PTS - it's good to talk (to your vet)

[nikicb]

As some may have read in another post of mine from a little while back, my 13.2 pony has been diagnosed with a tumour on his tongue. It is localised and currently not affecting his eating, general health, etc., but obviously will reach a point when I will need to make a decision. My four had their flu boosters today and I was glad to see I had one of the more senior vets come out, rather than one of the interns. It wouldn't matter to me at all for vaccinations so didn't specify a particular vet to attend, but not having arranged the 'deed' itself in advance before, I was grateful to have the opportunity to talk about the process/logistics etc. Whilst it won't take away my distress and upset when it does finally happen, I really feel so much better that I've had the discussion about the process, pros and cons of method, arrangements for removal etc. I also know that I will arrange for this particular vet to do it. The joy of a big local practice is that there is always someone there in an emergency, but you can pick and choose your vets. My previous favoured vet went on maternity leave last year and is not returning to practice at the moment, so I had been feeling a little left in the lurch in terms of who I would pick to come out when the option was there. I'm now feeling a lot more settled about the whole thing. Sorry for the ramble, but I just wanted to post this to say that it has made a big difference having an open and frank discussion about the PTS process and it really is worthwhile making plans, even if you think it could be many years ahead. xx

 

[Nudibranch]

Sorry to hear about your pony. I completely agree it's important to talk about it and have plans in place. Even if it's only on the basis of emergency planning. I've used my vet for years and he knows both me and my horses really well, and it's a good relationship. He had to pts my big lad last year, who he had known since a foal. That's why I asked him to do it rather than the knackerman I usually use (who is very good also). I normally hand a horse over last minute to avoid stress for them but I completely trust my vet, and he put me so much at ease I stayed. Although sad it was a strangely rewarding experience - hard to explain but I knew it was completely peaceful for my boy.

Good vets are priceless.

 

[nikicb]

Sorry to hear about your pony. I completely agree it's important to talk about it and have plans in place. Even if it's only on the basis of emergency planning. I've used my vet for years and he knows both me and my horses really well, and it's a good relationship. He had to pts my big lad last year, who he had known since a foal. That's why I asked him to do it rather than the knackerman I usually use (who is very good also). I normally hand a horse over last minute to avoid stress for them but I completely trust my vet, and he put me so much at ease I stayed. Although sad it was a strangely rewarding experience - hard to explain but I knew it was completely peaceful for my boy.

Good vets are priceless.

Thanks for your reply, and sorry to hear about your big lad.

Funnily enough, I didn't get off to the best start with this particular vet - he first came out to my horses at 1.30 am for a colic case, grumpily refused a warm drink, jabbed where needed and left. The following day he came back and apologised for being grumpy and explained that he had to be up at 5 am for racing stuff (we live near Lambourn) and ever since then has been really lovely. Today he couldn't have been more supportive - not just the PTS business, but a couple of other comments about the rest of the herd as well. I trust every one of the vets to give me a good service in terms of knowledge, but the 'bedside manner' matters an awful lot as well. x

 

[vmac66]

When I had a horse pts the vet was fantastic. She had been with us from before the diagnosis to the day off pts. She made a horrendous situation that little bit easier .

 

[CMcC]

Sorry to hear about your pony, but so good that you have peace of mind about how and who will be there when you need to make a decision. Hopefully he still has a lot of life in front of him.

When I had to have my first horse PTS I had no idea he was so bad, the vet who turned up to see him was one I had never met before. So in ten minutes of meeting him he was telling me there was nothing he could do and the kindest thing would be to PTS him there and then. I burst into to tears but the vet was fantastic,he let me take as long as I wanted to say goodbye. I had no idea about disposing of body so vet called the crematorium and insisted on waiting with me until they came to collect my boy. Vet was part of large practice, when he left to go on his own needless to say I went with him.

