OK lets have it.. please don't be too harsh!

[squiz22]

I can't believe I am doing this. I know its horrid.. really horrid!

This is a video of me taking Winnie on his first outing of the year. He'd been off for about 2 months with one thing or another and I started bringing back into work at the beginning of the year. I find him lollopy when he's fit let alone now! He's big too and I am working on keeping him much more together.. I am trying to hold my hands a bit higher than usual to help him come up in front. We started doing this in a lesson last week and it helped.. It doesn't matter if Winnie is jumping 90cm or 1.20m as the height doesn't phase him but our rounds are all a total mess!!

All CC would be much appreciated but please don't be too mean!

http://youtu.be/nKk3XgMpnd4

 

[Custard Cream]

No CC from me as I know nothing but wanted to post to say I was pleasantly surprised by what I saw after your description! Your horse is a poppet. It looked laid back and calm. A few bits of disunited canter round corners and you looked quite stiff in your upper body resulting in the 'rocking' motion, but nothing awful. I thought you both looked good!

 

[PonyIAmNotFood]

Massively NOT a jumper so don't know much, but would say I would sit down a bit more a couple of strides from the fence so you can get your leg on a bit more and get a bit more between leg and hand and pingy. But like I said, maybe wrong as don't know that much myself!

I was expecting something horrific when I read your description, it looked a nice calm round to me!

 

[squiz22]

No CC from me as I know nothing but wanted to post to say I was pleasantly surprised by what I saw after your description! Your horse is a poppet. It looked laid back and calm. A few bits of disunited canter round corners and you looked quite stiff in your upper body resulting in the 'rocking' motion, but nothing awful. I thought you both looked good!

Thanks, he's very very honest. I think you are sot on with upper body stiffness. I thought that but didn't feel like I was stiff at all..?? I think I need to do this a lot more and see if I can loosen up a bit perhaps.

 

[squiz22]

Massively NOT a jumper so don't know much, but would say I would sit down a bit more a couple of strides from the fence so you can get your leg on a bit more and get a bit more between leg and hand and pingy. But like I said, maybe wrong as don't know that much myself!

I was expecting something horrific when I read your description, it looked a nice calm round to me!

Thanks for comment! We did get 18 time pens BUT i went in to have decent round and try and work on the bits between the fences so I wasn't going in to win.

 

[ellie_e]

What a lovely honest horse you have!!! To me I think you need to ride him more forward with the leg and hold him in the hands, and look where you want to go, practice riding your lines to a fence as personally I wouldnt of jumped the fences If i was him given some of the lines you gave him. Sit up and tall and try and hold him together, he looks very big and strong but also honest and genuine. Good luck with him!!

 

[Baydale]

Awwww, don't be so hard on yourself, he's such a sweetie and there's a lot to like. Yes, he's big but that's not such an issue if you can get, and keep, him in front of the leg. He looks like he gets more into it in the second half and then the whole picture is more pleasing because he's more forward. I think you need to get him sharper before you worry too much about keeping him together as he seems to want to make a good job of it, certainly he never says no, just fumbles a bit when the canter lacks quality and your steering has gone wobbly. Anyhow, I much prefer one you have to kick than one that pulls. Is he like that in your lessons or does he just go a bit backward when you go somewhere strange as he does look a bit ring-rusty?

 

[noodle_]

same as custard cream tbh about the upper body - but nothing major!!!



lovely horse

 

[lex2501]

I do love Winnie! My suggestion would be to have him sharper off the leg as when you asked him to canter a few times, it took a fair few strides before it happened. I would be doing tons of walk to canter to walk transitions to build up the strength and the "sit" and basically to get him in front of the leg. The stiffness in the upper body is likely to be a symptom of you trying to hold him together and you are slightly setting yourself against him. Grand job for a big green baby with the most enormous canter though He is so honest and must be very tricky to ride being such a big fella. You have produced him beautifully!

