No point to lessons, cheaper to buy a horse!

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Onyxia

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Girl I know, not really a friend but have known her years, has just bought a horse.
She has had(at MOST) a handfull of stable care lessons and no more then one riding lesson a week for a year.
She hasnt helped out at RS, she hasnt helped out friends with horses-ALL her experiance is from those few lessons at RS.

She has bought it against the advuce of everyone she knows because its cheaper to keep a horse then pay for lessons
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That cant be true?
Two lessons a week costs, what? £50 with a really good instructer??
Surely cost of keep is far more then that?????

Feel very sorry for the poor horse
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What an idiot is all I can say. Bad things can happen when someone buys a horse without the experience and knowledge to look after one. I too feel sorry for the horse. And yes it is far more expensive to own a horse than to have lessons at a riding school!
 
yes that is very odd. I've had horses all my life and although I'd say I know more about keeping a horse than the average horse owner (around us = bad!) I trust my mum 100% that she will keep my pony 100%, and i'm not sure i'd like to take that responsibility.

It really is important to me that my horse is happy and in good hands, others don't have the same priorities.
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Where is she keeping the horse? At a livery yard/riding school or on her own land?

How much is DIY around you Anima? £30 per week max = £120 plus shoes and worming every 6 weeks = £60; So about £180 per month during the summer, more in winter obviously.

Versus 2 lessons at £50 per week you say? = £200 per month or £100 if she only has one per week.

Seems she's right if she does indeed have 2 lessons per week.......however she hasn't added in all the extras that go along with having a horse. She'll learn though.
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Best of luck to her - I have a few beginners on my yard and they are doing terrific with their unbroken youngsters that they are in the process of backing
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WE have two of these at our yard. One had sat on a horse 3 times in her life. The other (her mother inlaw) sat on her DIL's pony once then bought her own.
They bought a 4 year old and 6 yr old. They are doing amazingly well also. The DIL wont get on her 6 yr old mare and is even reluctant to handle it and the MIL is doing a grand job of teaching her 4 yr old all sorts of airs above ground.
 
I got told a good un, a bloke went on a holiday to the states riding horses. Never sat on a horse in his life until then.
Enjoyed it so much he bought a western saddle then bought a horse. The horse was toomuch for him so he sold it and on the advice of an inexperienced lass bought a 6 years old Selle Francais mare that has also proven to much for this bloke.

Seemingly this lass wanted him to buy this horse so she could ride it but then she couldn't cope with it either....


The mind boggles...
 
I was pretty much a beginner when I had my first horse. However, I never went into it with the arrogance or stupidity to assume that I didn't need lessons or that it would be cheaper than lessons at a RS.

Initially I only rode when I was having private freelance lessons on my horse...twice a week at £30 a pop! As my confidence grew the lessons were reduced to once a week, then once a fortnight. I now ride far more than I would if I was just having lessons at a RS.

However, I still need lessons and still have ALOT to learn. Even top riders have lessons regularly. It was important to me to learn to be safe and effective at controlling my horse when riding alone. I wouldn't have gone out on the roads for instance until I knew I could walk, trot, canter securely.

It's a bit foolish to just think it's cheaper to buy the horse than have lessons and find yourself stuck with a horse you cannot or dare not ride because your ability is not matched to the horse out of a controlled and safe environment of a school. Yes, by all means by a horse as a beginner. I am proof that it can work. However I knew from day one that I would need help with my riding and was prepared to pay for it. I also educated myself as best as I could on the management side of things.
 
well I got pickle (my first horse) after working up the RS where pickle is now kept on working livery, and loaning a riding school horse. I wasnt greatly experienced but YO put me on the right track!

Its not cheaper to buy a horse than have lessons definetly, because even if it is technically you are not taking into account vets bills etc. I have the best of both worlds have a horse then work all weekend at the RS at get a jumping lesson for doing that, I also do escort rides etc
 
This has potential for disaster, however if she is willing to listen and learn, she will develop her skills much faster with daily on to one contact with a horse and her riding will also improve.

Hindsight is a wonderful thing, I thought I was experienced enough when I bought my first horse, i had spend many years before that riding other people's horses, I now know that really I knew nothing, I was fortunate I had a fab YO who taught me a lot and I read voraciously to build up my knowledge.

I spent the first year being thrown off my pony every time I rode (she was NOTHING like a RS pony) but that little pony taught me so much.
 
