Race fixingf?

[Merry Crisis]

Ok you racing experts, what are your opinions on the Old Roan chase at Aintree this afternoon. I think that it was a fixed race to get Masterminded down in the handicap. I dont think Ruby rode him out, nor did he give him a good ride.

 

[Elf On A Shelf]

I just think the horse doesn't stay 3 miles simple as. Never thought it would and never think it will in the future. I do however think that Nichols ruins his horses by overworking them. His very, very good horses have managed to cope to an extent but the work load does appear to be catching up on them these days - Kauto Star, Denman, Master Minded - all shadows of their former selves. If you look into it, Nichols has very few horses over the age of 8 in his yard - they are worked very hard and raced alot when younger to see if they are going to cut it.

Katuo Star, Denman, Master Minded, Big Bucks, they have all been an absolute inspiration to racing and have really got more fo the public involved in it - how can they not when plastered across the front pages of most newpapers in March for 3 years was "Kauto VS Denman - Clash Of The Titans". But to me they clearly look on a downward spiral as age is making itself known.

I honestly don't think it was a trick to get his mark down, he just didn't look like a shadow of his former self to me at any stage in the race.

 

[Little Squirrel]

Think it was public schooling more than anything.

 

[be positive]

I just think the horse doesn't stay 3 miles simple as. Never thought it would and never think it will in the future. I do however think that Nichols ruins his horses by overworking them. His very, very good horses have managed to cope to an extent but the work load does appear to be catching up on them these days - Kauto Star, Denman, Master Minded - all shadows of their former selves. If you look into it, Nichols has very few horses over the age of 8 in his yard - they are worked very hard and raced alot when younger to see if they are going to cut it.

Katuo Star, Denman, Master Minded, Big Bucks, they have all been an absolute inspiration to racing and have really got more fo the public involved in it - how can they not when plastered across the front pages of most newpapers in March for 3 years was "Kauto VS Denman - Clash Of The Titans". But to me they clearly look on a downward spiral as age is making itself known.

As I am very local to PN and hear some gossip and see the horses out regularly, they do work very hard the hill is steep and most go up 3 times every day even the horses aimed for 2 mile hurdles, they rarely seem to do any short, sharp work which may, I feel, be more appropriate for a horse doing shorter trips.
He must be doing something right as he gets the results the owners want, but as said not many of his horses last and have long careers, the exceptions seem to be the "stable stars"
Some of the horses did not, apparently, do well over the summer break, and some did look poor early on when they were seen out on the roads, one top horse got very bad sunburn that must have pulled it down imo.
To the big yards it is sadly becoming more and more of a numbers game, if you chuck enough money at it you will get the results, the horses long term welfare is not as important as the need for the winners to maintain the yards high profile that then attracts more money from other owners jumping on the bandwagon.

 

[Phoebe]

I find the whole thing a bit strange. He tends to put info on fb that doesn't necessarily play out on the track. And I think denman and ks will be bookies favourites this year through sentimental betting, and the fact the PN bigs them up prior to a race. And I speak from bitter experience, sentimentally going on denman at aintree last year when he clearly hates the track!
Silly mistake.

 

[Miss L Toe]

Race fixing, I don't think so, the big races are not using a handicap system, but I tend to think that horses have only so many winning races in them, and whether one wants to have winners at the age of seven, or a career to keep them going is a moot point.
Some trainers, I would not send my dog to, as they want to win win win as long as the thing can walk round the parade ring, others look at the horse as having a career.
Have a look at the career of Marked Man , MacGreggor, and Super Coin [ Richard Lee], and then so many potentially good horses kept by other West Country trainers.. weep

 

[Miss L Toe]

Ok you racing experts, what are your opinions on the Old Roan chase at Aintree this afternoon. I think that it was a fixed race to get Masterminded down in the handicap. I dont think Ruby rode him out, nor did he give him a good ride.

Ruby is a top rider, he does not "school" horses when they can win a race. Who in the world dares criticise a world class jock!!!

 

[Dobiegirl]

You are having a laugh, horse wasnt as fit as expected,jumped to the right so maybe feeling his old rib injury,had a good blow after the race.

A lot of PNs horses are running into places so I presume the are not fully wound up yet, also Master Minded can run the odd duff race so I would not be too worried, will be interested to hear what Pns has to say.

 

[Racergirl]

He was never really going - certainally never jumping, but as said above - he does throw in the odd duff run from time to time.

Yesterday was 2 mile 4, be interesting to see if they still aim him at the King George - if hes going to get 3 miles anywhere Id have said it would be Kempton,though if hes good enough to beat Long Run round Kempton (let alone anyhwere else!) remains to be seen. Id say not,which saddens me somewhat,cos I loved MM when I met him at the yard - it was lovely to see such a good horse so relaxed and demanding kisses!!

 

[LadyRascasse]

Sorry but to say PN horses don't last long in racing is bull! Both Kauto and Denman are 11 which for a racehorse is pretty good. Best mate died at 10, Dessie retired at 12, Monet Garden retired at 12, Inglis Drever retired at 9, thoses are off the top of my head. so if both horses run this season they will also be 12! not forgetting Tricky Trickster who has what most people thought was a fatal injured but has been nursed back to health and is expected to run this season.

Master Minded doesn't always run his best and I expect will see him back soon with a better performance but to say Ruby didn't ride him is rubbish, he was clearly tired and Ruby rode him well. Also Ruby can't afford a 10 day ban for whipping him to much.

 

[Merry Crisis]

PN thinks only of march, so I do think that the race yesterday was a prep race. It is very early in the season and there are limited races for class horses, I dont think he went to the races as a contender.