Old Fashioned Horsemanship

Irishlife

Irishlife

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Reading all this Parelli vs Monty stuff is really interesting , I have watched a few You Tube things and frankly it is in some ways commonsense horsemanship re-packaged.

The join up for example is something that has happened quite naturally always. My latest example was a two year old untouched filly in a field that we needed to catch so my daughter started jogging around the field, the filly started trotting and trotting away from my daughter and cantering and bucking and when she approached my daughter she just kept jogging and clapped her hands at the filly. When she stopped the filly cautiously came over to her then followed her back to where I was by the gate we then scratched and petted her with a few apple slices and then quietly put the headcollar on. It was a wonderful experience.

When I first learned to ride, I spent the first year on the lunge because "The horses mouth is sacred and a gift to be earned" this was according to my old fashioned riding teacher and of course she meant an independent and balanced seat is critical before you can harmoniously interact with a horse.

Pony Club was miraculous albeit in a para military sort of way and we would stand to attention reciting the points of the horse be able to describe everything from thrush to epizootic staggers. But tack was cleaned, boxes were mucked out, you knew how to keep a pony at grass and stabled and by 13 or 14 you had usually broken in your first pony. I suppose discipline was quite strict then and basic horsemanship was about elbow grease, an eye for a horse, its condition and fitness and it always came first.

So what is my point? Errrrr I think basic principles will always be basic principles but they do seem to be lacking in a lot of areas and it is a pity that non ridden basics are not perpetuated through riding schools etc....

*****Prepares to be slaughtered************
 
I agree! I remember when I was a kid we used to do all the manky jobs round the yard and got roared at if it was not good enough. We had to ride without reins and stirrups, and we were not allowed whips until we were fairly competent.

I never recall bargy horses either, they all led nicely and picked feet up.

I sound really old, but I'm not! Common sense horsemanship - bring it back!!
 
I think too many riding schools spend too much time giving donkey rides to children in stead of breaking it down into intesting and useful sections during a lesson, for example correct handling, riding and how to look after a horse etc, this in its self teaches common sense, safety and what owning a horse is all about and of cours its all fun.

sorry stayed of subject there but when parents are paying good money to send there young children to riding schools and all they do is walk around a round....not only is it a waste of money but it must bore those poor ponies to death.

As my dad used to say, ''your meant to go to a riding school to learn how to fall off, not how to ride'' which in itself teaches you how to ride :D
 
I agree...I blame my floor OCD on pony club.....I can be seen raking the yard in high winds like an absolute arse....because I MUST SWEEP UP.:eek:

I also am not physically able to ride until ALL stable chores have been done......I just can't do it:confused:

My 7yo doesnt do pony club etc....but she can strip and clean her tack and tell me where I'm going wrong:o
 
i completely agree, it shocks me to see the standards that some people, particularly younguns have.

i'm doing an NVQ and the course relies on yard protocol (it gives you a practical qualiication and asseses you over time performing tasks on a yard) however it doesn't teach you what i would consider to be the very basic standards ie. not using a body brush on a horse that lives out 24/7, not feeding them titbits etc!
 
poppymoo said:
I agree...I blame my floor OCD on pony club.....I can be seen raking the yard in high winds like an absolute arse....because I MUST SWEEP UP.:eek:
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Lol I'm glad I'm not the only one with Pony Club / fierce ex-military riding instructor induced OCD! I have to wash the bit and clean my tack every time I ride.
 
I completely agree. My Grandfather taught my mother, who taught me to train/handle horses with due regard to their body language & mine. I was taught - amongst others by Jo Knowles who was very old school & correct whilst also teaching most of the principles of natural (once called correct) horsemanship, which has since been ripped off & marketed by a bunch of loony fanatics.
And like many of the rest of you, many of my PC trainers were army types & terrifying.
 
I remember an old boy telling me, years ago (so this happened probably pre WW1!) that he was 4 when he got his first pony, his Dad took him to a field in the middle of town (now many houses) and said 'see that bay pony over there, that's going to be your pony, now just walk towards her shoulder keeping your eye on her eye, she will walk away but keep her walking until she puts her head down and starts to eat, then turn around and walk back here to me and she will follow you because she will have chosen to be yours'.

So there's nothing new in these methods!
 
Dare I say it's a sign of the times and good old fashioned discipline is lacking in general life never mind the horse world - People these days want everything for nothing :(

I like good old fashioned horse sense - was brought up with it and always will do! :)
Kate x
 
I agree, everthing now a days seem to be quike fix, ready made ponies,dressage, mainly dressage and showjumpers that are expected to win no matter what the jockey's capable of. and things have got complete out of hand rugs wise, what happened to the simple NZ rug and the stable jute rug and blankets. I have so many rugs the washing bill is nearly as big as my mortgage was per month. but over the years I do think we have lost that special knowledge and Parellie? and such like won't bring it back
 
H's mum said:
Dare I say it's a sign of the times and good old fashioned discipline is lacking in general life never mind the horse world - People these days want everything for nothing :(

I like good old fashioned horse sense - was brought up with it and always will do! :)
Kate x
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I couldn't have put it better myself H's Mum!!
 