Luckily my riding was ok before I got the horses so no worries there and have done plenty of riding on the roads so fine there as well.
As for the practical side of looking after horses well. You learn as you go along don't you.
Common sense is an amazing thing.
My motto is if in doubt always ask.
There are always plenty of people on hand to ask about any issues with regard to owning or keeping horses as your own.
Friends, family, forums like this, vets, magazines, books and the internet. The list is endless.
Even the financial side of caring for a horse can be investigated both beforehand and during.
I have plenty of books on how to save money and time whilst caring for horses, think one is by Susan McBane. There are useful tips out there for all to see or listen to. It's having the intelligence to sort out the wheat from the chaff.
Some advice can be useless whilst others can be fantastic.
There is nothing wrong in a person who has done little riding to get a horse.
Has every dog owner owned a dog before?
Has every cat owner owned a cat before?
The answer is no !
We all have to start somewhere.
So long as these novices are capable of asking for help when they need it or are prepared to put the effort in then why not buy a horse.
Instead of being overly critical of others we may deem as not being as experienced in riding or stable care than us we should be helping them.
There was a thread on here recently where the op was verbally attacked for making a few bitchy remarks (with just reason) well some of these posts are even more bitchy for no reason!
Trouble is that some of us think we are elistist just because we own a frekin horse well we are not.
We all started off somewhere.
And for the record I originally had about 18months of half hour private lessons once a week at the age of ten onwards.
After that it was just hacks on and off until my last ride ( prior to getting horses) 4 years ago.
I had no experience of mucking out etc and all that goes with it.
But I'm a responsible adult who is very keen to learn and has the horses interests and welfare at the forefront of my mind.
Perhaps these people who are beginners when it comes to actual horsekeeping should be helped. Given encouragement. Ask them if they want help? Cannot control a horse or are scared of it? Lacking in grooming skills, mucking out or anything remotely connected with horse care.
These people should be helped out by people like ourselves who do have a bit more experience instead of being bitched about behind their backs!
Caroline
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point is - lessons are invaluable! getting a horse when you have no idea how to look after it is stupidity!

i want to get a tortoise but have no idea to look after it, and im not one to just get it before i even know how to keep it. i dont want to kill it!

i have lessons every week, yes on a horse i am riding at the moment. i would love to have him on loan, but i know that if i do that i wont be able to afford lessons. so lessons it is!!
 
It doesn't seem to occur to these people that they would still benefit from lessons even if they have their own horse and they don't factor in this cost. Granted it may not be as expensive on your own horse but still...
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I have no problem with first time owners as long as they and the horse are stabled in the right sort of yard and that people are humble enough to realise they know bugger all.

The dangerous ones are those who think that they dont need lessons, dont ask the more experienced for advice, or wont listen when advice is offered.

I do know of a couple of people who have bought horses after a couple of riding school hacks out and then read a book.....these people are an accident or cruelty case waiting to happen.

We all have to start somewhere but you dont have one driving lesson then go out and get that ferrari youve always wanted.
 
[ QUOTE ]
She has bought it against the advuce of everyone she knows because its cheaper to keep a horse then pay for lessons
shocked.gif

That cant be true?
Two lessons a week costs, what? £50 with a really good instructer??
Surely cost of keep is far more then that?????

[/ QUOTE ]

I don't know, I manage to keep my lad for around £50pw on average.

Don't get me wrong, I do NOT agree with what this girl has done (after over 4yrs of riding, 2yrs of which were helping out at a RS, 6mnths of which were having a share horse, and 12months of which were having a full loan horse, I still doubt in whether I'm ready to buy my own!!). It isn't fair on the horse, but sadly there seems to be more and more people who insist on buying horses too early.

My lessons were only £15pw for a group lesson, so far cheaper than owning/loaning, but for private lessons with a very good instructor more than once a week, you probably could own one for cheaper than lessons under the right circumstances.
 
I agree with Cazee34, it is incredibly hard to get into this if no-one wants to help you!

I am really lucky as I decided to share (then ended up full-loaning) before I was going to buy and the girl who owns him has been amazing! I had never owned a horse in my life, but I had started riding when I was 3. This girl has patiently (most of the time!) shown me what to do and how to do it for the last 7 months.

Whilst I am not horse owner of the year, I have managed to get so much better and even managed to spot it when C got colic.

If more people decided to share their knowledge and encourage those like me who haven't owned horses all their life then surely it would be better for the horses in the long run?

All it takes are some kind words of help & encouragement. Riding & owning a horse can be so Cliquey when there really shouldn't be any need for it!
I have had so much help & support as well as lessons, I have started going to dressage and I am actively encouraged to go out. Now there is no need for me to buy a horse as I have everything I need and am still learning.
 
