Problems when long reining. Advice sought please.

P

piaffe

Well-Known Member
Joined
22 September 2002
Messages
10,527
Location
Dorset.
Visit site
Please ignore any spelling mistakes etc have just come home from working a night shift.

Ok, I am having problems with my 3 year old when I long rein her. I started off in the school and she seemed to grasp the concept quite slowly. Was fine walking forwards and turning but when I gently asked her to stand she flipped. She reared right up. I would stay quiet, with my voice and allow her to overcome her paddy and then encourage her to walk forwards. I think this approach works better than driving her forward as it seems to make her worse. But maybe this is the wrong way to do it?
confused.gif
crazy.gif


Anyway, with practice, we improved a little and managed to stand nice and quietly with little or no fuss. So, then we progressed to doing it down a lane and in some fields (never anywhere where we may come accross traffic)

Walking forward is fine, not a problem at all. But, again, if I ask her to stand she rears. The other week she went straight up and over and landed on her back.
frown.gif
Luckily it was on grass and a soft landing. She was unharmed but maybe a little shaken.

I persisted, but put a standing martingale on as I really wanted to try and nip this in the bud. She still tried to rear and Im now not really sure which way to go now.
frown.gif
frown.gif
frown.gif


I haven't done it since as I think we have both lost confidence and I am also angry with myself as it is not often I am defeated.
blush.gif
blush.gif
frown.gif


She is backed and has tried to go up a couple of times but I have been quick to drive her on and she has been fine.

But, now she is backed, I really hoped to spend the winter just doing very light work which would have included long reining. But should I just not bother?

I am so cross with myself as I am obviously doing something very very wrong but I just can't see what it is.
blush.gif
blush.gif
blush.gif
Hence the reason for asking an outsiders opinion as I am sure it glaringly obvious but am just to stupid/blind to see it.
blush.gif
blush.gif
blush.gif


Im feeling very down about this, more than I expected I would.
frown.gif


Any word of encouragement/advice/slaps around the face?
 
You're not doing anything wrong! She hasnt got Arab in her has she?! Ours at work tend to have paddys and throw themselves on the floor, mares especially! How long has she been in work for? It could be that she needs the winter off but I wouldnt want to leave her on a bad note. Is it just when you ask her to stand that she rears? Could be she is just getting a bit full of herself, getting fitter etc. Do you do much lunge work with her or is it mainly long reining?
Sounds like her evasion is to rear which is not good, we had a youngster at work like this and found working him in a pessoa (or similar) worked quite well as if he tried to go up he was just pulling against himself. Sorry probably not much help as Im no expert, Im sure someone on here will be able to help you!
smile.gif
 
The only thing that occurs to me is that perhaps she is very soft in her mouth still and when you ask her to stand, it is hurting her? Have you thought of putting a headcollar under her bridle and attaching the longreins to the bit AND the metal squares on the noseband of the headcollar?

My boss does this with the backing projects until their mouths are more used to the bit and we find it helps to reduce the movement and effect of the bit and prevent soreness even if they get a bit strong or argumentative in the early days.

Otherwise, not much help I'm afraid but I hope you get it sorted.
 
LOL no arab she is a dutch warmblood!

At the time, I was doing maybe 1 lunge, 1 ridden and 1 long rein sessions a week. And, yes she only does it when stood. I forgot to say that she did it nearly every time out at a show over the summer.
frown.gif
Normally when stood up in front of the judge!
blush.gif


I did think about working her in a pessoa but thought maybe she was a little young?
confused.gif
 
She is soft in the mouth but then I am soft in the hand. I can ask her down with a very light touch and mainly voice but, that could well be the reason. I may well give that a go. Do you mean clip it to the head collar but run it through the bit rings? Thanks
 
[ QUOTE ]
LOL no arab she is a dutch warmblood!

At the time, I was doing maybe 1 lunge, 1 ridden and 1 long rein sessions a week. And, yes she only does it when stood. I forgot to say that she did it nearly every time out at a show over the summer.
frown.gif
Normally when stood up in front of the judge!
blush.gif


I did think about working her in a pessoa but thought maybe she was a little young?
confused.gif


[/ QUOTE ]

Well I dont know about that, we just used it at work as a last resort really, but this horse was very special and his response to everything was to rear. Surely if she is old enough to be ridden and show then she is old enough for a pessoa? Is she doing it because she wants to go and you are holding her back?
 
Gosh, sorry wasn't insinuating that you were hard handed - I just know how soft baby mouths can be. I'm sure you are really gentle with her
laugh.gif


Umm, hard to explain but my boss basically attaches the long rein clips to the bit AND the headcollar together. So the bit is kinda clipped to the headcollar (well the metal square bits at the side of the noseband). The clips have the bit AND the headcollar squares inside them when they are clipped up.

hope that makes some sort of sense?
 
[ QUOTE ]
Hadnt thought of it like that actually. I think she is. She fidgets like mad until I allow her to walk forwards again.

[/ QUOTE ]

Hmm sounds like bad manners then, how old is she? I guess lots of practice is the answer and somehow not allowing her to go up...but if you have a couple of weeks of her being good I would be tempted to give her the winter off
smile.gif
 
No its ok!
smile.gif
I may think I am soft in the hand but thats not to say that she disagrees with me! lol

I think I get it. I may well get a better idea if I have a play. Will def try it.

Thing is as well, I have read the pst below about the rearer and am now getting really worried. My trainer said its just because she is a baby but when does that stop being an excuse?
confused.gif
frown.gif
 
She was 3 in June.

