Owner of yard bossiness

[AShetlandBitMeOnce]

It's about time that full livery yards were dragged kicking and screaming into the 21st century of customer service.

That would also come with the 21st Century pricing, to enable them to pay 21st century wages.. A couple full liveries areound here are £750pcm+ with a nice school and stables etc but nothing incredible - I couldn't ever imagine having that much disposable.

 

[The Xmas Furry]

A couple full liveries areound here are £750pcm+ with a nice school and stables etc but nothing incredible - I couldn't ever imagine having that much disposable.

2 or 3 locally are around £900/1000 pcm for full, plus schooling on top. Those yards are full, rarely have spaces and highly thought of too.

 

[Winters100]

I would just move.

Different yards suit different people. One close to us is famous for having a lot of rules, I know one lady who felt that the rules were terrible and curtailed her enjoyment, but my friend who is there likes it, and feels that the rules make for good order. Better to move, but don't rubbish the yard, you never know when you might want to go back. If anyone asks why you moved just find a credible reason (new yard is nearer home, cheaper, has bigger paddocks or arena) and leave it at that.

It does sound a bit surprising to me that they charged you for removing a poop from your box when you are on full livery, but anyway this yard clearly does not suit you, so better to look for something more to your liking.

 

[Keith_Beef]

The one place here (just across the street) whose prices I could find published on the web charges €630 p.c.m including taxes for full livery (hard feed three times a day, hay twice a day, straw bedding, mucking out, but no turn-out), plus €120 p.a. for use of the arena.

 

[AShetlandBitMeOnce]

2 or 3 locally are around £900/1000 pcm for full, plus schooling on top. Those yards are full, rarely have spaces and highly thought of too.

oh no shade to those yards at all, justified price and highly thought of yards.. my post was more musing that that would never be within my reach. I think even if I had that level of disposable income I would feel guilty for the lost potential of that money if I were to invest it into an income generating asset. Lucky people who can use them, the pay off of good facilities and a YO who (hopefully) has common sense!

 

[luckyoldme]

oh no shade to those yards at all, justified price and highly thought of yards.. my post was more musing that that would never be within my reach. I think even if I had that level of disposable income I would feel guilty for the lost potential of that money if I were to invest it into an income generating asset. Lucky people who can use them, the pay off of good facilities and a YO who (hopefully) has common sense!

I get what you are saying entirely.
On one hand people need to be paid decent money for their services but on the other hand how many people could actually afford to pay
£900 a month ?
Then there's the elephant in the room that no one ever in the history of the h and h forum ever mentions....
How much money changes hands for 'livery' which is cash in hand and what impact does this have on the liveries who are running legitimate businesses?

 

[Shilasdair]

Agreed, but then some would also then need to charge 21st century prices and pay 21st century wages.......

I'd pay for decent full livery...but YOs get greedy.
Every month you pay the agreed amount, but the quality of care diminishes (no grooming, no feet picked out, injuries unnoticed, not enough bed or hay given).
And then you end up in that horrible place of either feeling bad because you are paying for a service that you are not receiving (mug!) or having to make a fuss and then feel bad because they hate you.

 

[The Xmas Furry]

I'd pay for decent full livery...but YOs get greedy.
Every month you pay the agreed amount, but the quality of care diminishes (no grooming, no feet picked out, injuries unnoticed, not enough bed or hay given).
And then you end up in that horrible place of either feeling bad because you are paying for a service that you are not receiving (mug!) or having to make a fuss and then feel bad because they hate you.

See my post #32
2 of those yards have been running for more than 30 years.

 

[Shilasdair]

See my post #32
2 of those yards have been running for more than 30 years.

I appreciate that money is a limiting factor for many people - but not for everyone.
The reason I do mine on DIY is not financial - it's because when I did try full livery, I was coming up at 5pm to find they had no hay left ('oh, they're pigs') and were being left that way until 11am the next day. The worst of it was, it was MY hay so not even a cost to the yard- they just couldn't be bothered filling the net full. And of course they brought mine in at 2pm ish so they could get home early.

 

[Christmascinnamoncookie]

Don’t think the OP is riding, I read it that she’s been doing groundwork as opposed to riding ie using the arena in a non traditional manner.

You’re meant to enjoy your hobbies. Move.

 

[Shilasdair]

Don’t think the OP is riding, I read it that she’s been doing groundwork as opposed to riding ie using the arena in a non traditional manner.