Of course it's nice when people offer to help you out but it shouldn't be automatically expected. People shouldn't buy a horse on the assumption that someone will babysit them and put them right. Often times people struggle to fit in their own horses if they have a hectic lifestyle. They wouldn't have the time to spend watching over someone else constantly.

What if there is no one around to help?

Don't get me wrong, I'm all for beginners having horses and indeed I did it myself. You (collectively, not meaning you directly) need to educate yourself and do things for yourself to be able to learn. I chucked myself in at the deep end and thankfully things worked out fine.

It's not the management of a horse that I think is the biggest problem though....it's the riding. I wouldn't have bought a horse thinking I'd be able to teach myself to ride as I went along. I went into it knowing and budgeting for private lessons. Therefore, in response to the OP's question......it certainly wasn't cheaper for me to own a horse than it was to go for lessons at a RS once a week.
 
I think the problem is that these people need the help before not after they are trying to muddle through with their first horse. The morning after we bought Mo we looked out the window and dashed out because it looked like she was in next door's field. That turned into our first meeting with W and her owner K, K had wanted a horse her whole life and done 2 years of off and on lessons in a riding school before buying W who was a green, diffcult 6 year old.

We have tried to help as much as we could from teaching K to catch, feed, tack up, muck out to introducing her to our instructor and farrier. However it would have been far better if she had been given some help before she bought such a diffcult animal as her first horse and she would have had far more fun.

At the moment W has gone on loan and K is talking about finding something she feels confidant with (we will help as much as we can) but your first horse shouldn't put you through the wringer like this.
 
Absolutely Patches, your horse is ultimately your responsibility, however, I have discovered after a few months at our new yard that there are people who have owned horses longer than I have and yet they expect other people to T/O or B/I their horses because they don't have the time, so their horse is out on it's own at night. Surely that is irresponsible?

You have a duty to both you and your horse to continue your education in more ways than just riding I feel. Any fool can sit on a horse or for that matter go out and buy one, but ( as I have learnt) it is so much more than that to owning a horse. I happily take advice from people who I feel are 'qualified' so to speak to give it to me, but there are many peolpe even on our yard who do things that I feel are unacceptable and not good horse practice. So who is right? It is certainly tricky, but I feel not everybody should be tarred with the same brush!
 
Absolutely I agree with you. I went from a complete beginner to someone who I think is pretty ok at managing horses on a day to day level. When I need advice I seek it from people who I know are only too happy to answer my questions and whose advice I trust implicitly. My horses are all happy and healthy and in fabulous condition. Educating yourself via the internet, books, from professionals or peers is all part of the journey to becoming an enlightened owner. If you want/need assisted livery then pay for it.

So, yes, I totally agree that not everyone should be tarnished with the same brush. I also agree that there are bound to people out there who have been in horses all their lives who probably have some dubious management policies.

No one is perfect, beginners and experienced people alike. As long as people are happy to offer you advice, that's wonderful. Surely though, for some people there can't be anything worse than a fellow DIY'er constantly asking for help/assistance. If they need it...they shouldn't be on DIY. The same applies for anyone.
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i think that it doesn't sound like the best thing to do although i brought a horse because it was cheaper that lessons however saying that i had worked my ass off everyweekend for 5 years at my local RDA center so was pretty clued up on most things however i stabled her where i worked at an old racing yard and got all of my stabling,staw,feed,wormer for free and still got payed but the lady was on site and i learnt somuch from her as she bred her race horses.
 
I think we have to be honest here, there are always going to be people who really shouldn't own any animal whatsoever! That shouldn't mean that you can't help genuine people who want to do the best they can for the horse/dog/cat/ferret!

I love C and I love what his owner has helped me achieve. I think that if more people were like that then it would be so much easier! Even just some encouraging words wouldn't go amiss!
 
We own our own horse but still recognise the need to have lessons. To think that because you now have your own horse you no longer need them is ludicrous.
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hmm-does she not have any horsey friends or even the yard she is keeping hers at might help her??? not the most sensible thing to do but lots do it! it is infact costing me the same price to keep my pony as having lessons.
livery including stable/grazing/hay/bedding = £20.00pw
feed = £10pm
insurance = £20pm
total of £110pm
and a weekly lesson would cost me between £20-£30 = £80-£120pm!!!!!!!!
(ok so forgot to add £25 for shoes every 8-9 weeks and wormer which doesnt cost alot!)
 
