Nervous pony and farrier - how can I make it easier on both of them!

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fine_and_dandy

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Ok, so Wonka had his first pair of shoes just before I got him. I was told that he was ok with farrier, no major issues to report - which I had nothing to question after. He was fine with having his feet picked up etc so I had no reason to have any suspicions that I hadn't been told the whole truth about his first time being shod. I had the farrier out when it was time for a change and to cut a long story short, Wonka got very wound up, bunny hopped down the yard with the farrier on the end of his leg, and in the end had to be twitched to get his back shoes off. At no point did he kick out or bite the farrier, he just got veyr upset by the whole thing. I apologised to our farrier and said that if I had any suspicions about his feet or shoeing not being as smooth as I was told, I would have told him.

Now my dilemma is here - I heard from somebody else that the farrier will not trim Wonka's feet or shoe him - he hasn't got the guts to tell me this and I have been trying to ring him to get an appointment! Now as I bought Wonka to sell on next year, I want to get him as sound as possible, but I really do not know what I can do in order to get him slightly less nervy about his feet and being shod - I don;t want him to be twitched everytime his shoes are changed.

Has anyone got any tips on how I can "de-sensitise" him to being shod?
 
I would think that the besy thing you could do is give him some sedalin each time he is shod and then try and ween him off of it, will be less stressful for him and safer for your farrier, good luck!!
 
Sedate them both?
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i may be slightly thick here (!), what is sedalin - a type of sedative? and where can I get it? I am at my wits end as I don't want anyone to get hurt or him to see it as a bad experience!

I don't know about sedating them both - more like me afterwards!
 
Seriously, you need to practice with your pony - stage one is making sure he is taught to lift his feet for you....then stage two is you holding his feet between your legs...then try 'hammering' them (pretend you are shoeing him). All the time reward him when he stands quietly and withdraw the food/reward when he starts to fidget.
Then get any random bloke (I'm sure you can find some) to do the same, rewarding pony for good behaviour again.
Then phone a new farrier, explain your pony is scared, and that you are trying to train him to be good...then see how it goes.
I had the same problem with two of mine when I got them and tried doping, twitching, nothing worked. Training them is the only effective long term solution...and now my shod horse stands without being tied for the farrier who says she is the best behaved horse he does.
So bribery and corruption all the way. Sedalin doesn't really work that well anyway.
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brilliant! thanks! i'm moving yards in two weeks and was thinking of asking the owner if she would get other people to do something like tap his feet etc before putting out in field and when he comes in again.

I have heard that if you "hammer" their feet too hard in can "concuss" (for want of a better word) if they aren't used to it - may be an old wives tale but I'm not sure. Wonka was also very anxious when he felt the pulling sensation of the shoe coming off - got any ideas there?!

thanks so much for the help
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If they tense up when the farrier hammers the nails home, it is often because they've been 'nail pricked' (when a nail goes into the sensitive parts of the foot, called sensitive laminae) or 'nail bound' (when the nail doesn't actually go into the sensitive part, but is so close it causes pressure to them) in the past and are anticipating the pain. It can be a sign of a c**p farrier (sorry!). When you are practising, you only want to hammer very gently on the actual shoe (not the sole of the foot in case you bruise him) to give the noise and slight feeling so your pony gets used to it...you aren't trying to shorten his height by blows!
It would also help to practice lifting his feet forward and moving about so he practices balancing on three legs...for the tripod part of shoeing...
Basically you need to make Wonka think the farrier is a good experience so think about providing a nice haynet, or offering treats, maybe making sure he has a (quiet) horse to stand next to...saying a firm 'no' when he starts to wriggle, but praising him constantly and rewarding when he's quiet.
Are you paying me per word here LOL?
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Forgot to say, don't make the common mistake of distracting him with food when he starts to fidget....or you are rewarding him for fidgeting. You must feed him for er...doing nothing!
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I have to disagree about sedalin not working. I cannot get a farrier anywhere near my horse - he is not agressive but will do whatever it takes to get away from the situation, and when you catch him again he is a trembling wreck. Away from a farrier I can do whatever I like to his feet, bang them, put them between my legs etc, but he has obviously had a traumatic experience being shod and is not the type to forgive and forget.

