Plight of Santorini Donkeys (pics too) LONG BUT PLEASE READ!

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sea_view

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Hi all, I will not apologise that this is long but please read as I am devestated at what is going on in Santorini with the donkeys (photos at the end).

I have just returned from my holidays, had a lovely time but it was tarnished by my visit to Santorini and I just wanted to see if anyone else had been there and experienced this and to let those that haven't know what is going on out there with their donkeys.

Santorini is a Greek Island and the only way to reach it is via this steep cliff (the path is the zig zag line hope it shows how steep it was):
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There are three ways to get up this cliff - walk the 900+ steps, cable car (that only takes 36 people at a time) and via the old tradition of donkeys.

I was devestated to see the horrific state of some of the donkeys. They lined the path of the cliff face in blistering heat with no water taking oversized, overweight and ignorant tourists up and down the cliff face ALL DAY!!!

The donkeys were either taken up on their own or joined in lines of 5 or 6. The donkeys were covered in sores, were very old and many had crippled legs. Their saddles were held on by rope and ratchett straps. The men hit and shouted at hem to go up the hill at the fastest possible rate and then forced them slipping and sliding down the hill at terrible rates to get more tourists. They were not given time to rest and it was 32o + heat.

One wee old donkey was tiny and carryinga big tourist whilst being dragged up at he end of a line, it was ht for going to slow and in a bid to get moving got caught up with and trampled a lady who was walking - it was awful, I was trying to get the donkey off her and pick her up at he same time - I was hysterical and screamed at the man to stop but he just hit the donkey which was trying to scramble out the way.

On the way back I asked where the donkeys got water and a man ponted to a tiny shed that certainly wasn't suitable for the hundreds of poor souls that were there.

The point of this was just to raise the plight of these poor animals - I have googled it and there are things trying to be done and a Facebook page too if you could join.
http://www.facebook.com/group.php?gid=5969571218
I am also going to write to Royal CArribean as a multinational holiday company like that in my opinion CANNOT be seen to be advertising this as a tourist attraction.

Thanks everyone for reading and here are some photos.

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hi, i've been to santorini often, i'm pretty sure there is a local donkey sanctury thing over there where they go out and reg check them,feet,teeth etc etc
 
Ther is a Santorini Animal Welfare, they check them twice a year. Stelios from Easyjet had pledged last year £24000 per year to fund this but it appears the charity is yet to see any of the money.
 
have to say i thought the donkeys would look in a really bad way from the start of your post. i give $20 of my wages each month to a charity who deals with loadsa animal charitys, i kno its not much but its something
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Going by the photos.........they look very well! Not one is skinny, all are shiney and the tack looks decent enough. As for the tourists, well they exist and not a lot can be done about them
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. Try contacting the WHW and see if they have something in mind for the donks re working hours, breaks and watering etc. I was expecting something awful but TBH was pleasantly surprised. Mairi.
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This has been well documented in a national newspaper just recently. I have to agree with the others tho', these donkeys look in reasonable nick. Not saying it's to 'our' standards or that they don't work too hard but they look ok.
 
Let me tell you Mairi the piccies do not do it justice, the donkeys were in an awful state - they may have big tummies (worm ridden probably) but were skinny on their rumps with crippled wee legs. The tack was made up of ropes and covered in sores - the shiny coat - from the blistering 32o+ sunshine that was beatng down on them. I for sure wasn't pleasantly surprised seeing them
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Ditto Mairi - they do look very well! I've seen far worse in other Greek tourist attractions.
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I think maybe the way to go about things would be to contact your holiday company and a charity such as WHW and suggest that a leaflet be provided to all holiday makers on the cruise ship (left in cabins or something) recommending that only tourists under a certain weight ride these donkeys, never to have 2 people on one donkey and to choose the donkeys that seem best cared for, are provided with water etc and tell the owner that this is why you chose their donkey. I'm sure I saw an advert in a horsey magazine a while ago trying to prevent adults over 9st I think from riding these donkeys abroad, may be worth finding out which charity that was?
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Going by the photos.........they look very well! Not one is skinny, all are shiney and the tack looks decent enough. As for the tourists, well they exist and not a lot can be done about them
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. Try contacting the WHW and see if they have something in mind for the donks re working hours, breaks and watering etc. I was expecting something awful but TBH was pleasantly surprised. Mairi.
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just what i was about to say...and i would also guess that they are Mules.