 

[ellie_e]

He looks like he gets more into it in the second half and then the whole picture is more pleasing because he's more forward.

^^^ This!!

 

[squiz22]

Awwww, don't be so hard on yourself, he's such a sweetie and there's a lot to like. Yes, he's big but that's not such an issue if you can get, and keep, him in front of the leg. He looks like he gets more into it in the second half and then the whole picture is more pleasing because he's more forward. I think you need to get him sharper before you worry too much about keeping him together as he seems to want to make a good job of it, certainly he never says no, just fumbles a bit when the canter lacks quality and your steering has gone wobbly. Anyhow, I much prefer one you have to kick than one that pulls. Is he like that in your lessons or does he just go a bit backward when you go somewhere strange as he does look a bit ring-rusty?

yeah he feels a bit like I giant sack of spuds and he wobbles all over the shop. It was his first time out in months so I was chuffed with his behaviour overall but there's a lot to work on.

In our lessons he can be a lot more forward going. I didn't have much time to warm up on Sat and there were LOADS of people in the warm up so we had a quick walk, trot, canter and popped 2/3 fences before we were called. I think he would have benefited from doing the 100 after as well because as soon as we came out he seemed to wake up..! I do need to sharpen him up a lot so if you know of any good exercises please do share..!
I find if he has time off he really loses muscle and takes a lot longer to build up again. I am really working on getting him fit again at the moment.

 

[squiz22]

same as custard cream tbh about the upper body - but nothing major!!!



lovely horse

Thanks.

I've been really lucky with him. Bought him as an unbacked young 3yo as a project and have just bought him on really slowly and I am so glad he's turning out so well. He's the kindest (not so) little person!

 

[squiz22]

I do love Winnie! My suggestion would be to have him sharper off the leg as when you asked him to canter a few times, it took a fair few strides before it happened. I would be doing tons of walk to canter to walk transitions to build up the strength and the "sit" and basically to get him in front of the leg. The stiffness in the upper body is likely to be a symptom of you trying to hold him together and you are slightly setting yourself against him. Grand job for a big green baby with the most enormous canter though He is so honest and must be very tricky to ride being such a big fella. You have produced him beautifully!

Walk to canter - i think thats an excellent idea Lex!!

 

[lex2501]

Walk to canter - i think thats an excellent idea Lex!!

Another thing I struggled with when I had one which wasn't great off the leg was to stop using the leg! You have to be really disciplined in not allowing yourself to "kick them along". Really make a conscious effort to keep the leg off, and when you use it, if they dont react then back up with a schooling whip. Carrying 2 schooling whips is really good too. You basically want to feel like he is waiting to react, and therefore you have something to contain. Easier said than done though and I really struggled with my backwards, lazy horse! I was constantly being shouted at by instructor to stop hassling him with my leg, because they just learn to ignore it. I'm certainly no expert just thought I would pass on these pearls of wisdom from my past experiences even if I failed to practice what I am preaching!!!

 

[ellie_e]

Another thing I struggled with when I had one which wasn't great off the leg was to stop using the leg! You have to be really disciplined in not allowing yourself to "kick them along". Really make a conscious effort to keep the leg off, and when you use it, if they dont react then back up with a schooling whip. Carrying 2 schooling whips is really good too. You basically want to feel like he is waiting to react, and therefore you have something to contain. Easier said than done though and I really struggled with my backwards, lazy horse! I was constantly being shouted at by instructor to stop hassling him with my leg, because they just learn to ignore it. I'm certainly no expert just thought I would pass on these pearls of wisdom from my past experiences even if I failed to practice what I am preaching!!!

I get told this all the time, its so hard not to do especially if there having a particularly lazy day!

