Muscle building supplements.

[ApolloStorm]

Horse is 10yo Ex racer who came to me nearly 4 months ago, after having 7 months out at grass with no feed. I spent the first month just doing gentle work with him, have gradually built up to now, where he is being worked about 5 times a week, usually 3 sessions schooling about 40 mins each, focusing on lateral work, and getting him using his quarters, one medium length hack and a lunge session in an equiami.
He is fed on 1 stubbs Alfa A Oil, 1 stubbs wet Equerry Conditioning Mash (speedibeet with added M.linseed), Topspec Cool Balancer and Ulsakind cubes, currently split into 2 feeds. Along with ad-lib haylage.
He is greatly lacking in top line, and general muscle tone, though his weight is not terrible, a shadow of rib is visible when working but not when in the stable. Is there any supplements out there which might help without sending him skyward! I've seen a few, Equifeast Muscle, Myoplast, Equinox Muscle, and global herbs muscle up.
Or am I missing something!

 

[impresario08]

have you checked teeth and back?

spirulina is the same as myoplast without all the sugar

 

[Goldenstar]

I use myoplast my TB has done very well on it .
I tried spirulina it's awful to 'handle ' gets everywhere turn you and the horse nose blue and tastes rank .

 

[Cortez]

3 - 4 months is very little time to really see an improvement in muscle bulk; as long as he is getting a good basic level of nutrition he will add muscle gradually as is natural and best. IME there really isn't any "wonder" supplement that will specifically speed up muscle development.

 

[criso]

My fussy one seemed to prefer spirulina to the sugar coated myoplast balls - maybe he didn't like the texture but he is strange

Got better results too but maybe I was given a slightly higher dose given that the spirulina is pure and the myoplast is 60% sugar.

Eta I use it when the hay supplied isn't as high in protein as I would like. Also add lysine.

 

[SEL]

Whey protein?

 

[paddy555]

high dose natural vit E for the muscles.

 

[ApolloStorm]

He is up to date on everything -should have said. What about the other products or is spirulina the best?

 

[Cortez]

high dose natural vit E for the muscles.

You say that for EVERYTHING............

 

[Nudibranch]

More hacking out, especially hill work.

 

[ycbm]

though his weight is not terrible, a shadow of rib is visible when working but not when in the stable.

This is a good weight for most horses, but especially so for a TB

Building top line on a TB takes time.

Photos would help us judge whether you are expecting too much or if there is a problem.

 

[Slightly Foxed]

3 - 4 months is very little time to really see an improvement in muscle bulk; as long as he is getting a good basic level of nutrition he will add muscle gradually as is natural and best. IME there really isn't any "wonder" supplement that will specifically speed up muscle development.

This. If there were a 'wonder' supplement to do the job it would be like human athletes taking steroids.

 

[Goldenstar]

This. If there were a 'wonder' supplement to do the job it would be like human athletes taking steroids.

Certainly my experiance with myoplast combined with work is that you see a visible difference .

 

[Lulup]

Myoplast has performed poorly in studies and it is just an expensive sugar coated version of spirulina. Equijewel has similar properties to steroids but from natural sources - worked wonders with my ex racer fed in conjunction with Alfa A Oil and Alfa Beet.

 

[ApolloStorm]

In the summer hacking ups to 3 times a week usually but at the moment light is a limiting factor, we also don't have many good hills on hacks, there's a good slope in our xc field but that's shut for winter now. I should also add, that this was prompted by a livery saying - ' he's skinny isn't he' which upset me a little, but not much I can do with a poor doer type in the middle of winter, Who needed to gain weight anyway. But either way it's just his top line, will get pictures today.
Myoplast seems to have very mixed reviews, I'd never considered whey protein!

 

[impresario08]

l-glutamine can help also

 

[First Flame]

I have had good success with rice bran based supplements - my vet gave me a supplement once to help which was gamma oryzanol, the natural steroid extracted from rice bran. It worked wonder alongside proper work but was expensive so I also tried Excel Muscle Pro from Equiform nutrition. Keyflow Plus, Equijewel and Omega Rice are rice bran based. I also tried myoplast and Spirulina and didn't notice any difference whatsoever other than a green nose on a grey horse!! My older advanced dressage mare started losing topline this year and I have had great results with adding a balancer (blue chip pro and Topspec comprehensive have been fab). Work is key to building muscle and topline but the correct feeding can help this process along. I think mine needed more protein. You also cant go wrong with micronized linseed .

 

[Toby_Zaphod]

I rarely recommend feed to people however I feel this may be of use to you. So many seem to have a feed skip full of supplements & additives & no real feed?