 

[eahotson]

As some may have read in another post of mine from a little while back, my 13.2 pony has been diagnosed with a tumour on his tongue. It is localised and currently not affecting his eating, general health, etc., but obviously will reach a point when I will need to make a decision. My four had their flu boosters today and I was glad to see I had one of the more senior vets come out, rather than one of the interns. It wouldn't matter to me at all for vaccinations so didn't specify a particular vet to attend, but not having arranged the 'deed' itself in advance before, I was grateful to have the opportunity to talk about the process/logistics etc. Whilst it won't take away my distress and upset when it does finally happen, I really feel so much better that I've had the discussion about the process, pros and cons of method, arrangements for removal etc. I also know that I will arrange for this particular vet to do it. The joy of a big local practice is that there is always someone there in an emergency, but you can pick and choose your vets. My previous favoured vet went on maternity leave last year and is not returning to practice at the moment, so I had been feeling a little left in the lurch in terms of who I would pick to come out when the option was there. I'm now feeling a lot more settled about the whole thing. Sorry for the ramble, but I just wanted to post this to say that it has made a big difference having an open and frank discussion about the PTS process and it really is worthwhile making plans, even if you think it could be many years ahead. xx

Well done you.

 

[TPO]

Sorry to hear about your pony. I'm glad that your vet was so supportive and able to help you at this difficult time.

Despite, unfortunately, being an old hand at it my current vets, Central Equine Vets, were amazing when I had 2 pts on the same day. Just having every step talked through as it happened was very reassuring. Having had some horrendous experiences with other equine practices it is night and day being with CEV. A good vet practice with vets who are trustworthy really does make a world of difference.

It's a subject that isn't talked about enough; between owners and vets or with other owners. I really do get how upsetting it is and it never gets any easier but I wish I knew the first time I had to have a horse pts what I know now and things would have been very different. I did ask my vet at the time of making the appointment but he was really vague and didn't want to discuss it beyond confirming the method. No other horse person I knew wanted to have a conversation about it because it's upsetting, which I understand but didn't help me. If I'd known then what I know now I'd have realised that the vet done it wrong and could have insisted on different action being taken at the time. So as hard as it is it really is good to talk. There's no shame in PTS and it's not "giving in/up", it's sadly a part of owning any livestock. The BHS helpline, although I've never used it, sounded like a really good idea and something that might also help.

 

[MotherOfChickens]

I'm sorry about your pony. I faced similar with my first horse and melanomas, my vet (who is now at CEV but was then at the vet school) was brilliant and we handled it mainly by email because I couldnt talk about it without being a sobbing mess and didnt want to embarrass him-but he talked me through it and said he would support any decision I made despite it not (yet) being an emergency or even at the point whereby I suspect many might have kept him going for a bit.

 

[Fransurrey]

Completely relate. I spoke at length with the vets I work with and have everything in place. You wouldn't know he'd been ill, now, but I still intend to pts relatively soon and at least know the logistics and what I want to happen.

 

[MiJodsR2BlinkinTite]

So sorry OP that you're in the position and having to think about "the decision".

I've had several who've had to be PTS over the years; unfortunately it doesn't ever get any easier especially if you're a bit soft in the head like me and keep stuff and not sell it on.

I had my two oldies PTS together (like another poster on this thread) on the same day last October; we had the vet they've always had which made it easier for them, and the mare's previous owner came to be with the mare as well.

Agree, it IS something we should all be talking about a lot more; I know there is a support group called "Friends at the End" which supports people (perhaps new owners) who just can't bear to be there and/or feel they need support.

Having a vet you know and trust (and who's dealt with the horse for a good long time) is THE most important thing.

 

[Merrymoles]

Agree with all this. Unfortunately my favourite vet has now become a consultant to his practice and is no longer doing clinical work and this seems to be happening more and more often. I don't feel I've now got a relationship with any particular vet or that any of them "know" my horse at all.

I've been spoilt with two brilliant vets in the past and am missing the long-standing understanding and continuity.