 

[squiz22]

Another thing I struggled with when I had one which wasn't great off the leg was to stop using the leg! You have to be really disciplined in not allowing yourself to "kick them along". Really make a conscious effort to keep the leg off, and when you use it, if they dont react then back up with a schooling whip. Carrying 2 schooling whips is really good too. You basically want to feel like he is waiting to react, and therefore you have something to contain. Easier said than done though and I really struggled with my backwards, lazy horse! I was constantly being shouted at by instructor to stop hassling him with my leg, because they just learn to ignore it. I'm certainly no expert just thought I would pass on these pearls of wisdom from my past experiences even if I failed to practice what I am preaching!!!

Its really hard not to become a 'nag' with your leg though on a horse like winnie. He also blows hot and cold and some days he's like a bat out of hell. XC he's strong and seriously forward going. We had 20pens at Munstead because I came so fast round the corner I shot past the fence.. hugely frustrating when dressage was ok and SJ clear!!

 

[Vindaloo]

Oh Squiz22, what on EARTH were you worrying about. I'm no jumper so wouldn't dare offer cc but from what I could see, you both looked pretty happy in your round and your lad looks lovely and soft. You ride him nicely and quietly too.

 

[Naryafluffy]

Another thing I struggled with when I had one which wasn't great off the leg was to stop using the leg! You have to be really disciplined in not allowing yourself to "kick them along". Really make a conscious effort to keep the leg off, and when you use it, if they dont react then back up with a schooling whip. Carrying 2 schooling whips is really good too. You basically want to feel like he is waiting to react, and therefore you have something to contain. Easier said than done though and I really struggled with my backwards, lazy horse! I was constantly being shouted at by instructor to stop hassling him with my leg, because they just learn to ignore it. I'm certainly no expert just thought I would pass on these pearls of wisdom from my past experiences even if I failed to practice what I am preaching!!!

Haven't watched the vidoe (I'm at work at the moment!!!)
We have a horse that we carry 2 dressage whips with bits from carry bags attached to the end, friend also used to use swan neck spurs, but a lot of people aren't keen on them, if your lower leg isn't still you can mark them quite badly and if he's just a bit of a baby I would stick to 2 whips to tap him on with.

 

[Miss Moose]

I'd say there is nothing seriously wrong with that round, but it would definitely be improved if you upped the canter and got him in a stronger canter. I think this would stop him coming so close to the fences and really help him to jump them better. I had a horse like yours and in order to make him jump better, in a more forward rhythm during a sj round I would think "cross country pace", which improved the canter and his jumping style!

 

[squiz22]

Oh Squiz22, what on EARTH were you worrying about. I'm no jumper so wouldn't dare offer cc but from what I could see, you both looked pretty happy in your round and your lad looks lovely and soft. You ride him nicely and quietly too.

Ha..! Thanks. I think I look really awkward and wobby in the video! I do try not to interfere with him much because it usually ends in him getting confused and knocking poles.
Have you put your vid up?

 

[SpottedCat]

I think you worry too much - you look fine to me! Yes, the round would be improved if he was more off your leg and in a 'buzzier' canter, but if he's only a baby, these things take time....

Does he often land disunited like that? That is something I'd want to work on, because coupled with him being a bit slow off your leg it means you can't (as discussed on another thread!) get the power round the turn then sit to the fence.

 

[sam-b]

For me the canter def needs to be sharper and much more forward, and he needs to stay up and onto the bridle through turns. Very sweet horse tho

 

[Vindaloo]

Ha..! Thanks. I think I look really awkward and wobby in the video! I do try not to interfere with him much because it usually ends in him getting confused and knocking poles.
Have you put your vid up?

Hang on, i'll go and check how long I still have to wait.... 36 minutes apparently! Ha ha, this could be the longest and most boring can you cc me EVER. Think i'll leave the dinner cooking, have a shower and come back to it.

OH MY GOD! The gas lead just broke and i've had a fire in the kitchen I KID YOU NOT.

 

[charlie76]

Lovely horse! IMO the canter needs to be moved up a gear and you need to feel that he is more in front of the leg, esp when coming out of a corner. I imagine nerves play a part in underpowering the canter.
Work on moving the canter on and bringing it back without loosing power on the flat and work on alternating the amount of strides between two poles on the floor on a related distance to make sure he is adjustable in the canter.
My third and final point is that I think your stirrups look one or two holes too long.