With just 2ml of sedalin he is as good as gold. Although he is aware of what he is going on around him and may pull back if someone moves too suddenly it takes the edge off him and stops him from freaking out.

If your horse is new to being shod then the training will probably work, with a bit of time and a patient farrier. But if it doesn't then I would atleast try sedalin.
 
bracken hates having her shoes pulled off, i had her a few years before i shod her as she had bruised soles! so anyways first time that the farrier came to replace them he just pulled at the first one, bracken went upright!! farrier then decided to remove each nail before pulling the shoe and she will just stand there as good as gold now. as the other have said just practise getting him used to having his feet handled and tapped he should get the idea!! bracken also when i first got her had 2 abcesess one after the other and after the second one refused point blank to lift her feet! dont blame her as she associated it with having her feet dug into!! anyways after about 4 months of constant attempts and loads of bribery!! and praise she went back to her normal good way!it also helps to have a very understanding farrier, mine is a treausure!! he is really patient and if it takes him all day to shoe a horse then so be it!! good luck with your boy!!
 
Have you seen those small trays of toffee that have a tiny hammer in them?
Well buy one, they are perfect for teaching babies how to tolerate the hammer.
Make it part of your daily routine, always reward him at the end and also teach him to stand with his front feet out in front, that's normally where they struggle.
Most horses get the hang of stretching out once shown what's required. A solid wooden box to rest on is ideal.
Use the hammer every day until he totally ignores it, then get a normal small hammer and tap with that instead.
We only ever get front shoes on first time or two, then the backs afterwards, somehow that seems to inspire confidence, but then we also are lucky enough to have the best farrier I've ever encountered in my life.. Anything nervous he uses Monty R techniques on, and spend ages just stroking and itching until they relax.
It seems one of his previous customers was Her Majesty, so I reckon what's good enough for her high standards will certainly suit us!
As for the farrier ring him and apologise for your horse's behaviour, it's our job to teach them manners not his.. Explain what you are doing and say you won't ask him to return until the horse is ok.. and if he refuses, find a better chap.. there are good ones, they just take some finding.
 
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Are you paying me per word here LOL?
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I can pay you in double choc dairy milk??

Thanks so much for the advice! He hasn't got shoes on as the last farrier refused point blank to do after we twitched him (he almost left him with fronts off and backs on) but I will defo get on the case with moving feet around, tapping etc and also getting different people to do it so he doesn't just associate it with me. I'm about to start him on blue chip karma to try and take "the edge" off him so I'm hoping it will make him slightly more managable in situations like this, though I know it isn't the solution - training, training, training! I shall report back in a week to let you know how he first takes to it and shall build up to the farrier coming lol

thanks again!
 
I apologised to the farrier already - I said to him that had I known how he was going to be I would have forewarned him as I know what it is like to go in blind having been mislead about something. He seemed fine and said he would come back next time but he has changed his mind. I think I will look for a new farrier as the one that came before doesn't hae the tolerance for Wonka - it showed when he was trying to get his shoes off and he lost it pretty quickly. It may be best to get a new farrier and let him know of the situation so he knows what I'm doing and hasn't got a past experience that he would hold against Wonka; if that makes sense :S
 
Most farriers are great as long as you are honest with them and tell them truthfully whether your pony is likely to kick, bite or whatever. If you explain you are trying to train him and you realise that it isn't the farrier's job to do the handling, you'll soon get them 'on side' - my farrier/s have been great about doing mine...as we are all working together to have an easy time.
I'll accept the truck of chocolate as soon as you care to send it.
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I was completely honest with the farrier first time round - it turned out the last person hadn't been so honest with me and his first shoeing escapade! Honesty is defo the best policy. I know full well handling is not farrier's responsibility, just need to find one that will be "on side" and work with us!

Chocolate coming courtesy of securicor - i've taken no chances!!
 