SPANA i believe do good work in Greece as do The Brooke.

its all about education i think...
 
I think you are right - I read up on some of it last night and it seemed that they are trying to educate but it is the older generation that they are having trouble converting. There seems to be a Santorini Animal Welfare but they only check them twice a year, as far as I can see they are also trying to push a government policy through in Greece regarding animals that are used for tourists attractions - something along the lines of them being maintained as public transport would be.

I'm defo going to contact the cruise company as they were advertsing it as a great fun family activity - but man alive it really wasn't. I noticed the Daily Express seems to be doing a lot of campaigning too.
 
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Ditto Mairi - they do look very well! I've seen far worse in other Greek tourist attractions.
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I think maybe the way to go about things would be to contact your holiday company and a charity such as WHW and suggest that a leaflet be provided to all holiday makers on the cruise ship (left in cabins or something) recommending that only tourists under a certain weight ride these donkeys, never to have 2 people on one donkey and to choose the donkeys that seem best cared for, are provided with water etc and tell the owner that this is why you chose their donkey. I'm sure I saw an advert in a horsey magazine a while ago trying to prevent adults over 9st I think from riding these donkeys abroad, may be worth finding out which charity that was?
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handing out leaflets seems like a really gd idea to me
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u never kno they might give a bit extra for the donkeys up keep but they look like they are in pretty good condition

just looked on the brooke website an saw this pic, OMG!!

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TBH I was pleasantly suprised too. I know it doesn't make it right, but on the grand scheme of things there are worse off donkeys who need to be helped first.

Though I did raise and eyebrow at the saddleclothes/blankets - covering a multitide of sins perhaps?
 
I have seen 100 times worse. I would worry about working hours and water etc, but their condition seems okay. Could do with girths instead of string though.
 
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SPANA i believe do good work in Greece as do The Brooke.


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SPANA, I think thats who I was thinking of putting the adverts in the horsey magazines, maybe they could be your first port of call.
 
Will do - I wish I had got more 'evidence' style photos but it was really difficult to get them without the men getting angry - I feel my photos are giving everyone the idea they were fine - which they weren't and with the cliff/heat and work load it wasn't good.
 
To be honest the donkeys in the photos you took seem to be in a very good state. Their feet look good, they all seem to have a decent weight, and the tack looks all right. Given what you say about the heat and lack of water you would expect them to be sweating and have hanging heads, but they seem pretty OK with the temperature. A bit like native ponies, donkeys and mules can carry a lot more weight than people give them credit for. Finally donkeys and horses are fairly rare in Greece and when they are used to make money people take good care of them as their livelihood depends on them.

I do think there are many more serious animal welfare issues to get involved in, if you fancy something in Greece Google the projects to remove bears from mobile one-man 'entertainment' shows, rehabilitate them and release them in the wild, or the projects to protect sea turtle breeding grounds.
 
Also, just as the people there aclimatise, the animals do too. If donkeys decended from wild asses from North Africa, they are likely to be genetically more able to cope with extreme heat than we give them credit for. Yes they still need shade and water, but they are more likely to be able to cope than we westerners think.
 
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And does that make a difference in how they should be treated?

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it does in the amount of weight they can carry....
 
I'm failing to see that this is really what the point in this post was about but if you want to go down that route then its up to you. What I saw was a bunch of animals - donkeys and mules that were in a worrying state and I felt that I wanted other peoples views on this. If that in turn means that we have to get picky about weights that they can carry then carry on. I'm more worried about their general health and well fair in that blistering heat going up a mountain cliff. Sorry if that doesn't seem as concerning to others as it did to me.
 
Whilst the donkeys may be mules, and the mules may be donkeys, it does not excuse the behaviour of their handlers!!!

