Planning Problem - justify me a field shelter

[CazD]

Hubby and I own a 2 acre paddock on which there are two wooden stables which were there when we purchased about 4 years ago. The stables have planning permission. We would like to add a field shelter to the paddock but have hit a problem with the planning dept :banghead: We are in an Area of Outstanding Natural Beauty so the planners are never keen anyway but they have written and said they are minded to refuse our application as we already have stables unless we can justify the need for a field shelter. There is no natural shade/shelter at the field but apart from that, what else can I say?
On a different note, they have said that as we have "equestrian equipment" at the site we will need to make a further application for change of use. I think they are possibly talking about the two jumps we have at the bottom of the paddock. So .... if I agree to remove the jumps can I get out of needing to make the change of use application?

 

[*hic*]

You could look into the possibility of a mobile shelter.

You could submit detailed plans for a pleasant looking building in the local vernacular.

You could cite animal welfare.

You could get at last 5 sheep for every horse and claim that you are agricultural and need a lambing shed.

Second point:

You could just remove the jumps.

You could get the 5 sheep per horse and claim that the jumps are part of the fencing - or to provide scratching posts for the sheep. Mine absolutely trash the jumps!

 

[Shilasdair]

I agree with jemima_too...as I have always been led to believe that mobile field shelters (which are usually on a metal 'sled' design) don't require planning.
I could be wrong though.
S

 

[CazD]

Thanks for the reply. According to the council, as we are in an AONB we still need planning for a mobile shelter. We have already tried submitting an agricultural permission but the council say we do not have enough land to qualify as an agricultural holding.
Regarding the second point, what I was really asking was IF I remove the jumps will that be good enough, or is the fact I have already "committed the crime" enough for them to force me to make a change of use application

 

[*hic*]

I don't know about the change of use, it depends on what they are like and how much they like you and what they've had for breakfast that morning.

Only justification is welfare and that you have 2 stables and more than two horses.

Then if you get plans for a properly designed and attractive building they may be minded to approve.

If you only have two horses is there no way you can leave the stables for them to come in and out? Even if you have to modify the fronts of the stables?

I'm afraid my horses are out on a very windswept field with absolutely no shelter or shade. There's not a lot I can do about that but they don't seem to mind at all. Two of them have been out 24/7 over the entire winter, with rugs.

 

[snaffle]

IF you go to redmire stables web site, there is a section about field shelters and a planning appeal which may be of use, IIRC that was in an AONB.

 

[reynold]

have a look on the DEFRA website at the horse welfare official requirements - there may be a paragraph or 3 in that you could use for horse welfare requirements. i.e. quote the gov. back at the planners.

remove the jumps

you could be agricultural on 2 acres as iirc you can apply for Single Farm Payment on anything over half a hectare (and one ha. is about 2.5 acres)

don't get sheep - with bluetongue around they will be nothing but a nuisance - similarly goats

AONBs do often require PP for mobile shelters - you aren't alone in that problem

also look at land management requirements for the application - ie. you wish to manage the land correctly (so that it does justice to the AONB) and therefore you use half theland near the stables part of the year and use the stables as shelter then - however when you want to rest that part of the land you need similar shelter on the other part of the land

additionally put together a brief land management plan to show what you are getting at

 

[CazD]

Thanks for that Reynold. Will pop off and check out the DEFRA website. Weirdly we do get single farm payment for the land - but after leading us down the garden path re Agricultural PP the Council then rejected our application as not being suitable for agricultural PP as we do not own enough land - cant remember now but we needed to have around 15 acres to qualify

 

[reynold]

Under GPDO 1995 (general permitted development order 1995) if you have less than 5 ha. of agricultural land you can only "alter or extend" an existing barn or structure by up to 10% of it's capacity and that extension has to be within 20metres of the existing structure

if you have over 5 ha of land you can "construct a new barn or alter or extend an existing barn"

so they were quoting GPDO 1995 at you - you can google this if you are really sad and want to read gov. gobbledegook

quote back your SFP at them as well to prove agricultural useage - which is what grazing is and for which you require a field shelter

good luck

 

[BankEndRescue]

If you get in touch with the RPA they will issue you with a holding number which allows you to be a registered smallholding. If you get that I don't see that the council can argue about your agricultural holding. There is no lower limit on the amount of land you have either, I kept a couple of goats on a plot of land 60ft x 90ft and I got a holding number.

 

[CazD]

Hubby has spoken to the Council this morning who say as we have stables we dont need a field shelter. They want to know why we cant just leave the stable doors open for the horses to come and go as they please. Hubby said the guy just couldnt understand why there would be a problem with two horses trying to get in and out of a 12 x 12 stable through a 3 foot wide door at the same time

 

[ladyt25]

Glad we don't seem to have these problems with oru council. It is luck of the draw with councisl isn't it. I have been told by ours and by a man who built our original stables years ago (and who deals with planning) that you do not need planing for a mobile shelter provided it is moved every once in a while. As for a change of use - I swear that is just to get more money off people - they'll want you to change to leisure use or something.

We have 12 acres of land on greenbelt (with that special interest blah on it), have 2 stables and shelter/hay store (fenced in) and a shelter in one half of the field. I also put show jumps in the field in summer and we've never been advised we need change of use. Recently just applied to build a log home (for me to live in) as we don't live on site, that was refused (which I thought) so now I am attempting going down another 'route'!

It is annoying when you try go about it the right way and abide with the 'law'. So many people don't and they put up shelters , barns and houses even and get away with it no problems and no questions ever asked. A lot depends on your neighbours to be honest. I think in fact we may have no got plannig for our 2nd field shelter but noone's ever queried it and it fixed on a concrete base!

 

[Magicmillbrook]

Try contacting you local councillor and get him/her on side. At my LA they do seem to hold a lot of sway. Also do an acess statement citing animal welfare and the need to rotate grazing and why you cant have two horses going in and out of a normal stable door. You could suggets that you have green roofing on your shelter or stain the wood dark brown or green to lessen its impact.