Mysterious ubtle intermittent lameness - could it be navicular or just a hoof thing?

[Marilyn91]

Hi everyone,

My Connemara pony seems a bit off. Some mornings she is very stiff, limping out of her stable, then after a few minutes on the lunge she loosens up and moves normally. While a few minutes of exercise seem to help initially, overall she is worse if she has been ridden the previous day, especially on the road. She used to be extremely forward-going (too much so!) but on the lunge she doesn't track up anymore, and under saddle she is very reluctant to move forward. Out hacking, she will move forward, but my friend who was out with me said she was moving strangely, and that it looked like she was putting too much pressure on her back legs. She also stumbles quite a lot, even when walking in hand, and she really struggles with hills.

I had the chiropractor come and take a look a few days ago, and the pony's front left leg made a cracking sound when she stretched it. She recommended me to get a farrier to do a hoof test.

I'm wondering whether I should get the vet out, or the farrier, or both and which one should come out first? Would it be worth giving her a month off?

I've uploaded a few pictures of her hooves, just in case I'm missing something obvious.

I would appreciate any insight as she is my first horse and I'm feeling a bit overwhelmed ?

 

[Zoeypxo]

Hi how old is your horse and do you have a video of her movement?

 

[Marilyn91]

Hi how old is your horse and do you have a video of her movement?

Thanks for the fast reply!

She's 6.

Video of her in walk: https://youtube.com/shorts/SMftrHTLeb8?feature=share

Trot: https://youtube.com/shorts/fgSY2BpHP-I?feature=share

 

[AmyMay]

Your first port of call should be your vet. My first thoughts would be a mild laminitic attack.

 

[Zoeypxo]

Ok so at 6 i wouldnt really expect her to be coming out of the stable stiff.
If she is limping coming out of the stable i would personally get a vet. If she is no longer willing to go forward it would seem she is uncomfortable somewhere. Did your chiropractor find anything suspect?

 

[Marilyn91]

Your first port of call should be your vet. My first thoughts would be a mild laminitic attack.

Thanks for your reply. What makes you think it could be lami? I didn't feel any heat in the hooves.

 

[AmyMay]

Thanks for your reply. What makes you think it could be lami? I didn't feel any heat in the hooves.

Just my initial thoughts from what you describe and the fact she’s very overweight.

 

[dixie]

I would be getting a vet too for loss of performance and lameness.

I’ve just done the same myself with my 6yr old. He wasn’t visibly, to me, lame but on scanning him he has issues with his suspensory.
I only had him checked out as he’s reluctant to canter right in the school and needed urging to canter at first on hacks. He’s still a very forward horse, so these were signs to me he wasn’t right.
You know your horse best and if he’s not as he was you should get him checked out by a professional imo.

 

[silv]

Definitely get a vet to look at her, she is not right, at least then you know what you are dealing with and can make her more comfortable.

 

[The Xmas Furry]

Vet 1st before anyone else. Get a lameness work up asap.

 

[Tiddlypom]

She's pretty sore.

Vet.

I agree with treating it as lami from now (this evening). In off the grass, deep bed, soaked hay. It might well not be lami, but it does look suspiciously like it.

 

[nutjob]

I would get a vet sooner rather than later. Laminitis doesn't always have heat in the hooves and the horse looks uncomfortable on all feet rather than lame on one specific one, also does look a bit porky. Where I live it's been difficult to manage the grass due to long dry spells then downpours of rain. It's been ideal conditions for laminitis and colics. Until the vet comes I would bring her in on a deep bed and feed soaked hay just in case.

 

[scats]

She does look a little to be favouring toe landing from what I can see, so could well be something going on in the heel.

 

[Gloi]

The other thing would be to test those deep sulcus in the front frogs for being sensitive and to make sure there is no thrush in there. However ruling out laminitis is the first thing

 

[Sossigpoker]

I haven't watched the videos.
But age 6 is now the average age for horses to be diagnosed with arthritis. I find that shocking and sad. My 8 YO has an almost fused hock , and that probably started around the age of 6 or so.

In any case , you need to get your vet out for a lameness work up and diagnosis. Being a bit off and then improving once warmed up sounds like arthritis, but it could of course be other things too.

 

[Honey08]

I’d suspect possible mild lami too.