I hope that helps- it wasn't horrid at all!

 

[squiz22]

I think you worry too much - you look fine to me! Yes, the round would be improved if he was more off your leg and in a 'buzzier' canter, but if he's only a baby, these things take time....

Does he often land disunited like that? That is something I'd want to work on, because coupled with him being a bit slow off your leg it means you can't (as discussed on another thread!) get the power round the turn then sit to the fence.

Thats seems to be a recent thing. I have been having more SJ lessons as this really is our weaker phase.He used to just land on the wrong leg and that was that but now he seems to land wrong but change at the front.. its like he's getting the gist of how to do it but theres an awfully long way way between his pea brain and back legs and the message isn't quite getting through. I know what you mean though and this is something we are trying to sort out at the moment. It feels like he's still weak and its all a lot of effort.

 

[squiz22]

Lovely horse! IMO the canter needs to be moved up a gear and you need to feel that he is more in front of the leg, esp when coming out of a corner. I imagine nerves play a part in underpowering the canter.
Work on moving the canter on and bringing it back without loosing power on the flat and work on alternating the amount of strides between two poles on the floor on a related distance to make sure he is adjustable in the canter.
My third and final point is that I think your stirrups look one or two holes too long.

I hope that helps- it wasn't horrid at all!

Nope not mean thank you!

Thats another good exercise I idea I shall give a go.

Short stirrups.. ekk.. I'll see how they feel a bit higher.. I'll look even more like a pea on a mountain! :b

 

[Baydale]

As lex2501 and charlie76 have already given you some good advice, I'd just add that teaching him to change legs over a pole on the ground is very useful and will help you hugely with your jumping rounds. Also don't spend too long doing one thing when you're schooling, keep him switched on mentally by changing pace, direction or whatever frequently enough to keep him listening to you without you having to nag him.

I'm much like lex2501 in a "do as I say, not as I do" way, so well done to you for posting something for us to cc - you can see how lovely and helpful forum folk can be when they're approached the right way.

 

[charlie76]

oh yes, forgot about him going disunited! I think you will find that as the canter becomes bigger and bolder he will not go disunited quite as much. He does it as he wants to offer a change but the power in the canter isn't good enough just yet- it will be- he is lovely!! Is he WB??

 

[squiz22]

oh yes, forgot about him going disunited! I think you will find that as the canter becomes bigger and bolder he will not go disunited quite as much. He does it as he wants to offer a change but the power in the canter isn't good enough just yet- it will be- he is lovely!! Is he WB??

I think thats it exactly. He's just learning to do it and he's trying!!

He's a kwpn dutch warmblood with Concorde lines. I bought him as the skinniest, runtiest little horse that was at the back of the field. The dealers were dutch and based up near Swindon and bought lots over from this stud in Aston, Holland. I'd gone to have a look at something else which I didn't think was right and they said they had this other one who they were yet to back. He was sold the moment I saw his face! He had the kindest most honest eyes. I turned him out for a long time to put some weight on him and let him grow up a it and have bought him on slowly. He's so honest and kind that I just want to do him justice!

 

[Supanova]

As others have said - a lovely horse and you just need to get a bit more canter, but he looks to be only young and therefore in the first half of the round he just looks a bit wobbly and babyish - it will come. He looks like he's really enjoying himself!

Regarding your upper body - i have the same problem! I used to watch videos of myself and couldn't believe how much my body rocked. In my case, the main cause is tight hips! Last couple of years i've really tried to relax my hips which enable them to take the flow of the movement not the upper body. Also I think my legs and hips used to act as a handbrake on the horse and actually as soon as i relaxed and stopped nagging so much - my horse went more forward (this has been something of a light bulb moment in the past few weeks and prompted from a thread on here!) Hope that helps a bit.