You’re meant to enjoy your hobbies. Move.

Absolutely this, OP. Take your horse (and your livery money) to someone who appreciates you.

 

[MiJodsR2BlinkinTite]

Agreed, but then some would also then need to charge 21st century prices and pay 21st century wages.......

^^^^ EXACTLY!!! People want "champagne" standard livery; but are only prepared to pay "lemonade" prices.......

 

[Shilasdair]

^^^^ EXACTLY!!! People want "champagne" standard livery; but are only prepared to pay "lemonade" prices.......

Some people, perhaps. But other industries are also price sensitive and still manage to make money whilst paying staff acceptable wages. There's so much waste in yards - particularly hay. If you weigh your hay/feed, for example, then you seldom have to throw it away.

 

[saddlesore]

Wow ? they’re clearly insane and hate you for some reason or other. Just leave ASAP.

 

[Arzada]

^^^^ EXACTLY!!! People want "champagne" standard livery; but are only prepared to pay "lemonade" prices.......

How much is the OP paying?

 

[Shilasdair]

How much is the OP paying?

I don't think we know.

 

[Flicker]

Good customer service doesn’t have to be expensive though. Even a very basic yard can have sensible rules, consistently applied, which seems to be the core of the OP‘s beef with this yard.

In my experience, many YOs tend to be people who have their own horses and a bit of land and some stables, and think they can spread the cost of their own hobby by having other people paying to keep their horses there. Then they get resentful of people always being on their land and in their space, and their home stops feeling like home, and they impose all these rules to try to regain control. Or YOs don’t manage the yard at all, and delegate to a YM who has some authority but not necessarily enough, or enough skill or experience, to manage conflict.

What does mount up cost-wise is employing good staff. Paying terrible wages is not going to attract sensible, customer-minded, professional staff - they’ll go to a well-paid job and do horses as a hobby. So a lot of yards either employ inexperienced staff, or staff who know the YO, or staff who are there because there is nowhere better to be.

 

[Christmascinnamoncookie]

I doubt yard grooms are paid loads, but ours genuinely loves the horses, knows them inside out, goes above and beyond and is a lovely person too. I’m not on full livery, I don’t want to afford it, but if I were, I’d be confident in the standards.

 

[Shilasdair]

Good point, Flicker.
And then, they start the 'This is my HOME' whining routine - no, it's not, it's your place of business. You decided to start the business, take the liveries' money - and you can't decide that it's your HOME and you don't want them there whilst still collecting the cash.

 

[Shilasdair]

I should add that I respect the privacy of YOs - I think I've gone to the door of my current YO's house once in 15 years for a water main bursting.

But the yard itself is not their 'home' in the same way - they are effectively renting it to all their liveries.

 

[MagicMelon]

Theres not really any advice anyone can give other than leave. You cant argue with her, she sounds totally unreasonable. Id definately move.

 

[flying_high]

I appreciate that money is a limiting factor for many people - but not for everyone.
The reason I do mine on DIY is not financial - it's because when I did try full livery, I was coming up at 5pm to find they had no hay left ('oh, they're pigs') and were being left that way until 11am the next day. The worst of it was, it was MY hay so not even a cost to the yard- they just couldn't be bothered filling the net full. And of course they brought mine in at 2pm ish so they could get home early.

On the flip side mine is on 7 day part livery, but I do a lot of the work myself. However I find it a lot less stressful than being away with work / stuck in important work meetings when something is needed urgently. I also dont worry about my horse every being left out alone. Yard will deal with vet / farrier / physio etc if I cannot be there. Yard do the basics everyday, and I pick up the extras and do bits and pieces myself.

I found DIY livery swaps amongst liveries tricky, as was paying for assisted services. I have a memory of a long running abscess and being away with work 4 hours away, and no amount I offered to pay the morning or evening grooms were they interested in changing a poultice. (I called in a favour with a friend not at the yard, horse was not tricky).

I still go up every day on 7 day part livery as I like oversight, I am currently going up twice a day, as hand walking and hand grazing twice a day as part of rehab.

Having livery versus DIY also means I can chose a yard further away and select for desirables like well draining winter fields, grass not too rich, 16 hours turnout a day, safe plentiful off road hacking etc.

Though currently with the handwalking and rehab I am cursing the distance (I could pay for the handwalking, but I am a bit of a control freak re handwalking my box rest horse myself).