I agree with that. We move yards on Friday so was planning to do a little bit even just in hand as there will be lots of new things for her to see and experience.
 
That was a scarey post. I almost didn't read it myself buy couldn't resist. Then I regretted it.
wink.gif


I just reread your first post and you say that when she has her little paddy you quietly calm her down and wait for her to get over it cos driving her forward seems to make her worse? I think you also said she was a warmblood?

I was talking about warmbloods on here the other day and someone said to me they are very very stubborn and oppinionated - or at least they can be. It just occurs to me that perhaps your little mare is displaying tendancies of lacking of respect rather than pain or anything else. Because, whenever she does it, you take the pressure off, she has now learnt that it is a great way to get 'human' to back off... ?

You say that she has threatened to do it under saddle but that you drove her forwards and she quit? If it were me (and this is just based on what you've written, obviously I don't know the horse) I would be tempted to do the same on the long reins. If she 'gets worse' she may well be throwing a tantrum, rather than paniking. Are you less confident in the long reins than you are with the ridden stuff cos she could be picking up on that as well and using it to her advantage/.

What i would do is if she went to rear up, I would immediately drive her forwards, using my voice and, if appropriate, slapping the ropes on her sides and put her on a circle for a couple of circuits of trot. Then I would gently put her back on the straight line and ask for halt again. I would repeat this until she got the idea that rearing = more trot work and cross, scarey, growly mother...


obviously it depends on how she reacts, if she completely panics then you might need to change tack but if she just leaps forward and throws a bit of a tantrum I would use the circles in trot until she gets over herself.
 
Thank you very much for your reply.

I feel like such a pleb!
blush.gif
Espeically if it is my "don't make a big deal of the naughty behaviour" has made her worse. I guess I am used to me highly sensitive gelding who you have to just keep quiet and calm or he gets tense and worried. Perhaps Im not clever enough to have distinguised between the two differing behaviours and temperments.
blush.gif


I have to say, I am not overly confident in long reining as it was not something that was done often when I used to do it as part of my job. I get a little flustered with the lines and am not good at going from a straight onto a circle although I am getting better.
blush.gif
blush.gif
blush.gif
blush.gif
 
QR -
Sorry to hear you are having problems with your mare! is she the one in the pictures? Absolutely beautiful!
I have had a lot of experience with young warmbloods, having had a number of jobs producing them for dressage yards.
In my opinion, they can be rather argumentative, yes, but if something is made black and white - perfectly clear, they will cooperate and will choose to take the easiest option!
Does she fidget about before she goes up? is she a bolshy madame in other aspects of her life eg leading?
It seems to me that as long as she is happy going forwards, and no rearing/napping when she is allowed to walk on I think you could rule out physical problems. However, this is more of a psychological dilemma for her, as it is her natural desire to move forwards (which is very good, you don't want a stuffy backward thinking creature on your hands!) but she is being prevented from doing this by you (obviously, as you want her to halt!) so as a consequence is feeling rather 'trapped' and panicing and the only way she can think of to get out of this is by going up. She was probably allowed forwards the first few times she did it - and so it has become a habit.
It is difficult to stop this behaviour on the long reins as you are behind, and have little control of the front end. I think that it might be wise if you do not long rein for a while to avoid any further episodes - she is a baby and you do not want this habit to become any more fixed in her mind!
Instead I would considr a lot of ground work over the winter while she is maturing, going into the school in her tack and just practising standing still with you holding her from the floor. Start of with just a few seconds, and increase the length of time you want her to stand, without letting her even so much as take a step forwards. If she steps forward, ask her firmly to move back and stand again.
Essential to this is a lot of praise when she is standing, lots of voice commands to ask her to halt and move on again. You could progress to her being ridden with someone at her head and halting, walking, halting, walking etc etc until she gets the idea that it is ok to stand still!
I would try not to make a big issue of it, otherwise she will too. As regards the martingale I would not use it as she is stilll trying to rear and she may end up damaging herself or you. I would catagorically not use a pessoa on a young horse, it makes them feel very trapped, their very sensitive baby mouth is connected to their back end and so any movement of the hind legs resuts in pressure on the mouth. This at best encourages a hollow, overbent outline to evade the pressure, and at worst actually encourages rearing by making the horse feel even more trapped. And if she rears and goes over in one of these contraptions it will not be a pretty sight! Believe me, I have seen it. Also, in my opinion, a pessoa has no place in the correct training of a young horse as it forces them into a false outline.
Sorry for rambling on!
 
Agree with ChocCornflake - I would give the long reining a miss for the winter too. Especially as you say you're not confident with it, and the transitions to circles etc. It won't be helping her or you! When you're practicing your halting and walking on in the school, I'd also be trying three more things.

1. Use ground poles as a guide for her - it brings her attention down towards the floor and you, and away from sticking her head in the clouds! Leading her, you could ask her to halt between them like this (if the top of the 8 is her head and the bottom her butt)

|8|

or this
_
8
_

2. When you halt her, have her stretch her head to either side, and down between her knees - I use a treat in my hand to give Henry a sniff, and he then bends his neck to either side to get his reward. It is bribery but it makes the halt more interesting!

3. How is she with obstacles? You could set up a handy pony type course, bending through cones, trotting poles on the ground and a designated stopping place. perhaps then her focus might be more on the different things she is having to think about, rather than all geared to having her stop and stand.
 
Thanks for your advice. Lots of things for me to try. Im now looking forward to moving yards so I can start doing a bit with her again.
smile.gif
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Top