Please help

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zxcvbnm

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I really hope some one can help me, my horse silver a 14.3 connie was diagnosed with laminitis and cushings at the start of February he is still lame and I'm scared he may be coming to the end, he had a huge colic op 8 years ago and has small colics is he is stressed and doesn't eat the right amount of food, he is fed bran, happy hoof and a handful of high fibre nuts in a ball he has 3 tiny small holed soaked hay nets at night to keep gut moving. He was x-rayed 4 days after he became lame my farrier fitted him with plastic imprint shoes he was still in agony, I've got him on a huge shavings bed with thick rubber matting, after about 3 weeks vet came back out and said he could go out for a few hours to stretch his legs he was still lame but able to walk and we are lucky to have a very soft grounded stable size paddock with just weeds, 2 days ago I found him hunched up in the field barely able to move after 2 of us working to slowly walk him to box and calling vet he said even though it was almost impossible it looked like he was tying up and took bloods these came back negative so we think its the laminitis hitting him again :( he's in so much pain but still his happy cheeky self, he is having 2 bute a day more if needed and having reg vet and farrier visits, this is my best friend I don't know what I would do without him and just want some help :( really sorry for the huge post x
 
Hello,
Can you get x-rays done it may give you some prognosis. (looking at rotation of pedal bone) you will then know what you are dealing with.

I have been told horse should be completely sound for two weeks off meds before it even ventures out of it's heavily bedded box even for mucking out etc.

It may have even been the weeds that set him off?

Hope this is of some little help, I am not a vet so am not an expert.
 
If the horse is this bad you may need stronger pain killers.

It also may be time to talk to your vet about euthanising the horse.
 
I have been where you are and I know how agonising it is! My lovely old T.B nearly 23 at the time had cushings and then developed laminitis in all four feet also prone to stress related colic.
I had a top equine vet out who said he was bad and would have to come in to the hospital but that the outlook was pretty poor and in his opinion it would best to pts!
I was not expecting this and I had to think of my boy who I loved so much and the thought of life without him was unbearable, but I didn,t want him to suffer or have no quality of life, he had always been such a spirited boy so I made the awful choice of having put down, this was the hardest thing I have ever had to do but the vet said I was doing a kind and unselfish thing!
I think a lot depends on the age of the horse, what hope there is for a good outcome and quality of life for the horse!
I am so sorry for you it is so awful, have a good talk with your vet and see what would be right for your horse! Hugs xx
 
We have found with our laminitic that if he gets a chance to eat weeds, they set off his laminitis as badly as grass does, so his diet paddock gets weeded and if he goes in the big field he wears his grazing muzzle. X-rays would be a good idea, as lizness says; there may be pedal bone rotation or sometimes you can see gas pockets which usually (in our experience) indicate abscesses brewing. February is not that long ago and some horses take a long time to come right. Our vet always recommends Sedalin in conjunction with bute/Danilon, as he says it dilates the blood vessels and helps circulation, but he usually does this at first onset. I know how you feel, believe me, and wish you all the best with Silver.
 
Thank you he's only 15 and has got plastic support shoes on which both farrier and vet said he could go out in, he has a muzzle on at all times, I've got one farrier out today, vet and X-rays tomorrow and farrier again Wednesday physio Friday if that all fails I have to think of him :( xx
 
hug.gif
firstly, have a hug. Laminitis is a total *****. Have you tried the ECIR forum and website? They might have some useful information for you http://www.ecirhorse.com/#.

Personally, I would remove the happy hoof and bran. Fast fibre is an alternative that works for many. I would also add mag ox, agnus castus and brewer's yeast/yea sacc.
 
I also lost my lovely little welsh/arab to laminitis/metabolic syndrome, I fed him happy hoof, wish I had not its not that great for them! Is yours on magnesium?
I would have a look on the barefoot forums about diet and laminitis, lot of helpful information, wish I had, I tried for 12 months to save the little lad he was only 12, but in the end when we couldn,t control the pain, knew I had to let him go
 
Our boy is only 11 and just gone down with laminitis for no reason we can see. We have got our vet coming up to do X-rays on Thursday, so I know how you feel. Ours has had worse attacks than this one in the past, some years ago, and we have got him sound, but then we get these inexplicable "blips" and go back to square one. We are going to ask about trying metformin. (I don't think this is used for Cushings horses though.) I hope we both get good results from the X-rays; that would be a start. Good luck; it's so hard to know what to do when they are still their cheeky selves.
 