Minkymoo and Patches some very good opinions and comments there.
With regard to lessons yes I would love to have more if I could afford to but only if I was considering doing something like showing or dressage for instance. Even jumping would be handy because at present my current yard does not have a proper school to use.
I am strongly thinking of sending my daughter for more lessons though as she seems to have forgot a lot of what she was taught a few years earlier. In an ideal world somewhere close by where she could take Mcfly up to as well would be handy. I don't drive, we don't have a towbar nor trailer nor can we afford a horsebox so sadly travelling is not a possibility as I would need somewhere within walking distance.
A lady on our yard goes for lessons but she does dressage and endurance and has her own 4x4 and trailer which makes life a bit easier. She told me she saved for one and that is what I plan to do.
In our case we could not afford to get all the equipment before getting the horses. I did get some saddles, tack, rugs etc and smaller items but as for a trailer where would you store it and also what size would you need and also it would have wiped out most of my budget.
Yes I did prepare for the horses before I got them. A good friend of mine was badgered by emails etc for nearly a year beforehand asking about this that and the other. I learned a lot during that time and I'm still learning.
If I need help or advice I will ask for it.
There is no point in being too proud not to ask and I also offer advice if someone else asks me.
I have an extremely busy life and don't get as much time with the horses as I would like but that still doesn't mean when I am at the yard I shun people because I want time with my horses.
I would go out of my way to help people. But that is the way I am. Equally though I do expect that when I ask for help I get it. Is that being selfish ? no in my opinion. If someone is kind enough to offer their time to help others then at the very least someone should offer help or advice to them.
I am not a taker, I am a giver but there are times when I do expect a bit of take as there is no point in being a doormat all your life.
Even if that ask of help just results in a few words of yes that is right or you are doing well etc. Like Minkymoo rightly pointed out it is not much to ask for someone to offer a few encouraging words.
I suppose time may be an issue here as some people may not have the time to offer help and advice to others but I personally think we should all make sacrifices for each other no matter how well or how little you know your horsey neighbour.
It is no wonder after reading some of the posts on here that people who are entering riding yards or horse ownership for the first time perceive us horse people as rude, elitist snobs!
I think it is about time that those elitist attitudes were wiped out. Just because someone has owned a horse or ridden a horse for upteen amount of years it does not necessarily make them a better horse owner or rider than a beginner.
A person's ability to care and ride a horse is as equal to their ability to learn, ask questions, learn from mistakes made ( no one is perfect) and above all listen to and help others. A lot can be learned from helping your horsey neighbour. You can hear about issues you had never encountered before and as a result you will learn about them whilst making an effort to help or console your stablemate.
Caroline
 
hear hear Cazee34!! Well written and one in the eye for all those elitist snobs! There is no harm asking people for help, if they don't have the time (and some won't) just ask someone else! At the end of the day, I feel it is the horse that will suffer if you don't ask for help or won't give any and that isn't fair!

And I don't think there is anything wrong with doing a bit of taking as well as giving either!
 
[ QUOTE ]

Perhaps these people who are beginners when it comes to actual horsekeeping should be helped. Given encouragement. Ask them if they want help? Cannot control a horse or are scared of it? Lacking in grooming skills, mucking out or anything remotely connected with horse care.
These people should be helped out by people like ourselves who do have a bit more experience instead of being bitched about behind their backs!
Caroline
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Hmmmm not sure I 100% agree. I understand what you are saying and I agree with the sentiment BUT...

If someone arrived to livery at the same yard as me who had only had a handful of lessons and hadn't taken the time to build up enough knowledge and experience to own a horse largely 'unsupervised' (and had bought the horse just because it was cheaper than lessons) I certainly would not feel obliged to automatically dedicate lots of my time to teaching them. No way. I usually have a busy stressful full time job which I do just to be able to have my horse, I end up rushing around most evenings just to get done what needs to be done for him, ride etc.

We ALL come across new situations where we need advice, a second opinion etc and I'm sure if you asked anyone at my yard they would tell you I'd go out of my way to help others and likewise ask others if ever I am unsure BUT I certainly wouldn't feel it my duty to oversee and coach someone the basics- I see it is THEIR responsibilty to make sure they have that before they take on full responsibilty for a horse.

It's not my job to make sure everyone knows what they are doing, one horse is enough responsibility for me.

Does that make me selfish and bitchy? Maybe, but I can't say I'll lose too much sleep over it.
 
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hear hear Cazee34!! Well written and one in the eye for all those elitist snobs!

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Just because someone isn't leaping forward to offer unlimited help, time, and advice doesn't mean they are an elitist snob. What a ridiculous and petulant thing to say.
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