New pony - in pain or testing me?

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Lb1105

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Hi, I’m just after a little advice with my new pony. I purchased him nearly four weeks ago as a pony for me to enjoy and for my daughters to learn to ride on so we are all very much still getting to know each other. He is an older been there done it pony who has been perfect on the ground for myself and my daughters. I’ve ridden him a few times and he has been great but this has changed this week. It started with a very exuberant lunge session where he took off bucking and pulling me across the school, I got on him after and he was fine. A couple of days later I took him on a solo hack where he was napping at every turn but nothing nasty and I was able to encouraged him through it and we did the full ride (a loop so no turning round and we have done this ride a couple of times before). Then today I had a lesson on him with a friend, he was great in walk and trot although he kept calling and was sticky by the gate, I managed to push him on and he produced some good work. We then tried a canter which is where it went a little wrong, on our first attempt he was on the wrong leg and told me this with two big bucks, I thought that’s fine he was unbalanced let’s try again. We then tried another canter and we had a few nice strides before he decided he wanted to go to the gate, he then bucked and bolted all the way down the long side to the gate. Like me my friend was shocked and said she never expected him to do that. I’m not the most confident rider who isn’t very gutsy now I’m older and I’m worried how to move forward with him. He was previously a pony club pony and was previously ridden by a 12 year old girl who learnt to canter on him so it seems out of character for him. He was living out over winter but is in overnight now so there have been some changes for him. He was vetted and tried and no issues came up. I’m going to get his saddle and back checked as a starting point but any other advice would be most welcome. Many thanks
 
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Have you spoken to the old owners? Is he in vastly less work now? Is he used to being ridden with others and is now being ridden alone? Is he doing ok in the field with settling in? Have you changed his feed?

Based on the very sweet pony we now have who turned into a monster in the home before us due to poor saddle fit (their saddler insisted it did fit - never seen anything that bridged more!) I would get the fit checked by someone new if your standard saddler fitted what he is wearing now. Ours - they assumed pain, spent a fortune getting her checked out from lameness exams to blood tests to…everything. It was the saddle. She was shouting this from the moment I met her and the saddlecloth appeared, and it most definitely did not fit.

I should probably add that I have know field friendship (or not) issues completely derail a sweet and safe pony. So it is worth standing and watching when you have time.
 
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What's his grazing like? Spring grass is coming through and can send some a little loopy. Has he been out grazing before you ride him, i.e. not getting rid of excess energy if he's been in overnight.

How much cantering have you done prior to the first 'whoopsie' canter? It could be that he's still settling and if there have been changes to his routine it's all new.

Has he made a friend that he's calling to? Have you been out in company and solo?

Would your friend get on him after the saddle check?
 
Thank you for the replies and thoughts. Here’s a little more info, he wasn’t in full work with his old owner (only hacked at the weekends since September) although he has been passed through pony club for a good number of years now and I’m his eighth owner so he is probably used to doing more.

I have put him on a low cal senior balance but will be stopping that as he probably doesn’t need it.

He was hacked alone and in company with his old owner but preferred company so the napping when alone wasn’t a total surprise.

He’s normally out from 7am until 5pm and was out before our lesson. Grazing isn’t great but they have hay in the field as we are on clay soil.

We had one canter prior today which was out on a solo hack (although my dad was walking on foot) he was good as gold and it was lovely steady canter, so cantering together is still pretty new to us.

We are on a small yard and there is one other younger pony with us, I do feel they have become quite attached and he has been calling out to him when we leave the yard. He is lovely and such a sweetheart and I really want him to enjoy himself but his second bronc felt quite nasty, like he really wanted to get me off 😔. He’s only 13.2 so my friend is too big to ride him, to be fair the one positive is that I was able to sit his silliness which has totally surprised me and I’m extremely thankful I bought a neck strap today 🙈.
 
Are you certain you aren't giving him conflicting aids? A friend once got a young pony who seemed to change personality when ridden. She booked some lessons and it turned out that she was inadvertently squeezing him on all the time, whilst having his reins really short and fixed. Once that was fixed he reverted back to the calm pony she's bought.

It could also be that he's feeling insecure, especially since he's become attached to another.
 
