Thank you for the long and detailed reply. You have said pretty much what my vet said about it last night, but he views it very much as a last resort. Ronnie is bucking in his box as well, at feed times or other times when he finds it a bit exciting. The sedalin/ACP don't seem to help much when his adrenalin gets going.

I rode him last night to see if that would be safer than leading, and he was brilliant. This doesn't mean we've fixed it as it'll be tonight that I'll start to have problems (it's always the 2nd time we do things that he gets fractious - the first time he's so occupied by the novelty he doesn't think about being an idiot). If, however, he stays calm then I may be able to take him off the sedalin and indeed any sedative. He's not been so bad at bucking in his box since he's been walking out.

I think the midecate may be a viable option if he does get out of hand, at least to try, as the sedalin just dopes him up when I don't need him to be, and yet doesn't stop him being dangerous.

Ho hum. If only I could explain to him that he needs to heal, and this behavoiur isn't helping.

 

[Bubbles]

Hi there,
I used this on my last horse in a bid to get him sane, and while we had mixed results the general consensus was that it really helped: I could do things with him that I could only dream about without the drugs, but without him being that dopey yet inclined to explode state that using ACP induced. Tarrsteps is right, a lot of people use it in the States for box rest and the like, and a few competition riders have been known to use it along with other things (ahem, Irish sj gold medal won and lost...) to keep neds calm at the big events. When I last talked about this with my vet he told me it wasn't licensed for use in horses, but then neither are lots of other meds that are used. I personally think that for what you need it for it would be perfect.