 

[Lucky Snowball]

I haven’t watched the videos but I would get the vet ASAP. Definitely not ride or lunge, keep off the grass, soaked hay just in case it is laminitis. Hopefully the vet will find something easily fixed.

 

[sbloom]

Going forwards, once you have sorted this acute issue, those feet have significant asymmetries - ie toe in, deviation/flare to the outside, they have significant growth lines (hence lammi being more likely), more growth at the toe than elsewhere, deep sulcuses and what look to be overgrown bars. Hopefully a foot expert will wade in. Without square on photos, from ground level for the side on shots, it's hard to say what's going on with hoof balance etc.

It would be worth getting farrier and bodyworker together, and never rule out improving her thoracic sling too, the way a horse goes can affect the feet, not just the other way around.

 

[ycbm]

But age 6 is now the average age for horses to be diagnosed with arthritis. I find that shocking and sad.

I'd be interested to know where you're getting that information from? I've personally known hundreds of horses in my life and never heard of one of them diagnosed with arthritis at or before the age of 6. I've only heard of arthritis in horses that young on the Internet and usually due to an injury.

("Average" is definitely incorrect, sorry to be picky, because if that was true then for every 15 year old diagnosed with arthritis there would have to be nine 5 year olds and that clearly isn't the case. )
.

 

[Marilyn91]

Thanks to everyone who has replied so far! It doesn't seem like laminitis to me, because she is okay-ish some days and worse others. Surely laminitis would be more severe and more constant? She has put on a little weight, because of the intermittent lameness in the past 6 weeks I haven't been able to exercise her as often/intensively as usual.

I called the vet and our old farrier this morning. We changed farriers when we moved yards a few months ago, and while I thought the current one was okay, the old one is more of a specialist and she had good hooves before. I was thinking of getting hoof boots for her, but one hoof is bigger than the other (!) so I'm aware we have a lot of problems, I'm just not sure what the underlying cause(s) are.

 

[Birker2020]

I'd be interested to know where you're getting that information from? I've personally known hundreds of horses in my life and never heard of one of them diagnosed with arthritis at or before the age of 6. I've only heard of arthritis in horses that young on the Internet and usually due to an injury.

("Average" is definitely incorrect, sorry to be picky, because if that was true then for every 15 year old diagnosed with arthritis there would have to be nine 5 year olds and that clearly isn't the case. )
.

Hi I'm not disputing whether the poster is correct or not but my friends horse had juvenile arthritis. He was 4 when diagnosed, at a professionals yard being backed and was on/off lame but the rider carried on regardless eventually casually mentioning it to my friend when she went to visit him. She was horrified and withdrew him from the yard and got him looked at immediately by a vet.

He sadly ended up a write off despite having bone chips taken from his knees and stifles. She kept him as a pasture pet but as soon as it was seen that he was struggling to get up and down in the field he was pts aged 7 or 8.

https://www.eurodressage.com/2011/03/20/osteochondrosis-growing-pain-young-horses

 

[Marilyn91]

Another update - my vet looked at the videos and says she's not lame, but she doesn't look right to me. The vet will come tomorrow to do a full investigation, and she asked me to work her today in the hope that the lameness will be more noticeable tomorrow. Now I'm thinking probably I should have just got the farrier on the job, or maybe it's all in my head.

 

[sbloom]

It's not in your head - she's NQR on the lunge, her feet aren't great so you'll definitely need help there of course, and she's fairly down in front, start with first principles which is vet, then posture/feet together so they help each other.

 

[HeyMich]

No Marilyn, it's not all in your head. She doesn't look right to me either. If your vet continues to not see it, please get another vet for a second opinion.

 

[Birker2020]

I personally don't think she's bringing her off fore forwards as much as the other leg. I also think she looks very stilted in her hind limb movement which could be indicative of all manner of things, without a correct lameness assessment you won't know. Like others say, I'd get a second opinion.

I seriously think you need to limit the amount of grass she is consuming, either by strip grazing her or by using a muzzle or restricting the amount of time she's out. I think the latter could cause additional problems, so I'd personally strip graze. I wouldn't give her any hard feed (if you are), if she needs supplements she can have just a handful of chaff to mix them into.

If you cannot split the paddock and strip graze (if horses are in a herd situation) then a muzzle to restrict her grazing might be the best option.

I have strip grazed my horses and its quite effective. Being overweight just like humans causes all sorts of joint issues as well as metabolic issues like EMS and laminitis.