Its safer for everyone to assume pain, rather than "testing". Yes, it could be that he is still unsettled with change of home and rider and routine, but I would be doing saddle and a properly qualified physio or osteopath at least, if not the vet. If he has low grade pain somewhere, the added stress of new things could be enough to push him into a reaction that he might not have been giving before.
 
It’s a new partnership and you are finding your feet with one another and this takes time. Hack out and take lessons. How old is the pony? 8 owners is quite a number and may point to an issue others were encountering.
 
I’m not surprised he is unsettled if he has only known company for a good while (years?) and is now being asked to do things on his own with someone he has only just met, in a quieter environment with only one other equine.

Put yourself in his hooves and think about how he is feeling and how you can help him would be my suggestion. I would also talk to the old owner and see if, if he is unable to settle to the new way of doing things, they would take him back. It is usually best to buy a pony from a similar setup to yours, for an easy transition.

Things to build trust and get used to being alone for riding:
- school work alone (lunging, long reining, leading over poles, natural horsemanship type stuff)
- walks in hand alone (round the yard/fields at first if you are unsure of being able to hold him)
- bringing in away from the other pony for fuss, grooming, treats (carrot/apple type treats).
You need to show him you’re enough, get to know each other and get him used to finding being alone something pleasant/ok.

Calling/running to the gate would be stress from feeling insecure without equine company.

There may obviously be other issues also, but it is worth addressing the whole horse - mental health as well as physical health.
 
He’s 15 and after looking through facebook etc it’s seems he’s been bought for a PC child and then outgrown and sold on. In his last home he was wintered out in a field on his own (as he was being bullied by a bigger horse). I was expecting him to be cheeky he’s a NF 🤣🙈 which he has been, he tests the fencing and is quite mouthy and this week has been difficult to catch but the bucking has just really scared me. It was our first lesson together and the instructor was lovely. She felt it was him being very naughty and napping to the gate and to my friend who was waiting down that end. He’s a lovely boy and seems to be so safe in walk and trot but seems to just explode when cantering in a school. When he was vetted the vet did say he lunged him and he was very fresh and took off galloping around the school but the vet and owner both said he was in a different school and there was another horse cantering along the fence line and once he stopped he worked well. I love him and want to give him a home for life so I really want to work through this, I’m just so annoyed it’s bucking as i just don’t feel I could consistently sit to his bucks. I going do some groundwork with him to work on our partnership and trust and then once his saddle is checked do some confidence building hacks.
 
also I will admit I do need some lessons as I’ve very much been a happy hacker for a number of years so I could be unbalanced and weigh more than his last child rider. He’s my first pony after years of sharing so any advice would be welcome as I’m sure there are things I will miss.
 
I would get the vet and saddler to give him a check over even if just to rule out the behaviour being pain related but if it helps I still have my children's ponies...long outgrown...one isn't ridden but the other has had 3 loaners in about 10 years.

The first was an experienced rider but hadn't done a lot of jumping and she loaned him for 6ish years and in that time did her first sponsored rides, shows, show jumping etc and apart from a couple of rears in the prizegiving lineup at shows when he was younger she never had an issue and only gave him up when she no longer had time to ride because of work and uni.

Pony then had loaner number 2 for about 6 months who already had a bigger pony but it was too forward going for her and so her parents wanted something more school mastery I took him back as he wasn't being ridden and was grossly over weight bordering on laminitic and they said they never had time to ride him.

Loaner 3 then came along, she had only ridden at a riding school and had only jumped bottom hole. When she started loaning I gave her lessons and pony who had always been really good was a nappy little sh*t, spinning for the gate or refusing to go passed it, heading for me wherever I stood and running out when asked to go over the lowest jump...he'd been competing at 85 and taking his rider to the jump previously...after some enquiries I found loaner 2 had always cantered towards the gate, her mum always stood there and loaner would stop there constantly she also kept pulling him out of jumps at the last minute. So his 'naughty' behaviour with L3 was him doing what he had been taught by L2.

I'm not saying this is the case with your pony but if it had taught it previous rider how to canter it's possible they always cantered towards the gate as it was easier to get and pony just needs to relearn.

Oh and L3 still loans pony and is having great fun! She's jumping 85cm on him and has even managed the odd 1m...he's 16 and 12.3 so doesn't do big jumps very often to save his legs...she's also cantering him without any napping and had her first gallop out on a hack and pulled him up easily.
 
