My horse needs to be shot before I do it myself!

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Mollymillymoo

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Coco was a little fuc*er today, I really wonder why we have him sometimes. He's a cob and gets the typical scabby cob skin under his feathers... so today I took the clippers down with a mind to chop the feathers off to get to the skin to shampoo it and put on some cream we got from the saddlery.

I plugged the clippers in, got him tied up in the stable and started on one of the back ones... I got one side done when he decided he was done with that and picked his leg up to threaten me, which he //never// does, so I thought ok, and went to his front leg and he did exactly the same as soon as I turned the clippers on. We went and got the twitch and I put it on and mum held it as I went back to the first leg to finish the awful job I'd done on it. So my mum let go of the twitch and the next thing I knew it flew past my head at the same time as Coco's hoof did.

His leg looked awful but he wouldnt let me near it at all so I gave up and took him outside to groom him, hoping he would calm down. I managed to wash his legs with the shampoo anyway and decided he had calmed down enough to get the scissors out in an attempt to tidy his leg up a bit. He wouldn't have any of it and barged about away from me stamping his legs. So I groomed a bit more till he calmed down and then got the cream to rub on his flakey bits and as soon as I touched his leg he barged into me and stomped his feet, where my foot had been, really hard, swinging his quaters round at me so I gave in and put him out - he was getting ridiculous and I know he 'got away with it' but I didn't want to get hurt, he's a big boy.

What do I do with him? He got turned out with one hairless back leg and one gunky pink front one. He looks ridiculous and he's worse than he's ever been with me before - he's never threatened me before like he did today. I tried shouting at him and smacking his bottom when he did it to me to no avail - I'm just getting him into bad habits but I don't know how I can stop him, he has no respect at all sometimes. He's not usually bad like this - he can be really lovely but today... gah. Anyone got any advice for me? I really need to get them off or he will look really silly until that leg grows its fluff back.
 
Step 1, remove the pain - Germolene has a local anaesthetic in it, as to some sunburn gels - if it hurts less he will be less fraught about it.

Step 2, do a little at a time, it might take a few days to snip around the legs, he will fight less once you have got the local anaesthetic on to it

or alternative, get the vet, sedate him, clip the lot and clean it up in one go
 
Ever thought that it might actually be hurting him trying to clip his legs????
If they are scabby it’s probably pulling the skin as it takes the hair off. I had this problem with my cob (who’s now fully clipped) and I started taking off little bits of feather with scissors over a matter of weeks until I could get them clean enough to clip them. He still gets a small amount of grease behind one of his knees now but I cut the hair with scissors rather then using clippers and then hibi scrub.
Please don’t shoot him, I think he is trying to tell you something!
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The bit I was doing on his back leg isn't scabby though and our clippers are very sharp - we've just got new blades for them so it shouldn't pull at all... I did think perhaps it was hurting him but he was fine to let me scrub them with the shampoo and a hard brush. When I got the scissors out he got silly too but I only held one lump of hair without pulling at it at all... I will look out for the anasthetic though and I'll let you know if it works. Thanks though - it is something I considered because he was being so out of character. and I'm not gonna shot him really you know!
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Someone at our yard told us about ATP pills you can give them, do you think this is an idea, rather than get the vet out? I do think itwill be easier to get it all over and done with at once! Thanks for the ideas... I'll definately look for the anasthetic cream.
 
Phew for that, you know you love him really!
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It sounds like it might just take a bit of time and patience! He may have been hurt in the past and may think you are going to hurt him??
Just out of interest, do you clip his body and if so what is he like?
 
I get the impression from your post he is a little fuc*er -as you put it- generally. Am i right? maybe some handling/behavioural classes wouldn't go amiss.

agree with other posts, it is most likely hurting him, horses are great in that respect - they tell you when something's wrong.

Is it neccessary to shave his feathers? will this not expose his legs further to the elements, therefore becoming crustier? sorry, but i have no experience with cob crust!
I can't imagine he would look anything but ridiculous for having his feathers shaved off!

You say he has no respect for you.. i'm questioning from the wording of your post as to whether you are deserving of his respect!