I too have watched horses being beaten and cajoled in foreign countries. On one such occasion ( a market) I was so appalled I had to get out of the village!! It was really terrible, and there was no one to complain to, as the attitude to animal welfare is often very different from our own.

However, this does not excuse, nor is it acceptable to treat these animals this way. If that was the case, why is Brooks or the WHW charities trying so hard to stop this?

As responsible and caring people I agree with Sea_View. The mules/donkeys may not look badly treated, but these people are very good at covering up things for the tourist trade, and tourists are often totally ignorant of the animal's plight.

Perhaps a petition, signed by supporters and sent to the WHW to highlight that these equines need care, education of owners/handlers, and water and shade, would help move things forward.
 
i am just pointing out a few things that you will need IF you are going to make a complaint...

as if you go off half-cock with innacurate info..NO-ONE will take a blind bit of notice.

you must not come across as emotive, impartial or aggressive..just give the relevent info in a matter of fact tone..

you may just get somewhere..

who are you going to start with?

i would suggest The Brooke, then the WHW and then any local charity/rescue run over there by BRITISH expats...

good luck...it is sadly, a thankless task campaigning for equines, whatever country you are in.

JM
 
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good luck...it is sadly, a thankless task campaigning for equines, whatever country you are in.

JM

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You are absolutely right about that.
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i have ti agree with the majority here in saying those pictures seem to show a set of pretty healthy looking animals and there isn't any one picture of of one being overladen with weight. Ok, so quite possibly the pics don't do justice and maybe some looked a little shabby and, if this was the case then as JM07 suggests, complain down the correct route to try and get things changed.

People's idea of animal treatment does vary - the 'tack' may not be out idea of normal but they do not have bits it so cannot be hauled about in their mouths by tourists - donkeys and mules by nature are more stubborn and do require some more 'persuasion' on occasion to get moving. I do not condone cruelty/abuse of animals in anyway but the greeks have nothing to gain by mistreating these animals - they are the means to their livelihood after all. They are used to the heat (we may not be but these animals are) - as are the greek men who no doubt go up and down the path throughout the day with their donkeys!

Maybe a little more 'education' would be helpful - as it is for all of us on occasion - but in general most of these donkeys have a pretty decent quality of life and are well cared for.
 
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i have ti agree with the majority here in saying those pictures seem to show a set of pretty healthy looking animals and there isn't any one picture of of one being overladen with weight. Ok, so quite possibly the pics don't do justice and maybe some looked a little shabby and, if this was the case then as JM07 suggests, complain down the correct route to try and get things changed.

People's idea of animal treatment does vary - the 'tack' may not be out idea of normal but they do not have bits it so cannot be hauled about in their mouths by tourists - donkeys and mules by nature are more stubborn and do require some more 'persuasion' on occasion to get moving. I do not condone cruelty/abuse of animals in anyway but the greeks have nothing to gain by mistreating these animals - they are the means to their livelihood after all. They are used to the heat (we may not be but these animals are) - as are the greek men who no doubt go up and down the path throughout the day with their donkeys!

Maybe a little more 'education' would be helpful - as it is for all of us on occasion - but in general most of these donkeys have a pretty decent quality of life and are well cared for.

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excellent answer, sums up my thoughts too.... so saves me having to write it!
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Excuse me,but those Donkeys are MULES!!!!!!

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Exactly what I was thinking!!!! They also look in good condition. Mules are a lot stronger than a donkey too, no excuse for the fat US tourists on board mind you!
 
QR Agree the photos look fine, but S_V clearly saw some very nasty, unnecessary sights. And as she said, the owners in that case were hostile as they KNOW what they are doing is not right. S_V your account was enough for me. Obviously there are many ovners who are treating the animals correctly and they are healthy working animals. But also, some are not but are still allowed to work their animals there. Surely this makes it easier to eradicate, with some effort? As someone said, education of tourists - plenty of healthy animals, petition them to never use the ones who are struggling?

S_V fair play to you for trying to do something, seeing such stuff would ruin me xxx
 
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