 

[oldie48]

I use a big equine hospital but have a favourite vet whom I like to book for vettings or anything important. Unfortunately I have had to have two horse pts with strangulated colic in the last two years, both completely unexpected and outside normal hours so I had whoever was on on call. I got two vets with the first as I rang a second time in some distress as my horse was in such pain and I was desperate for someone to arrive. The second time I had a different vet. I didn't really know any of the three vets but they were all quite senior in the practice and I felt well supported throughout. I also knew my horses were put out of their pain kindly and effficiently and I am very grateful to them being both professional and caring. It must be the hardest part of being a vet!

 

[pippixox]

When my old boy was very ill nearly 3 years ago (brain abscess that could have been tumour, had to wait and see) the vet who treated him (scoped and xraye) even phoned me at 8pm when I had finished work to talk through options with me. Thankfully it shrank and he is still here today, but as it was very uncertain I needed clarity and a plan

When pony got pts before Christmas it was booked a week in advance before he deteriorated too badly from liver failure, but I had to go with day I could sort childcare rather than day my vet who has treated him (lovely lady who was always happy to give extra advise) was available. So it was a male vet who is co-owner of practise but in the past I’ve found him quite blunt. But he was so kind and did a great job. Vets arranged disposal, they waited out of sight until I was ready. Saved extra hard phone call

Sorry to hear your bad news. I hope you have plenty of quality time left

 

[Pearlsasinger]

Sorry to hear about your pony. I'm glad that your vet was so supportive and able to help you at this difficult time.

Despite, unfortunately, being an old hand at it my current vets, Central Equine Vets, were amazing when I had 2 pts on the same day. Just having every step talked through as it happened was very reassuring. Having had some horrendous experiences with other equine practices it is night and day being with CEV. A good vet practice with vets who are trustworthy really does make a world of difference.

It's a subject that isn't talked about enough; between owners and vets or with other owners. I really do get how upsetting it is and it never gets any easier but I wish I knew the first time I had to have a horse pts what I know now and things would have been very different. I did ask my vet at the time of making the appointment but he was really vague and didn't want to discuss it beyond confirming the method. No other horse person I knew wanted to have a conversation about it because it's upsetting, which I understand but didn't help me. If I'd known then what I know now I'd have realised that the vet done it wrong and could have insisted on different action being taken at the time. So as hard as it is it really is good to talk. There's no shame in PTS and it's not "giving in/up", it's sadly a part of owning any livestock. The BHS helpline, although I've never used it, sounded like a really good idea and something that might also help.

I once suggested that we ask either the local Equine Crem or a vet or both to give a short talk about pts to our RC. It didn't happen because a committee member (who didn't actually have her own horse) thought it would be too upsetting. It wasn't intended to be for my benefit, I've unfortunately had to go through the experience several times but I did think that it could have been useful for many members.

 

[nikicb]

Thank you for all the replies. I'm sorry to hear of so many losses, but it looks like most have been dealt with sensitively. I'm not a stranger to death. Other than many pets over the years, I have been with people at the end, including my sister last March. I think it is the 'falling' that I am most worried about experiencing with horses. Much against what I thought I would choose, I think I am steering towards shooting with this pony. He is a sharp bright one, and needed extra sedation for his biopsy. My lovely vet said that he was happy for owners to walk away and leave him to deal with holding and shooting, but much as I don't really want to be there, I have less connection with this pony than some of my others, and think it would be better to see it this time round as a first time, than with one of my others. I hope that doesn't come across badly. In the meantime, the pony is happy and healthy. I've just ordered a hackamore so he can still go out to PC parties. I just need to watch out for the tumour becoming ulcerated or him beginning to drop condition. No sign of either at the moment. xx

 

[Pearlsasinger]

I prefer to have the horse shot, tbh. I have been present for both methods and although when the horse is shot, there is some blood, it's not a great deal and death is instantaneous for the horse, which particularly with an elderly horse and in some cases of illness, is not the case with the injection. We don't have the vet to shoot, though, we have had the hunt and the Equine Crematorium, who are far more used to shooting than a vet.
Whichever method you choose, ime it is the loss of the horse which is most upsetting and the method doesn't really make much difference to the owner.
As you say, though, when you have sat with family members at the end, you are no stranger to death. I am just glad that we can make it easier for animals. I am sorry about the loss of your sister.