Hugs. Sorry to hear this. I agree
Maybe xrays will give you and vet an idea if how the feet are and this will help in your prognosis of his future. Good luck
 
I agree with the above advice, please dont walk him if hes in pain you will only do more damage! Have you asked about more pain relief and possibly acp so he lays down more and takes the pressure off his feet? Also what about pads on his feet? Mine had lami last year and was on total box rest for 7 months then was slowly allowed back out after walking in hand and being sound without pain relief. Please speak to your vet about options available to you, its very early days for hes lami at the moment. It takes a longgg time for his feet to heal and become comfortable again, there was many times when i felt wrong for continueing.
 
Thank you so much everyone, he is now staying in huge shavings bed!! Will he not colic if I take bran out? I haven't been brave enough to stop it? Happy hoof bad?? It's got the stamp on I'll take him off that now, what's the feed you suggested kassie 2007? He has now got the liquid coming up from the coronet bad vet has put poltise
 
Thank you so much everyone, he is now staying in huge shavings bed!! Will he not colic if I take bran out? I haven't been brave enough to stop it? Happy hoof bad?? It's got the stamp on I'll take him off that now, what's the feed you suggested kassie 2007? He has now got the liquid coming up from the coronet bad vet has put poultice on and given him stronger pain killers, I don't want people to think I'm being selfish keeping him going but how when I arrive my pony has ears forward and still his twinkle do I give up? I really and so thankful to you all xxx
 
I dont think your selfish at all! Only you know your own horse well enough to judge when enough is enough. Mine was very down throughout his lami, hes normally full of attitude and grumpiness, but my vet was happy he would make a full recovery as he had no rotation, have you had xrays & bloods taken? This is give you a good idea of where you stand. All i can say is be patient. Its a very long healing process & you will have to be very careful in the future. Best of luck.
 
He's had bloods done they showed he had cushings but liver and all organs good, he is having his second lot of X-rays done tomorrow and then farrier out Wednesday I don't care how long and if hes never ridden again he's my baby I just want him safe and happy xxx
 
OP, if he's not already you need to get him on pergolide/Prascend for the Cushings immediately. Cushings, as you will know, is a primary cause of laminitis, often without the "normal" stressors associated with non-Cushings laminitis. I have to say, if you can't control his pain and he has no chance of a reasonable quality of life, you do need to seriously consider whether it's fair to keep him going. You might need to be very very brave for him. And I'd always remind: better a week too early than a day too late x
 
It's such a horrible disease. I thought I had it cracked because we'd been managing my old girl for years, but I've really struggled with getting the younger pony stable since his first attack.

My old girl was diagnosed with cushings about 12 years ago - we've had a lot of success with using an Agnus Castus supplement and managing her diet. She's now well over 30 and the vet considers her to be a bit of a marvel as everything else that was diagnosed at the same time as her is no longer with us. Cushings is normally a disease of the older horse so you've been very unlucky.

Our younger pony has just been officially diagnosed as being insulin resistant. He's been hit and miss for years, with the odd blip and then he's OK again, so I know how frustrated and upset you are feeling. He's had two bad acute attacks - one about 4 years ago which took him weeks to get over when he ended up with some rotation, and then another one last week. Last week's was what finally triggered the formal IR diagnosis. He actually started with the acute attack while we were there, which would have been quite fascinating had it not been our pony in pain. But on the plus side, because we were so close to the start of the acute attack, the vet was able to use ACP which stopped it dead in its tracks. Ruddy pony was bouncing round his prison pen that evening in a right strop. I guess it just goes to show that acute attacks should be treated as an emergency as prompt intervention can help no end. He's been put on metformin and so far it's early days but he seems to be better in himself, his crest is softer and his pulses are less, and he seems to be a bit more tolerant of his surroundings - it was frosty here yesterday night and normally that would have triggered a 'blip', particularly so soon after an acute attack, but he was fine.