I would be taking him out of the field away from his friend daily but as maya suggested not necessarily to ride. Take him to the yard to stand and have a munch on something good, give a groom and put him back. A little bit of groundwork and back to the field but only ever when he feels relaxed. If he’s good inhand you could walk him out hacking as well as ride to try and help the napping. I would keep sessions short to start with and hopefully he will realise quite quickly his friend will always be waiting.
If he was by himself before you got him it could be a bit of separation anxiety so you just need to build his confidence. It could be why you’ve seen this behaviour in canter as his adrenaline is up with a bit of speed. There will be no harm in keeping it to walk and trot where he’s happier until he seems a bit more settled.

Of course it could be saddle fit, pain etc so don’t rule it out but the above is something you can do anyway and give him positive associations with you until the fitter, physio etc has been.
 
It could be saddle fit. Did he come with tack, has his weight changed? Or more likely he’s a pony and having fun at your expense. Ponies are clever and can pick up on people’s confidence. Some ponies are kind, others less so and an experienced PC pony will have seen a lot of life! I would try and find out from previous owners or local PC if they knew anything about the pony. It’s easy to find contact details for the DC.
 
Lb1105 said:
He’s 15 and after looking through facebook etc it’s seems he’s been bought for a PC child and then outgrown and sold on. In his last home he was wintered out in a field on his own (as he was being bullied by a bigger horse). I was expecting him to be cheeky he’s a NF 🤣🙈 which he has been, he tests the fencing and is quite mouthy and this week has been difficult to catch but the bucking has just really scared me. It was our first lesson together and the instructor was lovely. She felt it was him being very naughty and napping to the gate and to my friend who was waiting down that end. He’s a lovely boy and seems to be so safe in walk and trot but seems to just explode when cantering in a school. When he was vetted the vet did say he lunged him and he was very fresh and took off galloping around the school but the vet and owner both said he was in a different school and there was another horse cantering along the fence line and once he stopped he worked well. I love him and want to give him a home for life so I really want to work through this, I’m just so annoyed it’s bucking as i just don’t feel I could consistently sit to his bucks. I going do some groundwork with him to work on our partnership and trust and then once his saddle is checked do some confidence building hacks.
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New Forests do tend to buck - when excited or when cross for whatever reason. My first NF would rodeo if she’d had enough of whatever you were doing…My current one proper rodeos with head between her front legs, sort of twisting and turning like a pogo stick. She’s done it all her life and she is 10 this year. I know her triggers and mostly it’s not an issue. For us, if not in decent canter work she will get excited and buck in canter; if allowed to canter too fast - excitement…buck; if on an adult only hack where she is not babysitting…buck…if I put a child on her - buck. If she’s hurt herself she doesn’t buck, just parks up (fine!). My friend’s NF gelding is an absolute first ridden angel for a child but bucks merrily for an adult.

I would get him in more work, maybe look at your bit (I use a variety of gag always because I need to be able to get the head up if needed), get saddle check etc and work to gain his trust - it should fade away as he settles.
 
Thank you everyone for your responses and suggestions there are plenty of ideas I will look at. So I did message his old owner and just received a reply saying he had done the same thing twice with them when they first got him and after a good smack he stopped and never did it again. So I’m now feeling that he is testing me and I need to put my brave pants on and try again making sure I correct this behaviour.
 
Lb1105 said:
also I will admit I do need some lessons as I’ve very much been a happy hacker for a number of years so I could be unbalanced and weigh more than his last child rider. He’s my first pony after years of sharing so any advice would be welcome as I’m sure there are things I will miss.
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Saddle, I presume it came with him? We can't just get in someone else's saddle, the rider fit is crucial and your extra weight/height may have had a profound effect on how it fits on HIM now, even IF it was a perfect fit with the smaller rider (which I doubt, knowing what sort of saddles are generally sent with horses).

I do not believe that horses generally test people, smacking him doesn't get to the bottom of why he's doing it and just shuts his opinion down. Bucking in canter is often saddle and you have good reason to think this essentially doesn't fit now.
 
