Prices for Travelling horses to Lessons?!

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EquestrianFairy

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-Please!

7 mile trip there (15 mins)
1 Hour wait (can watch horse lesson if wanted or at times may join in lesson)
7 mile trip back (15 mins)

-How much would you charge?

Horse in question is a 15.1hh LW cob and it is a 4x4 and Trailer.

Thanks guys, much appreciated.
 
I would say at least £50. If someone is giving up 2 hours of their time and using their car and fuel and their trailer, it is not worth doing it for less.
 
RedRolo said:
Very true but in reality this doesnt happen as we know, i am looking more for petrol cost and their time cost really.
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OK.
So you are happy for her to travel your horse illegally, and without the correct Ins?
What will happen if there is an accident?
Or someone runs into the back of the tralier and injures your horse?
 
nativeponies said:
OK.
So you are happy for her to travel your horse illegally, and without the correct Ins?
What will happen if there is an accident?
Or someone runs into the back of the tralier and injures your horse?
Click to expand...

I dont beleive i ever mentioned that she didnt have insurance?
Your jumping the gun somewhat, your concern is noted but as you have already stated you would charge nothing so thanks for your input.
 
Legally, you cannot even give your friend petrol money for transporting you as this remains hire and reward. Why not ask a horse transporter what they would charge you? That way you have a realistic idea of the "value" of the favour you now owe your friend! Better still, find out what your friend thinks your outings are worth in terms of "favours". You are still on dicey territory with the insurance situation... I have another one - is your horse insured for the damage it may do to your friend's trailer - potentially?
In reality, horse transport works out at 80p - £1 / 1.50 per mile (there and back) in my experience, plus an hourly rate for waiting. Its probably a bit better if your friend was also having a lesson with you!
 
RedRolo said:
I dont beleive i ever mentioned that she didnt have insurance?
Your jumping the gun somewhat, your concern is noted but as you have already stated you would charge nothing so thanks for your input.
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She may have insurance but I suspect it would become void if you paid her for transporting your horse - hence the 'no insurance' issue.
 
Personally if it were a friend, I wouldn't charge anything! (except get petrol money - which you can guage from what is used) and i would hope and expect something in return like some help with my horse or whatever, maybe she could shout you the odd lesson or something similar.

x
 
For a one off for a friend - nothing

As a regular thing for a friend in a pickle with a horse - nothing

As a regular thing for a friend who insisted on giving me something £10
 
I would think nothing for a friend, but would offer to muck out/turn out once a week or whatever, i.e. if shes got some days she struggles with, offer to do those days =] xxxx
 
RebelRebel said:
For a one off for a friend - nothing

As a regular thing for a friend in a pickle with a horse - nothing

As a regular thing for a friend who insisted on giving me something £10
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Can i be your friend ;-)

Sorry NP i wasnt having a go, i was confused on what you were trying to get at.
 
Operators Licence regulations refer to horseboxes over 3.5tonnes, not car and trailer.
VOSA publications show exemptions, which include vehicles mainly intended for passengers, and their trailers, and Landrovers and trailers. If I were to offer this journey to a friend, I would think they were very generous if they offered me £20. Actually, for a journey this short, if it were a close friend with whom I regularly swapped helps, I would be happy with a nice bottle!
At the end of the day, if you took a friend to the airport (which, I'm sure lots of us have done, and will do), it is entirely normal and acceptable for that friend to fill up your tank. You wouldn't worry about registering as a Taxi. It's when you do it for 30 "friends" week in,week out, that it becomes a bit more than a favour!
 
Groom42 said:
Operators Licence regulations refer to horseboxes over 3.5tonnes, not car and trailer.
VOSA publications show exemptions, which include vehicles mainly intended for passengers, and their trailers, and Landrovers and trailers. If I were to offer this journey to a friend, I would think they were very generous if they offered me £20. Actually, for a journey this short, if it were a close friend with whom I regularly swapped helps, I would be happy with a nice bottle!
At the end of the day, if you took a friend to the airport (which, I'm sure lots of us have done, and will do), it is entirely normal and acceptable for that friend to fill up your tank. You wouldn't worry about registering as a Taxi. It's when you do it for 30 "friends" week in,week out, that it becomes a bit more than a favour!
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Thank You for that.
I have wrongly assumed it was illegal.
But, and I'm not being picky, what about Ins if there is an accident?
Or horse damages Trailer?

So many questions.
 
Actually for me it would be more on the lines of time out - because its not actually 1 1/2 hours it will be more like 2 (hitch up, put away, most definately assuming friend cleans out trailer) and the fact that unless I joined in the lesson, can't do anthing else when my weekends/evenings are so precious. So, unless its an emergency, I would not even go down that route, regardless of the rights and wrongs of insurance. I might well end up sharing a friends trailer to go out competing with her and would split petrol but thats to travel together - I do have my own!
 
To transport a horse for hire and reward-does not matter if profit involved at all

Trailer and 4x4 must be under 3.5 tonnes otherwise an operators licence IS required.
DEFRA Licence COMPULSORY
Trailer & 4x4 inspected by DEFRA and Vehicle then licenced for either 8 hours and Under or for 8 hours and over
Person driving THEN MUST have either CET (8 hours) or ACET (over 8 hours)

Insurances Include
hire and reward this is upgraded from your normal 4x4 insurance
Public Liability
Care Custody and Control
Breakdown Recovery upgraded to Horse Transporter not family or personal membership

So as everyone has pointed out not only is the person helping breaking the law and would effectively be voiding her/his insurance, Trading Standards would fine minimum £5,000 the person for starters, then the police for not having the correct insurance so wave goodbye to your driving licence

And god forbid that your horse was injured on board in the event of an accident or if a third party was injured.

