Old dogs- when do you know it’s time

[4faults]

I think I know what I need to do but I really need a hand hold 😢
I have a 10yo English Mastiff who’s age seems to have caught up with him all at once. He’s slowed down a lot in the last 6 months but this last week or so has really gone down hill.
He’s struggling to get up and has started crying in pain and frustration, he’s been dropping weight despite having a really good appetite and has been drinking a lot. He had cancer a couple of years ago and had his spleen removed, when they opened him up they said there were lesions on his liver and kidneys which they did the best they could to remove but said it’s likely to reoccur. We swore we wouldn’t put him through another operation and I don’t think he would survive it now anyway.
We took him to the vet on the 27th for his annual booster and mentioned all this, although he was fine getting up and down at that point, and they checked him over and just said he’s a big old dog who actually looks great for his age apart from arthritis in his hocks.
And I have just noticed blood dripping from his nose 😔 I have booked him an appointment for this evening. I’m probably right in thinking we’re going to be saying goodbye to our old friend aren’t I?

Sorry this turned out so long I think I just needed to write it all down

 

[meleeka]

Big hugs to you. I think you just need to get to the vet and decide there. Is he in medication for his hocks? There’s plenty they can do to help with that and the nosebleed could just be one of those things. Or it could be something else entirely. For me it’s the level of intervention needed. If they just want a blood test to diagnose I’d probably allow that, if you can get his arthritis managed. but I probably wouldn’t put him through much else. I think most vets will steer you to the right decision for the dog so it won’t necessarily be your decision. Having had an emergency visit with my old dog last night I can totally understand how you are feeling x

 

[Clodagh]

I find vets tend to sit on the fence slightly, I assume because of repercussions if they advise PTS, so I would observe him today and go with a clear idea of what is best for him tonight.
Personally, if I had a dog crying out in pain when it tried to stand he would be PTS immediately, let alone a nosebleed.
An awful time, poor old boy. Be strong for him.

 

[4faults]

We’re off to the vets tonight at 6.30 ☹️ He was on steroids for his arthritis but he has skin allergies and they were making them flare up terribly so he was moved onto yumove which helped for awhile. If they suggest blood tests I might go for that but honestly if he gets any worse today I can’t watch him suffer

 

[meleeka]

We’re off to the vets tonight at 6.30 ☹️ He was on steroids for his arthritis but he has skin allergies and they were making them flare up terribly so he was moved onto yumove which helped for awhile. If they suggest blood tests I might go for that but honestly if he gets any worse today I can’t watch him suffer

Mine’s on Onsior which is an NSAID. It sounds absolutely like you’ll know what to do so just trust yourself x

 

[JillA]

I was told by a vet years ago in answer to the same question that they deteriorate steadily but eventually they just go down hill really fast, as though they have fallen off the edge. I have found it to be so true and it sounds as though your old chap has fallen off the edge. Good luck at the vets - it is easier to go with treatment in mind then decide to let them just have an overdose of anaesthetic while you are there

 

[Alec Swan]

We’re off to the vets tonight at 6.30 ☹️ He was on steroids for his arthritis but he has skin allergies and they were making them flare up terribly so he was moved onto yumove which helped for awhile. If they suggest blood tests I might go for that but honestly if he gets any worse today I can’t watch him suffer

4faults, I genuinely feel for you. There is only one way to answer you and it's going to be blunt …. The time is now, you know that in your heart and your refusal to see the dog endure ANY further suffering shouldn't be in ANY way dissuaded by a vet who suggests stringing out the inevitable with pointless and invasive tests. Should you meet any resistance to what you know to be right, then take your dog to a vet who will comply with your wishes.

I apologise for being so direct, but I genuinely believe what I say to be in yours and your dog's best interest.

Alec.

 

[MotherOfChickens]

4faults, I am sorry-its so hard. I suspect strongly that if you suggest to your vet you feel the time has come they will be in agreement with you, they are generally reluctant to suggest it up front. a large dog struggling to get up to the point of vocalisation is time in my book but you are the one there with him and know him best.

they should be able to offer an in house blood test (results in 20 mins if they can do it in evening surgery) that will show anything obvious such as a recurrence of the cancer. I say this only to give you information and the option if it makes things easier for you either with dealing with the vet or to make a decision.

 

[meleeka]

4faults, I genuinely feel for you. There is only one way to answer you and it's going to be blunt …. The time is now, you know that in your heart and your refusal to see the dog endure ANY further suffering shouldn't be in ANY way dissuaded by a vet who suggests stringing out the inevitable with pointless and invasive tests. Should you meet any resistance to what you know to be right, then take your dog to a vet who will comply with your wishes.

I apologise for being so direct, but I genuinely believe what I say to be in yours and your dog's best interest.

Alec.

This makes me genuinely grateful for my vet. He gives me my options and follows with “if it were my dog ...” which is always a huge help and is usually the most conservative treatment option (and the cheapest!)

 

[Sandstone1]

I'm sorry but no one should advise you without knowing and seeing the dog.
Its really only you that can decide. There are things that can help the arthritis.
The nosebleeds could be something or nothing.
If it was my dog i wouldn't go for invasive tests or anything that needed a general anaesthetic at his stage but I would go for bloods.
If he's not on painkillers at the moment I'd probably give that a try.

 

[splashgirl45]

so sorry you are going through this, you know him best and need to decide if his quality of life is good. from your post i would say not at the moment...if your vet can give some pain relief to make him comfortable that may be worth a try but otherwise better to call it a day before he gets any worse. my lurcher had arthritis in her hips and the pain relief didnt help so i PTS...i know it was the right thing to do....