Irishlife said:
When I first learned to ride, I spent the first year on the lunge because "The horses mouth is sacred and a gift to be earned" this was according to my old fashioned riding teacher and of course she meant an independent and balanced seat is critical before you can harmoniously interact with a horse.
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That should be written in 3' high flashing neon lights imho. i've never heard it but it is SOOOO true.

i used to teach a lady and was continually reminding her to be soft and elastic with her arms and hands. she'd previously been taught for quite a while by a BHS guy who had won some big Instructors' Award and she told me that he'd insisted that "a strong contact is always better than a light one, if you can't manage to be consistent"... this is so so WRONG that i was almost speechless.
(i told her that a light contact, and working on your seat, and grabbing mane or neckstrap if necessary, was far better than hanging on by the reins (which she did, fwiw)).
poor horses. :( :(
 
Irishlife, I loved your post, took me right back. I feel very sorry for anyone learning now, they have no chance of the fun and blisters we had while we strived for anywhere near the perfection the old teachers demanded.
 
I am extremely grateful to the years of being made to ride without stirrups and reins and the bareback jumping I did as a kid - comes in very helpful when my horse sets off fly leaping as yet another horse eating pheasant flies out of the maize.
 
I couldn't agree more. I think at least half the time I spent at my local riding school was dismounted - we learned stable management, horse care and welfare, first aid, tack stripping and cleaning, etc, etc. We caught, groomed, tacked up, untacked, fed and turned out again all as part of 'learning to ride'. The RS owner had a bit of a name locally for taking on other people's problem horses - those of us who she judged to be capable were awarded the dubious honour of riding these horses! So we also learned to cope with buckers, rearers and bolters ... Our PC was very old-school and the rallies were quite terrifying but goodness, did we learn a lot!
 
Irishlife said:
Reading all this Parelli vs Monty stuff is really interesting , I have watched a few You Tube things and frankly it is in some ways commonsense horsemanship re-packaged.
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I have said this for a long time. There is always something to be learned from these methods BUT a lot of it will have been learned if you have spent any amount of time around horses, have a certain amount of instinct for being around animals and also have a variety of good 'tutors'. Neither Parelli nor Monty should be treated like a bible but on the other hand we should always keep an open mind.

I suppose not everyone is confident enough to believe in their own ability and feel they need someone or something to follow - as long as it is not to the exclusion of any other ideas then I can't see there is too much harm in it.

l
 
I absolutely agree too. I think a lot of aspects of horsemanship whether it be riding or caring for horses is best the 'old fashioned way'. Good old common sense and compassion go a long way.
Obviously things like veterinary science changes with the times and should be embraced but looking around, I can't help but notice how many people don't know the fundamentals - knowledge that's readily available from good books and knowledgable, usually older people. I think it's about time everyone got back to basics and I'm glad somebody finally brought the subject up!
 
Thank the Lord there are still plenty of 'sensible' horse people out there!
When I first started to ride, like many, many others, I spent the whole day at the riding school doing various jobs with no payment, the joy of being around ponies was payment enough! So from a very young age I learnt the value of time management, team work and the importance of getting the job done properly or you would be in for it with the Instructor (who was truely terrifying to a 8yr old!). What a pity today's children are denied this fantastic opportunity.
 
Does this make me (at 16...) old fashioned too? :o I agree with all of the above (:

Though I think a lot of my 'horse sense' must have been self taught, as we weren't allowed to spend much time on the yard at the first riding school I went to, but I always used to get left the jobs at the second so I just got on with them! Didn't seem fair that horses would have to come back to filthy stables - so I cleaned them. Always hated filthy yards - so yard got swept (I have yard sweeping OCD though and frequently sweep the ENTIRE yard, no matter how filthy it is as we're only supposed to do our 'own sections' :o) And I have a tack cleaning obsession that also involves going round tack rooms running up stirrups, straightening girths & saddlecloths and putting bridles away properly.... :D And manky water containers? CLEANED!!

I left the last riding school I went to because I got frustrated with the instructor who after taking over the school developed the mentality of 'if we don't teach them to ride, they wont be able to get their own horses and leave' O.o So I took my horse elsewhere, even though beforehand, it was an amazing school :(

So not all of us kids are lazy little brats with ready made ponies :p (I've only ever had 4/5yr olds really...!)
 
Yes but! kids are not allowed to work for free any more and you have to have massive insurance, health and safety and God knows what. I loved it when I was a little one, helping to groom and tack up and the joy being chosen to ride ponies back to field, bareback at end of day, Bliss! And I have found most kids that come to me ,don't like getting dirty, wet weather, or snow or the cold, mucking out and turn up when they feel like it and get a bit shirty when I say don't need them. I'd turn up in a snowstorm when I was a kid. So no wonder Parrillie are earning millions as it's the young ones (20-35) or so that want fast fixes
 
In the good old pre indoor arena days, if the weather was truely atrocious then we were given stable management lessons.
I spent hours riding without stirrups and without a saddle. I still can't bear to see straw or shavings in a tail and unless on a native I hate unpulled, unbanged tails or straggley manes.
Dirty bits drive me positively nuts especially on the bridles of horses belonging to equine students and don't get me started on messy muckheaps. The muckheap is the barometer of the yard a messy muckheap or one made up largely of clean straw and clean shavings is a no no.
And the basic rules of feeding do still actually apply!!!!!!!
 