Let the hair grow back.. not meaning to sound so glum, but that's my advise
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Well we've had him since he was 4, he was shipped over from ireland when he was 3 1/2 and was gelded, bought on and sold to us by his breeders sister, so he shouldn't have had any bad experiances, although I know he had had his legs clipped out when we bought him. He's fine with his body but we can't hog him without the twitch and even when he has that he fights it, and its impossible to do his ears, twitch or no. He was ok when he was younger to have his legs done but he has progressively worse - I had it down to us being too soft with him as our old YO used to be able to it fine - he respected her.
 
Have you thought about mites? I have a cob with feathers and when he gets scabby bits we know he's got mites. We originally thought it was mud fever or greasy heel and treated it accordingly but it never went away. The vet eventually diagnosed mites and ever since we have sprayed his legs with frontline as and when it's needed. He has had no scabs since.

He wouldn't let us clip his legs either but is now fine. Clipping off the hair is a good idea so when you use the frontline spray it gets right into the skin.
 
I wouldn't bother with ACP or Sedalin or any of the other oral sedatives, they can wear off very quickly and are a bit unpredictable in their effects. The kindest thing really would be to have the vet sedate the horse and hang around to do top ups while you clip everything you need to do, I know it is expensive as a one off, but getting to the bottom of the problem and being able to treat it properly, without risk to yourselves, is worth it.

you then have time to address the handling issues and train in a little compliance. if this goes well you may never need to sedate again.
 
lol yeah a very glum reply but at least you're honest!
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uhmm no he acutally looks quite smart without his feathers and the initial idea was to get rid of the hair so I could get to the skin better - it would expose it more but it would mean it could be better treated with cream, which would also protect it. Usually he is an angel actually - he does throw a buck in sometimes but today was really out of character... I can usually lead him in from the field without a headcollar he's so quiet! I'm not the one to say whether I deserve his respect or not but I'm not a forceful character, although that doesn't mean I usually let him push me about or misbehave... I just end up lost when he's really naughty because I don't want to beat him up as I'm told I should do by certain people. Thanks for the advice!
 
Thanks everyone for yours ideas - I'd never thought of mites, I shall definately consult our vet! I'll see if my mum is up for him being sedated... If I can get the hair off and get to the sore bits we should be able to solve the problem once and for all - without getting hurt in the process. As for his behaviour we have a man at our yard called Richard Maxwell - I may ask his advice as I've heard he is very good with naughty horses! Thanks again, very much appreciated advice.
 
I had this exact same problem with Chex a few years back. He's not a bargy horse, but kept shoving me, legs flying everywhere etc. I gave in and got the vet to sedate him, so I could clip his feathers short and gave them a really good clean. Every couple of days I had to twitch him to clean his legs. After a few weeks I just had to twitch him for the first minute or so. Eventually he'd just stand perfectly. I think it took him a while to realise that it wasn't going to hurt when I clipped/washed them.
 
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If I can get the hair off and get to the sore bits we should be able to solve the problem once and for all - without getting hurt in the process.

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Yes but if he's got mites it won't ever clear until you kill the mites (and they do come back so you would have to reapply at certain stages during the year). I would most certainly put money on it being mites as it's extremely common with heavier weight horses with feathers. Mites can drive horses mad and make them irriatable too which could be causing some of this behaviour. I would definitely get yourself a bottle of frontline and give it a go.
 
Yeah sorry, I'll definately be ringing the vet about that tomorrow - How often does the spray need to be applied out of interest? And do you know how they get them? The irritability would make sense if that is the case... thank you for that.
 
I have never found out how my cob gets them it is always a mystery and because neither or my other two have much feather they don't pick them up. It depends on the horse how often the spray will need to be used. My cob is sprayed probably 3 times a year, sometime more. You can normally tell when the mites are back though as they bring the scabs back with them.
 
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As for his behaviour we have a man at our yard called Richard Maxwell - I may ask his advice as I've heard he is very good with naughty horses! Thanks again, very much appreciated advice.