Lb1105 said:
So I did message his old owner and just received a reply saying he had done the same thing twice with them when they first got him and after a good smack he stopped and never did it again. So I’m now feeling that he is testing me and I need to put my brave pants on and try again making sure I correct this behaviour.
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Please do not do this. :(
 
sbloom said:
I do not believe that horses generally test people, smacking him doesn't get to the bottom of why he's doing it and just shuts his opinion down.
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I'd normally agree with this but IMHO ponies, particularly clever little native ponies can just be naughty to see how far they can go. My big lump of a cob is always, always, always a sod for new people. I end up having to go over and show them how to handle him and have them do some work with him under my supervision and he's back to being a lovely boy. He always tries it on again once he's alone with them, but by then I've shown them how to handle him and he realises and reverts back to being a polite and pleasant pony.

If he's left to his own devices the behaviour escalates until he's dangerous, he pushes and pushes until he's in control then doesn't like it and panics and you cant safely handle him. Hes outsmarted 2 decent pros because if you try and smack him or push him around and dominate him he comes at you and he might only be 14.2hh but he's built like a tank and he means business. Admittedly, he's a very quirky and tricky boy with a history of abusive homes, so he's an extreme version, but he's not the first and wont be the last that's like that, it seems to be a pony thing to see just how far you can go before someone says no.

Smacking isn't the answer, but some ground work to build a relationship and lots of lessons while you get to grips with each other.

I would also do a full MOT of back, teeth, saddle as that's the first thing I do when I get a new horse home. You want to be absolutely certain he's comfortable and feeling well.
 
Lb1105 said:
Thank you everyone for your responses and suggestions there are plenty of ideas I will look at. So I did message his old owner and just received a reply saying he had done the same thing twice with them when they first got him and after a good smack he stopped and never did it again. So I’m now feeling that he is testing me and I need to put my brave pants on and try again making sure I correct this behaviour.
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Try to imagine how you would feel and react if walloped for expressing your opinion. This is absolutely the worst side of 'horsemanship'.
 
Mrs. Jingle said:
Please do not do this. :(
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I won’t be smacking him, personally I feel a growl would be better for him as he responds well to your voice. If he does it again I will ride him through it and ensure we finish the session on my terms and not at the gate. Before I even try again I will be doing lots of groundwork with him and establishing trust and a partnership between us which I know will take time. He really is the sweetest boy and I was actually quite upset to see he’s had quite a few homes, i want to ensure he has a happy home for life with me.
 
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Thank you everyone again for your comments and advice the saddle fitter has been contacted. I’m also getting the physio out to check him. Unfortunately he is chipping away at my confidence 😔 I took him for a little in hand walk today and he was good as gold. When we got back I thought I would give him a little lunge, we were just walking and after pushing him forward when he tried to stop and eat grass he just exploded 😬 he was bucking, spinning and tanking to the gate nearly pulling me over just like last weekend. Once he had calmed down I walked him around in hand so we didn’t end on his terms but I feel his reactions are just so extreme. He’s off any hard feed and his turnout has increased so hopefully this will help. I totally understand he may be feeling incredibly unsettled but I’m worried he’s going to hurt himself. He is an absolute angel to lead, catch, turnout and groom, he’s very respectful I can ask him up back up and stand and he will with no hesitation. He’s a lovely boy and I’m sure we’ll get through it but this week feels hard.
 
I would stop lunging him just now or ask an instructor to do the lunging if it’s making you lose confidence. Stick to activities that are relaxed and happy because he will lose confidence in you if you’re not feeling it.

You had a nice walk inhand and you might’ve just pushed it asking more of him just yet.
 
Peglo said:
I would stop lunging him just now or ask an instructor to do the lunging if it’s making you lose confidence. Stick to activities that are relaxed and happy because he will lose confidence in you if you’re not feeling it.

You had a nice walk inhand and you might’ve just pushed it asking more of him just yet.
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Thank you and yes I agree lunging isn’t a good idea at the moment. He’s having the day off tomorrow and then I have some very experienced friends coming to help over the weekend.
 
How did you get on over the weekend?

I would also agree on vet route. We had a very similar situation with our NF when he first arrived. Eventually, after much investigation, it turned out to be pain related (SI joints). Any schooling was a huge no no for him. In fact, we’ve since retired him. He would have been ok hacking but he was very nappy from the get go. 5 stage vetting too.

I’m not saying that’s your situation but ruling out pain first, then looking at behaviour usually is the best way of doing things. Sooner rather than later too.
 
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