The important things are to get your pony stabilised and to keep them stabilised. What works (and if it works) will depend on the causes of the laminitis and what the structural damage is. I think you need to have a good sit down with your vet and discuss the long term prognosis, treatment and management.

Fingers crossed we both manage to get to the bottom of it for our respective pones. I must admit that while I was waiting for the vet this time I was wondering if it was worth it if I couldn't keep him stabilised. It is all about quality of life, and they get so depressed with laminitis pain it's horrid.
 
zxcvbnm said:
Thank you so much everyone, he is now staying in huge shavings bed!! Will he not colic if I take bran out? I haven't been brave enough to stop it? Happy hoof bad?? It's got the stamp on I'll take him off that now, what's the feed you suggested kassie 2007? He has now got the liquid coming up from the coronet bad vet has put poultice on and given him stronger pain killers, I don't want people to think I'm being selfish keeping him going but how when I arrive my pony has ears forward and still his twinkle do I give up? I really and so thankful to you all xxx
Click to expand...

Kassie my niece was talking about my mare

why is he on bran???

bran stripes alot of goodness from the horse if fed allot.
Use only short term

this page has details of bran half way down
http://www.laminitisclinic.org/Explaining Laminitis and its Prevention/Chapter 6.pdf


if its an abbcess
from coronary band you need to ask your vet about putting him on norodine antibiotics
Baytril anti bio
and pottassium iodide mixed in water

my mare got infection of pedal bone and all the above stoped it all beit she was on them a month .

All due to the abccess and slight delay in treatment

baytril must be suringed in orally once a day

i poulticed twice a day and tubbed twice aday till no more coming out


i use bedmax bedding as its very soft and supporting and recomended by laminitic scociety



my mare 16 hh

is on twice a day

1/2 scoop fibergy
1/2 scoop alfa a lite
half a sieve ( bought from tescos )of speedy beet rinsed through till water clear. twice a day .

am she has 4 pumps soya oil -founderguard-laminator-flexijoint
pm soya oil formula4feet laminator and flexi joint


I am not changing this this suits her.

her hay soaked 12hrs and rinsed through

4lbs am around 8
4lbs around 12-1pm
4lbs around 5-6 pm
4lbs around 9-10pm

she was also in alot of pain in stages of her journey varied from 4 bute to two depending on flareups etc. she also is bright and alert most of the way.

The horse will tell you when it gets to much.

Caring through is expensive time consuming and a stress/worry on the owner but if you can do all the above and finance it . Go for it no one can force you to put him down unless pedal bone goes through or pony cant cope and is showing signs of not willing to fight.

To many on her say xxx amounts of box rest is unfair
or pts is best
or what life will he have.


no one can predict the future, you know the pony how he is coping.

my mares due to grain overload first time
second she escaped into field and eating 1/2 sac barley rings
3rd haylage mauve lami one which we had to put her on due to protein loss once they raised ghaylage to much for her.

my mare 8 months box rest
has come through
3 flare ups 2 being serious
2 sinkings
2 rotations
pedal bone infection
1 being cast to itchy rolling ( not colic )
1 colic due to tape worms seperate month to above.
1 abccess
protein loss also due to tape worms.


She has come through all the above remained a fighter always showing her will to live. She has the advantage of VERY HARD FEET as Billy Crothers world champion farrier 5 times said even last week when he trimmed need a chainsaw on these god they are hard which has bee a huge impact on her recovery.


Thats us up to date lami foot having her glue on shoe redone next week.