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Wow, is RM really at your yard? I'd love to meet him!
Behaviour problems aside, a method I've found to be successful is to smother the scabs in an emollint cream (nothing expensive needed, zinc and castor oil, nappy rash cream), wrap the legs in clingfilm, bandage overnight, the next morning you should be able to remove most of the scabs. Just repeat for a few days until clear.
 
Our center is made up of 3 seperate yards and he rents the top yard, he's down quite a lot but I haven't had an excuse to speak to him yet - watching him work is amazing though
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That's something different... certainly something to consider if he ever lets me near his legs! lol thank you!
 
Your boy is trying to tell you that it is hurting him to have his legs clipped. My elderly horse is a cob gelding and prone to mud fever so keep his legs clipped. In the early days of his condition, I used to get impatient at him not standing still until I realised the state of his legs and how inflammed they were. They were sore.

Please stop and listen, your horse is trying to tell you in the only way he knows how by playing up. Put yourself in his position - wouldn't you react if you had scabby sores and someone was trying to clip your legs.
 
If that's THE Richard Maxwell, then you have the best person right there to help you figure out what the problem is, and almost certainly help you solve it, probably without resorting to sedation, etc.
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Thanks for the advice but I don't think it was pain, his back legs are not flakey at all, they were only going to be done so he looked smarter, and that is where I started and ended! The clipper blades are brand new and were cool... He let me scrub all of his sore bits with a hard brush and shampoo, and I had only lifted the hair on his sore bits to use the scissors on them when he was naughty, despite letting me scrub them moments before. He could be in pain so I'll let the vet know, but I don't think it was that... and as for Richard Maxwell I will talk to him and see if he is the guy I think he is! I'll see if he has any ideas! thanks again everyone!
 
I too think it is mites or chorioptic mange as it is otherwise known. Trouble is as is often the case the horse has mites. Owners don't know they have and treat for something else ie mud fever. The cause of the irritation is not eradicated therefore the skin is still irritated. Result is usually a secondary skin infection which can be mud fever or similar which then masks the original cause ie mites. Using hibiscrub and barrier methods ie sudocrem and mud guard will not kill the mites. It may sooth the skin on a temporary basis but the the irritation will resurface and often worse than when the feathers were left on since the skin has no natural defence against the elements and therefore allows the bacterium dermatophilus congolensis easier access to the skin causing the condition 'mud fever'
Our young lad when we got him last year had them.
We had originally treated for mud fever ( new to horse ownership and didn't know about leg mites then) and didn't have clippers so trimmed feathers with scissors.
We eventually treated several times with frontline spray as I had seen this treatment recommended on vet websites and had been told this by someone on the yard ( again a vet recommended it). We also wormed with a wormer containing ivermectin which is also believed to kill the mites.
Touch wood he has shown no signs of them this winter( as this is the time they raise their ugly heads).
When we got him last Sept though he was bleeding on his front legs and they were scabby at the base of his heel and back of knee and he used to foot stamp in the stable as well.
He was very sore though and I must warn that using Frontline can be tricky since you need to get the spray as close to the skin as possible ( often underneath the scabs) as that is where the mites are.
As you may or may not be aware ( have used Frontline for years as have cats, dogs and ferrets etc) it says not to use on sore or broken skin. In the case of leg mites in horses you will find that the skin is often sore as it is best to try and remove as many of the scabs as possible before spraying which will make it sore.
So long as you know for certain it is mites ( would suggest getting a vet out to check and maybe do a scraping to confirm this) I would recommend treating with frontline. If your horse is uncomfortable with the spray ( our Mcfly won't even tolerate water sprayed on his legs now after using frontline sadly) then perhaps use a twitch and get someone to hold up a front leg while you are spraying the back legs as they find it harder to kick on 3 legs so I am led to believe.
If you would like further information on leg mites ( chorioptic mange) then check out the following websites and pages.
Alternatively there are a few people well versed in the subject on the forum. Theresa is one of them, hope I have got name correct forgive me if I have missed part of username out but I am sure someone will correct me.
Anyway here are links and good luck
Caz
web page
web page
web
page skin pdf file
web page interesting post on a forum about leg mites
 
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