Not to say I havent done DIY / Assisted DIY and wouldnt again if I found a good local set up.

 

[AShetlandBitMeOnce]

I guess the DIY vs Part argument all depends primarily on the YO and secondarily on what people can afford.

 

[little_critter]

Prob

I find this extraordinary and how often it crops up on here about livery owners that shout and berate their clients! Is this normal yard owner practice these days? Why do any of you who have this problem allow it to continue? Do you allow people in other walks of life holler at you and boss you around, or is it purely a horse yard acceptable way to treat paying clients?

Not just directed at you Bernster, but your post made me think yet again, how often this seems to be the case at livery yards.

Probably because the response if you raised it as an issue would be "you know where the door is" and relocating horses isn't always quick and easy to do depending on your horses, your location and your wallet.

 

[Mrs. Jingle]

Prob

Probably because the response if you raised it as an issue would be "you know where the door is" and relocating horses isn't always quick and easy to do depending on your horses, your location and your wallet.

Well obviously - but it still beggars belief that these yard owners still manage to keep a client base that is enough to make a living if they are so damn rude and quite psychotic in a lot of cases. But I would have thought if someone is treating you that offensively on a regular basis you would for the most part be looking elsewhere and getting on the list there and the minute a place came up on a decent yard you would move?

Or perhaps there just aren't enough decent yards run by normal human beings to go round. And maybe that is because people expect too much for too little payment to keep the decent ones in business? Its all a bit of a merry go round I think, and unfortunately lack of decent run yards that are paid appropriate livery charges by their clients is leaving the psychotic livery owners free too abuse all that are unfortunate enough to be stuck with their yard.

 

[Kat]

Lots of yards don't like loose schooling, in the school or using jumping poles for loose schooling because it messes up the surface and damages poles for those who want to school.

 

[Caol Ila]

I tolerated a YO who would yell and berate liveries for a lot longer than I should have done, and oy, would he play favourites. Egregiously. Like doing favors for liveries he liked but refusing to do the same things for people he didn't like. Totally unprofessional. But my horse malfunctioned if the yard juju wasn't suitable, and she had to be in individual turn-out. Yards offering that are slim pickins' around here. I would go through phases of yard hunting on and off over about a seven year period, but often wind up nowhere. At the grumpy yard, my horse did not fencewalk at all in their summer turn-out, and her fencewalking was controllable and predictable-ish in their winter turnout, which was better than it being totally out of control. It felt like it was the best I could do for a while. It's all well and good saying, "Just move," but sometimes not so easy.

 

[MiJodsR2BlinkinTite]

Good point, Flicker.
And then, they start the 'This is my HOME' whining routine - no, it's not, it's your place of business. You decided to start the business, take the liveries' money - and you can't decide that it's your HOME and you don't want them there whilst still collecting the cash.

^^^ This isn't the way I run my yard!! Never have done. This is a BAD YO!! My yard and my dwelling are on top of each other and I share my yard with my liveries. If there's a problem (and we all hope there isn't!!) then I can help if I can, such as yesterday when one of my liveries was "pinged" and had to go off and be tested and had to stay away from the yard - and I was only too happy to see to her dear old boy for her as well as feed her cat which she keeps at the yard too!!

I don't see a livery as being "in my space", not ever. Yes it is my home as well as "my" yard, but we all share the yard, and share each others' joys and sorrows too. That's the way it is. I've been doing livery for very nearly 30yrs now and the last thing I want is an unpleasant atmosphere on my doorstep! The last livery I had stayed for 10 years and I was able to watch her sweet little family go to "leading rein", "first ridden", then off to Pony Club and shows where the rosettes started coming in! We've shared our sorrows too where we have had to say goodbye to our lovely horses and have been able to stand with each other and support. Sadly they left but it was wonderful seeing this happening under my nose!! Yes there ARE bad liveries AND bad YO's, that is an undisputed fact sadly. Which is why my counsel to the OP would be to get rid of the "livery" she/they have and to get someone who will bring peace to their dwelling & yard.

 

[Caol Ila]

Since joining this forum, I've thought MiJods' yard sounded lovely. Just very, very far away.

 

[Mrs. Jingle]

Since joining this forum, I've thought MiJods' yard sounded lovely. Just very, very far away.

For most of my life I have been lucky enough to keep my horses at home, but I have to say even I would be tempted to go on livery at MiJod's yard! ?