Wasn't suggesting you hadn't been...but farriers do get lied to a wee bit!
Perhaps you should keep the chocolate to bribe the farrier? Make him lots of cups of tea and feed him biscuits (the farrier, not the pony). With time and patience most farriers can be tamed
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I believe you can buy calendars with herds of them running naked pictured.
Wouldn't look myself, though, as I'd be shocked.
I think, generally speaking, they remain semi-feral....but I know many girls who have tried
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My pony used to be exactly the same. Trained him as others have suggested by picking up feet and hammering. Also left back shoes off so only had to have two feet actually shod. He really didn't like the smoke either so the farrier cold shod him for a few times.
 
Don't laugh, but i found scratching my pony did the trick. using one of those dog brushes with the white plastic bobbles on. He was so ecstatic about the scratching he forgot all about pratting around whilst his hind shoes were being nailed on. They're his "flashpoint" - he got caught up as a youngster and doesn't like his hind legs being fiddled about with. He's sent the farrier through the air before now, and was on a "final warning" at one stage. He's also tried to sit down a few times too. It was such a good feeling, when we got him shod in record time and all 3 of us stayed calm. I wish you the best of luck, up until the last time, I always dreaded the farrier coming because it was such an ordeal - I'm hoping next time will be just as good...
 
My young horse was like that, she came with her first set of shoes on and I was told she'd been fine to shoe, obviously not as I find out when our farrier came to shoe her! She totally freaked out especially at the banging, and was even worse with her hinds. Eventually had to twitch her which I don't like doing but she did stand quietly then and I took it off for her final leg and she was ok. I tried all the usual things to try and get her to stand, quietly banging her feet, making her watch the other horses getting done but the next time she needed to be shod she was just as bad as the first time so the farrier stuffed cotton wool in her ears and she stood perfectly quietly. As long as she couldn't hear the banging she was fine. That was 5 months ago, now she doesn't even need the cotton wool. Another idea to try if all else fails!
 
Hello...
My older mare used to be a bit like this when I first had her, changed farriers as anyone who is nervous/resentful of doing your horse is only going to make the situation worse! After a few shoeings with my current farrier she was absolutely fine because if she panicked, he let her fot go, calmed her down and carried on once she was chilled again. He used to spend 2hrs or more with us. Now she is as easy as anything to shoe. He is local to me and I'm not too far from High Wycombe, so I can PM you his number if you like? He also managed to shoe OH's mare a few weeks ago after she had had 10 different injections/nerve blocks in one leg, and wouldn't let me near her foot. Thought that just showed how much all our horses trust and like him! Like Adam Young as recommended by Fruity on your other post, he is popular and busy, but worth seeing if he could fit you in. WHereabouts in HW are you? Adam is good too btw, as is David Matthews apparently?
 
Why has your farrier given up so easily? I know it's a pain whne horses mess around but he's not huge and it sounds a bit like your farrier might have got wound up too. Surely one difficult time shoeing (and it can't be the worsed behaved horse he's ever shod) shouldn't make a farrier give up?

Sometimes horses can be worse the second time around so it doesn't necessarily mean he was awful the first time. He might have been reacting more to the shoes coming off which obviously he wouldn't have had the first time around. I had no problems with Titan the first time. The second time I hadn't got up the yard quite in time for the shoes coming off and my farrier said he'd been an absolute s***e! It was the main farrier shoeing him when I got there, not an apprentice, and that's saying something! He'd been good at picking up his feet for me and was shod before so I was surprised. As soon as I stood by him he was an angel, my farrier said "He knows his mam and not to mess with her"! Were you with him when he was shod? Were you yourself a bit nervous? Maybe he just reacted to the feeling of having shoes coming off, which would be a new sensation for him?
 
Hiya hel!

Farrier was fine at first but as Wonka got more wound up, he got frustrated and yelled at him, gave him a little thump - all things that don't help. I thought it may have been the sensation of shoes coming off as well, but I can't say for certain how he has been with shoes on as I'm not sure now. I wasn't nervous at all, didn't do anything differently to how I would if it was a normal day, Wonka was just very anti farrier. Wonka is not at all the worst behaved horse that the farrier has shod, I have heard worse stories from him and other owners but he will not go near Wonka again. I think its rather odd as I had heard good things about him and to give up so easily seemed odd in my mind.

Emma_C I am in lacey green, but will next week be moving to a yard down loosley hill!
 
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