Everyone has to learn and its great you've come on here to ask.

 

[scats]

As owners, we become very tuned in to our horses. If your gut tells you something isn’t right, trust it. I’ve had to be quite forthright with a few vets over the years because I’ve had a niggling doubt about something that may not be obvious at first to someone who doesn’t know the horse inside out. That instinct has never failed me.

 

[Birker2020]

Thanks for your reply. What makes you think it could be lami? I didn't feel any heat in the hooves.

Feeling heat in the hooves is quite an outdated way of diagnosing laminitis, as hooves change temperature throughout the day. Its better to learn how to take a digital pulse, finding a bounding pulse is something you will never forget.

Stilted pottery walk is another symptom of laminitis, also shifting weight from one foot to another foot and pain at the point of the frog when hoof testers are applied. Horses with laminitis can be reluctant to turn tightly and can also be reluctant to pick up their feet.

Some of the symptoms like a bounding pulse and lameness can also be indicative of other issues of the foot, I once rang the emergency vet on a Sunday as I thought my horse who was very lame and had a bounding pulse had laminitis. She asked me questions and then reassured me that a call out wasn't necessary as it wasn't laminitis and I could wait till the following day. She was right and it turned out to be inflammation of the coffin joint from existing arthritis which was exacerbated by the horse running across the had ground in the field during a hot spell.

 

[Marilyn91]

I personally don't think she's bringing her off fore forwards as much as the other leg. I also think she looks very stilted in her hind limb movement which could be indicative of all manner of things, without a correct lameness assessment you won't know. Like others say, I'd get a second opinion.

I seriously think you need to limit the amount of grass she is consuming, either by strip grazing her or by using a muzzle or restricting the amount of time she's out. I think the latter could cause additional problems, so I'd personally strip graze. I wouldn't give her any hard feed (if you are), if she needs supplements she can have just a handful of chaff to mix them into.

If you cannot split the paddock and strip graze (if horses are in a herd situation) then a muzzle to restrict her grazing might be the best option.

I have strip grazed my horses and its quite effective. Being overweight just like humans causes all sorts of joint issues as well as metabolic issues like EMS and laminitis.

Everyone has to learn and its great you've come on here to ask.

Thanks for sharing your experience. Her field has almost no grass, it's practically a starvation paddock, and she only gets a handful of chaff. She gets a lot of hay because otherwise she cribs in her stable - so for this reason limiting her time outside would be tricky. I didn't notice she was that overweight, I guess it crept up on me as I haven't been able to exercise her as much due to the intermittent lameness. She will be weighed on Saturday so I guess we'll see the extent of the damage then. I don't think it's laminitis personally because the lameness comes and goes, but let's see what the vet says tomorrow. She asked me to work her today so the lameness is more noticeable tomorrow, I feel terrible but I guess it has to be done.

 

[Birker2020]

Thanks for sharing your experience. Her field has almost no grass, it's practically a starvation paddock, and she only gets a handful of chaff. She gets a lot of hay because otherwise she cribs in her stable - so for this reason limiting her time outside would be tricky. I didn't notice she was that overweight, I guess it crept up on me as I haven't been able to exercise her as much due to the intermittent lameness. She will be weighed on Saturday so I guess we'll see the extent of the damage then. I don't think it's laminitis personally because the lameness comes and goes, but let's see what the vet says tomorrow. She asked me to work her today so the lameness is more noticeable tomorrow, I feel terrible but I guess it has to be done.

Lets hope its something simple, like it was with mine (coffin joints). Do keep us all updated and good luck tomorrow. Try not to worry too much x

 

[WelshD]

Obviously I'll echo the recommendations from other regarding getting a vet but when my pony was having intermittent problems (same as yours re loosening up after a while and being more reluctant to go forward under saddle) it turned out to be a saddle issue despite the saddle having been checked and fitted just a few months before, pony's show season weight gain meant the saddle was too narrow and he soldiered on for a while before we figured it out meaning he then had some very set in pain up and over his loin area as opposed to the usual suspect of the saddle area. we remedied that with a fresh saddle fitting and plenty of chiro and massages and then got the vet to do a sanity check on the legs and hooves just to be sure. They put him on a herbal painkiller called BozMerix (not allowed Bute because of show season) which worked a treat and after a couple of weeks he was right as rain.