Not all hosres cope with box rest my girlie does

Good luck with your boy..:)
 
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I will try and reply to all head is abit all over the place, X-rays have showed severe rotation in right foot and gas pockets left has rotated but not as badly my vet and farrier came out together we all Sat down looked at X-rays and they have decided as hes still standing up, happy and fighting to try what we can, we have removed imprints and placed lily pads which made him more comfortable he is on noridine and 4 bute also on all treatment for cushings, I soak his hay for 24 hours and give him 4 small (rugby ball size) nets through out day and night, I know bran should not be a long term feed but the second its removed from his diet he cloggs up and colics so vet would rather he stay on it he has Only got half his guy after a huge colic surgery 9 years ago, if for one minute he looked like he was giving up or in agony I would end all this for him he's my baby and my best friend I would never put him through pain for my gain so please don't think that of me. He's still fighting I feel I owe him this after so many happy years he has given me my farrier has called in a friend of his who is one of the best around and once silver has had a chance to stabilise the would like to do a dorsal wall resection I think, hope I have replied to everyones questions, thank you again for all the advice xx
 
I hope everything works out for you too. I have been in the same position. If your pony still has his fighting spirit and can be kept comfortable, then in my experience it is worth keeping going and I don't think you are being selfish at all in doing just that. xx
 
Janesomerset said:
I hope everything works out for you too. I have been in the same position. If your pony still has his fighting spirit and can be kept comfortable, then in my experience it is worth keeping going and I don't think you are being selfish at all in doing just that. xx
Click to expand...

^ 5 to this


My mare ha s been fighting all the way hers is in the off fore , she has rotated 15 %

I would strongly ask your vet to put him of Potassium iodide which penitrates the hoof



The second you see an abscess get your vet to use also baytril its very expensive but it penetrated bone thus the only one who can protect from the bone being infected.

The last thing you want is Pedal Osteitis septic one.

I would aslo rinse his hay through till water runs clear, I am still doing this with mare. You will be amazed how much the water is still brown until you rinse hay be REAL striked I was and still am even though we are further down the road to recovery now . You mustnt laps for a minute or it could cost his life, trust me on this I know as I have had many setbacks .
 
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after 8 months being in
110.jpg

from yesterday alowed 10 mins max standing in the uv's rubber matting outside .
This is soaly to boost her day every other day only
this is her off fore which is the worst one and the only one structurely damaged
its not cut at the front just filed tho there is a gap between the toe and shoe you can put your finger between them

116.jpg


115.jpg
lamifeet12-03-203.jpg
 
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Hi There. My daughters 19 year old Sec A has cushings and suffered teribly with lami so i feel your pain. 2/3 years ago I didn't think he was going to make it as most days he didn't even both getting up as his feet were so sore. The best thing i ever did was put him on pergolide. It takes a while to get the dose right but boy oh boy is it worth every penny. While he was really sore I only gave him enough NSAID to take the edge off the pain as you don't want to completely mask the foot pain or they'll do more damage, the best thing they can do is lay down and let the feet heal. Make sure the diet is super tight, low S&S feed, i feed dengie hifi lite or Alfa a lite and dengie healthy hooves plus hay that i know is low sugar and absolutely no treats of any form. Our little guy is fiighting fit now and lives out all year with my big horse and can regularly be seen charging around the field and will happily pop a little jump and trot down the roads when out hacking. Getting a correct trim is also super important, short toe & low heels. I get the pergolide from a local pharmacy by getting the script from the vets as its a fraction of the price. Good luck :)
 
Quick update after the last 3 days being putting lily pads on, changing poultices and having norodine sprayed in my face we have finally found a happy medium! He will now leave his feet alone and stop chewing through vet wrap, vet has already got him on Cushings meds and things to help hoofs and abbcess, farrier back out tomorrow to put clogs on see if they help support him, he's a very happy pony and apart from 2 front feet looks as healthy as ever, thank you guys xx
 
I'm so happy for you both! By the way, when you get to the stage of just needing a dry poultice, we found disposable nappies to be SO much easier to wrap round a hoof! (with tape over them, of course.) You probably already know that but I thought it was worth a mention anyway.
 
my boy was with this world for 17 years, 12 of that he was the most loved spoilt baby boy ever, he fought with all his might but today lost his battle, this horse was my best friend my rock my life support. in the end i just could not let him suffer thank you all your posts and support and please never take your horses for granted xx
 
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