We bought a 5 year old warmblood who had been rather neglected had poor condition & despite us feeding him quality feed & adlib hay/haylage etc he still didn't really increase his weight. We remembered we had some feed left over from when we build up another horse for doing working hunter classes. This feed had really done its job, so we decided to try that. We fed it to our new youngster & in only a few weks we saw an incredible difference in him, he'd put on weight, was lookingreally good & with the work we were giving hime he was muscling up really nicely. The feed we used was 'Equi Jewel' which is in the Saracen Range of feeds.

http://shop.saracenhorsefeeds.com/saracen-horse-feeds/conditioning-range/equi-jewel-pellets/

Now he's at the correct weight we are back to our normal feeding regime & he's maintained his weight, looking stunning & is working well. Equi Jewel is expensive at £42 per 20kg bag but you use it like blue chip, a cup in his feed. Using just one bag, coupled with some light work, you should start to see a difference in your horses condition quickly. This feed is used by many of the top show hunter people.

 

[SEL]

In the summer hacking ups to 3 times a week usually but at the moment light is a limiting factor, we also don't have many good hills on hacks, there's a good slope in our xc field but that's shut for winter now. I should also add, that this was prompted by a livery saying - ' he's skinny isn't he' which upset me a little, but not much I can do with a poor doer type in the middle of winter, Who needed to gain weight anyway. But either way it's just his top line, will get pictures today.
Myoplast seems to have very mixed reviews, I'd never considered whey protein!

I am a bit of a fan of Forage Plus - worth reading this and maybe speaking to them.

https://forageplus.co.uk/protein-and-amino-acids/

 

[paddy555]

You say that for EVERYTHING............

I say it as I have had a lot of success in the use of high dose vit E for muscle problems and wastage which is what this thread is about.

Also I advocate it as many are so short of vit E at this time of the year anyway, muscles problems or not.

What is your experience of using vit E?

 

[Goldenstar]

Horses working hard in winter defiantly 'do ' better if you supplement them with vit E

 

[SEL]

I also supplement with vitamin E. It started with the one with symptomatic PSSM but I've encouraged my friend to add it to the diet of her 22 year old arthritic ex polo horse. Its made a massive difference even at small dosages (about 500iU i think)

 

[Slightlyconfused]

Agree with the vit e supplement but also it's takes a long time to build up muscle. 4-5 months isn't that's long, it will take.up.to at least a year to build and develop muscle.

 

[Cortez]

I say it as I have had a lot of success in the use of high dose vit E for muscle problems and wastage which is what this thread is about.

Also I advocate it as many are so short of vit E at this time of the year anyway, muscles problems or not.

What is your experience of using vit E?

My experience is that unless there is actually a real problem - determined by proper testing - there is no need to add anything to good forage/grazing and basic straights. Horses which lack muscle generally need proper work. Perhaps I'm just freakishly lucky, but I have NEVER fed a supplement (other than a dash of veg oil to starvation cases). It takes time to build horses up, lots of time and targeted work, and perhaps that's something that people are impatient about? If there is a medical issue then that's a different kettle of fish.

ETA: My horses have always looked and performed pretty well.....

 

[paddy555]

My experience is that unless there is actually a real problem - determined by proper testing - there is no need to add anything to good forage/grazing and basic straights. Horses which lack muscle generally need proper work. Perhaps I'm just freakishly lucky, but I have NEVER fed a supplement (other than a dash of veg oil to starvation cases). It takes time to build horses up, lots of time and targeted work, and perhaps that's something that people are impatient about? If there is a medical issue then that's a different kettle of fish.

ETA: My horses have always looked and performed pretty well.....

Can you explain where a horse on grass, hay and straights is going to get vit E from in the winter? (ie Oct - Mar ie 6 months)
I cannot see from anywhere. General supplements usually have pretty low levels of high quality natural vit E. The only ones I can think of with reasonable levels are the FP winter balancers.

I am not impatient about work I just like to do everything I can nutritionally to get the horse's body in the best state to work. What I have however found is that in horses with muscle problems (and in this thread the horse is lacking top line and musculature) a high dose of natural vit E sets the horse up for success far more quickly that just targeted work. The other point is that some of the horses posted about on here (to which I reply suggesting Vit E as you have already pointed out) most likely do have medical problems even if not yet diagnosed.

 

[rowan666]

Lysine, needs to be used in conjunction with correct work though

 

[SEL]

https://forageplus.co.uk/protein-in-horse-diets/

I also like thus article by FP.

I actually fed my under muscled oldie (the non symptomatic PSSM one) an amino acid supplement from one of the body builder suppliers. It had the same % make up as many of the better horse supplements, but cheaper.

I think it helped, but hard to tell as there's a lot else going on joint wise.