 

[CorvusCorax]

I usually make the decision once the dog cannot get up unaided or does so with difficulty, it is hard for the larger breeds to bear their own weight when they are in pain. Thinking of you, it's not easy and he's a great age for a big dog.

 

[Chiffy]

Oh dear, so sorry, it’s the last kindness we can do for them. I hope you let him go, you have done so well keeping a big dog to this age.
Don’t expect the Vet to suggest it first but he/she will more than likely agree with you. The decision is yours.
Thinking of you and sending a hug.

 

[Annette4]

It would appear I still can’t read these types of threads without getting teary but I didn’t want to read and run.

If they don’t have the quality of life they once had and are struggling or distressed I would (and recently have) made the decision. For me, a week too early is better than a day too late and I would hate for them to suffer because I’m too selfish to let them go.

 

[Sheep]

So sorry to hear that your old dog is unwell.
We lost our 13 year old Lab back in March. Our vet gave us a "quality of life" questionnaire which really helped us evaluate how he was and helped us objectively understand that it was time to let him go. Might be worth discussing with your vet. Wishing you and your dog all the very best.

 

[Sheep]

double post

 

[Pearlsasinger]

So sorry to hear that your old dog is unwell.
We lost our 13 year old Lab back in March. Our vet gave us a "quality of life" questionnaire which really helped us evaluate how he was and helped us objectively understand that it was time to let him go. Might be worth discussing with your vet. Wishing you and your dog all the very best.

What a good idea!

OP, I wouldn't want to keep a dog which cried out in pain when putting any weight on its joints. It is never an easy decision to make but you have done the best you can for him all his life - and 10 yrs isn't a bad age for such a big dog, it sounds as if now is the time to do him the final kindness. I wonder why the vet didn't prescribe Metacam in place of the steroids.
Wishing you strength for your appointment.

 

[{97702}]

Sorry to read this 4faults, I would definitely be letting him go if he were mine - he is showing all the signs that he doesn't have sufficient quality of life for me Believe me, I've been there many times and I know how hard it is - thinking of you xxx

 

[pippixox]

I hope what ever decision you made this evening you felt was the right one.
I would always try to go for the theory 'better a day too early than a day too late'. We did this with our boy with cancer (terminal) we could of kept him going perhaps a few months more but didn't want more suffering.

I was in a horrible situation this year of dog sitting my mum in laws dogs. One was very old and they said he had had a few funny turns. He had been failing in site and hearing for years but pottered around. But the last few months he was not happy but they refused to do anything about it. Sadly while they were away I arrived one morning to find him struggling to breath and unable to get up (huge columber spaniel) so I knew I had to get him to a vet and make the hard decision to say good bye. It was horrible. He should of gone peacefully months earlier at home instead of the scary emergency

 

[meleeka]

Just logged on to see if there was an update and to send you many virtual hugs (())

 

[4faults]

We took him in and he actually looked a lot perkier which didn’t help to be honest. We have done bloods and are waiting for the results, he’s given him some pain killers but he agrees with us that it’s probably the best call as he’s gone downhill so fast. We have booked an appointment for Friday and OH is taking the day off so we can give him a good pamper day. Going to spend the next couple of days cuddling him and making him tasty dinners. Thank you for your responses everyone, I really needed the hand hold. He’s my dog of a lifetime and has been my best friend and protector for the last 10 years. I don’t know know what I will do without him

 

[Clodagh]

Sounds like a plan, the waiting to see is the worst, have some quality time with your boy.

 

[Bearsmum]

Hugs, it's so hard making the right decision, where you don't put them through unnecessary treatment, but do enough to feel you've given them the best chance.

We called a day on treatment for our old girl before Christmas & she spent the last evening contentedly cuddled up with me on the sofa. Enjoy your time with him, whatever the future brings, it's hardest for us owners.

JDx

 

[Cinnamontoast]

Crying in pain would make me decide, I think. Such a horrible decision and the worst part of being a dog owner. My old boy always makes a liar of me at the vet’s, adrenaline kicks in and he looks fab.

Courage, ma belle.

 

[splashgirl45]

hope all goes well on friday . good luck

 

[Pearlsasinger]

IME, they often do perk up with the extra stimulation of being somewhere different - unless they are particularly anxious about going to the vet. I hope that the pain relief is effective and that you get some answers by Friday.

 

[4faults]

THANK you so much for your support everyone. His results came back and showed the cancer has returned. There have been many tears shed and lots of cuddles, bought him lots of tasty food and treats and we’re taking him for a last beach trip before the appointment on Friday ��

 

[Clodagh]

THANK you so much for your support everyone. His results came back and showed the cancer has returned. There have been many tears shed and lots of cuddles, bought him lots of tasty food and treats and we’re taking him for a last beach trip before the appointment on Friday ��

So sad, but at least it is now a cut and dried decision. I hope he has a lovely beach outing.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

I'm sorry to hear your news but at least now you know. You really have done well to get such a big dog to 10 yrs old. I hope you can all enjoy your beach trip and spoiling him until the next appointment.

 

[Alec Swan]

…. . His results came back and showed the cancer has returned. ….

Coupled to a huge dose of kindness and understanding, what sort of response would help you reach a decision?

I'm really sorry, it's a bitch and we all know that, but for how long will you draw out the inevitable, or would you prefer that I said nothing?

Alec ……..