I have so enjoyed this thread. I have yard OCD: I can't bear an untidy muck-heap, unswept yards (like a nail on a chalk board, ugh) and couldn't understand why I was the one who got the strange look for washing the bit at the end of my lesson!

Don't get me started on reins not secured with the throatlash when not in use (so at risk of being dragged across the yard, tripped on, caught up) and headcollars left dangling from lead ropes still tied to bindertwine, sweaty numnahs left rucked up under saddles on pegs after use, in fact messy tackrooms altogether, ooh I could go on and on!

So glad I'm not alone, had begun to think I was being unreasonable!
 
I'm a grumpy old woman in training :p

I quite like MR,mainly because what I have seen of him has been horse-sense and logic which both seem to be getting lost!
But no one way can ever be the only correct way,the BHS/pony club is a fantastic all round base of horse education as long as the person then keeps an open mind about what different trainers have to say.


Also very glad to find out I'm not the only one who HAS to have a squeaky clean tack room and yard floor :o
 
johnrobert said:
Yes but! kids are not allowed to work for free any more and you have to have massive insurance, health and safety and God knows what. I loved it when I was a little one, helping to groom and tack up and the joy being chosen to ride ponies back to field, bareback at end of day, Bliss! And I have found most kids that come to me ,don't like getting dirty, wet weather, or snow or the cold, mucking out and turn up when they feel like it and get a bit shirty when I say don't need them. I'd turn up in a snowstorm when I was a kid. So no wonder Parrillie are earning millions as it's the young ones (20-35) or so that want fast fixes
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Totally agree - children working for free was the backbone of the average riding school 20 years ago and, yes they were probably exploited but owning your own horse is hard work and you need to be prepared and the knowledge gained was priceless.
 
Alogaki said:
I have so enjoyed this thread. I have yard OCD: I can't bear an untidy muck-heap, unswept yards (like a nail on a chalk board, ugh) and couldn't understand why I was the one who got the strange look for washing the bit at the end of my lesson!

Don't get me started on reins not secured with the throatlash when not in use (so at risk of being dragged across the yard, tripped on, caught up) and headcollars left dangling from lead ropes still tied to bindertwine, sweaty numnahs left rucked up under saddles on pegs after use, in fact messy tackrooms altogether, ooh I could go on and on!

So glad I'm not alone, had begun to think I was being unreasonable!
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I think we must have been twins separated at birth!

I can also add leg straps not clipped up before removing a turnout rug and rugs not being folded up when taken off and don't get me going on rugs being taken off and dumped on the floor ...
 
Recently i saw someone doing Parelli demo and everyone else seemed so impressed. But i have to say i really wasn't. The lady doing it was lovely and she was showing she had a great parntership with her horse, and that was lovely to see. BUT i just simple wasn't impressed with it, as i keep thinking. If you do your normal management with a bit of old fashion common sense and a bit of horsemanship. You're horse will do most of the stuff she showed us....... eg walking over plastic sheeting, not walk into humans space, following you, free running on lunge etc... etc.... How many of us on here can play 'peek a boo' with our horses in field :) :) or follow the my leader - i can and i bet loads can on here.

I think now days there are so many poelpe who want quick easy fixs to everything, and wants to not do alearning curve or knuckle down and do some hard work.... ****waddles off **** grumbling to myself!!!!
 
johnrobert said:
Yes but! kids are not allowed to work for free any more and you have to have massive insurance, health and safety and God knows what. I loved it when I was a little one, helping to groom and tack up and the joy being chosen to ride ponies back to field, bareback at end of day, Bliss! And I have found most kids that come to me ,don't like getting dirty, wet weather, or snow or the cold, mucking out and turn up when they feel like it and get a bit shirty when I say don't need them. I'd turn up in a snowstorm when I was a kid. So no wonder Parrillie are earning millions as it's the young ones (20-35) or so that want fast fixes
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I was going to ask about kids being allowed to work at riding schools nowadays. Is it still done? I started riding at 9 and spent Saturdays for the next few years at the riding school, for nothing of course - we paid for our morning lesson and then spent the rest of the day sweeping, making up haynets, cleaning tack, mucking out and so on. Only after you'd proved yourself were you allowed the "luxury" of bringing in the turned out ponies at the end of the day and doing a bit of grooming! I also spent a lot of time doing much the same at a rescue centre, only without the riding. This was even after I got my own pony.

Looking back now, yes, it was slave labour I guess but as others have said, it was absolutely invaluable in learning the ropes. I'm the only one on our yard now who can lay a bed or twist up a lead rope properly.

By the way, at the age of 32 I don't really count myself as such a "young one" - but Parelli and the likes, I wouldn't touch with a bargepole!
 
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