I know someone who did the above and thought she was 'above the law' she lost everything and her house, which subsequently took her marriage etc and she had to sell her beautiful horses as well.

Not worth the risk IMHO

There are plenty of places that do self drive and have the correct self drive insurances and defra licences
 
foraday said:
To transport a horse for hire and reward-does not matter if profit involved at all

Trailer and 4x4 must be under 3.5 tonnes otherwise an operators licence IS required.
DEFRA Licence COMPULSORY
Trailer & 4x4 inspected by DEFRA and Vehicle then licenced for either 8 hours and Under or for 8 hours and over
Person driving THEN MUST have either CET (8 hours) or ACET (over 8 hours)

Insurances Include
hire and reward this is upgraded from your normal 4x4 insurance
Public Liability
Care Custody and Control
Breakdown Recovery upgraded to Horse Transporter not family or personal membership

So as everyone has pointed out not only is the person helping breaking the law and would effectively be voiding her/his insurance, Trading Standards would fine minimum £5,000 the person for starters, then the police for not having the correct insurance so wave goodbye to your driving licence

And god forbid that your horse was injured on board in the event of an accident or if a third party was injured.

I know someone who did the above and thought she was 'above the law' she lost everything and her house, which subsequently took her marriage etc and she had to sell her beautiful horses as well.

Not worth the risk IMHO

There are plenty of places that do self drive and have the correct self drive insurances and defra licences
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very interesting i agree:

A genuine question: surely people who share transport when going to shows etc dont have all this insurance? If you think about at an average show there are like 50 odd people and say half come with two people and two horses.. do we assume that they are breaking the law or is there some loophole here?
 
RedRolo said:
very interesting i agree:

A genuine question: surely people who share transport when going to shows etc dont have all this insurance? If you think about at an average show there are like 50 odd people and say half come with two people and two horses.. do we assume that they are breaking the law or is there some loophole here?
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The difference being that if you share a trailer between friends to get to a show the person doing the driving is not getting any reward - this includes getting horse mucked out etc, doesn't have to be money/petrol.
If you are getting any sort of compensation - ie horse being mucked out, petrol, money, haynets filled, bottle of wine etc then you must have to relevant licence and insurance.

Also foraday if you are caught with no insurance by the police you don't lose your licence you get 3 points and a fine.
 
FWIW a local RS (about 5 miles away as the crow flies) charges £20 to collect and deliver back a pony for a clinic (we couldn't get trailer out due to mud in the winter). I didn't opt for this in the end, daughter rode a RS pony instead.
 
When I went through a period without having transport, I'd give people who took me and my horse places the petrol money.

I gave £50 for a 100 mile round trip. (Picking up a horse)
If someone took me to a show, and I was sharing the trailer or lorry with their horse I'd give a tenner, and if they were taking me on my own I'd give them £20. (These were all friends, so it was to mainly just to cover their petrol and to say thank you. I'd sometimes get them a box of chocolates or flowers as well)

hope that helps :)
 
Dubsie said:
FWIW a local RS (about 5 miles away as the crow flies) charges £20 to collect and deliver back a pony for a clinic (we couldn't get trailer out due to mud in the winter). I didn't opt for this in the end, daughter rode a RS pony instead.
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I did ask but this RS dont do it unfort- however that price isnt bad. Thanks
 
crockshard said:
Legally, you cannot even give your friend petrol money for transporting you as this remains hire and reward. Why not ask a horse transporter what they would charge you? That way you have a realistic idea of the "value" of the favour you now owe your friend! Better still, find out what your friend thinks your outings are worth in terms of "favours". You are still on dicey territory with the insurance situation... I have another one - is your horse insured for the damage it may do to your friend's trailer - potentially?
In reality, horse transport works out at 80p - £1 / 1.50 per mile (there and back) in my experience, plus an hourly rate for waiting. Its probably a bit better if your friend was also having a lesson with you!
Click to expand...

No, giving petrol money does NOT constitute hire and reward - VOSA have confirmed this and H&H did an article on it.

ETA link: http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/horsecare/1370/116217.html

So actually, as per the last question on that page, splitting fuel costs, bottle of wine, whatever is actually ok.
 
Last edited:
Misinterpreted said:
When I went through a period without having transport, I'd give people who took me and my horse places the petrol money.

I gave £50 for a 100 mile round trip. (Picking up a horse)
If someone took me to a show, and I was sharing the trailer or lorry with their horse I'd give a tenner, and if they were taking me on my own I'd give them £20. (These were all friends, so it was to mainly just to cover their petrol and to say thank you. I'd sometimes get them a box of chocolates or flowers as well)

hope that helps :)
Click to expand...

SpottedCat said:
No, giving petrol money does NOT constitute hire and reward - VOSA have confirmed this and H&H did an article on it.

ETA link: http://www.horseandhound.co.uk/horsecare/1370/116217.html

So actually, as per the last question on that page, splitting fuel costs, bottle of wine, whatever is actually ok.
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A livery yard owner occasionally takes clients and their horses to shows, along with her own, in return for sharing fuel costs. What must they do to comply?


VOSA: "As it is not in connection with a business, this is a private arrangement and, as long as no payment for transportation from A to B is involved, no OL or tachograph is needed."


Defra: "The regulations will not apply if the journey is purely a private, non-economic activity with friends sharing fuel costs, irrespective of whether they may also be clients, provided the transport is carried out separately from the livery yard business."

(seems that way)
 
crockshard said:
Legally, you cannot even give your friend petrol money for transporting you as this remains hire and reward.
Click to expand...

Is this still the same if you have your horse + friend's horse in the back and you are both going off to compete at the same competition?

Sorry to hijack thread, and I'm sure it's been done before, but if I give my mate a tenner for fuel, is that deemed hire and reward?!?! that is totally insane!!!
 
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