really nervous horse

[jeruselem5]

hi,
one of our horses which weve had for a few weeks takes food from us at full stretch but wont allow us to stroke or brush or touch her and backs of with the slightest movement towards her.
we think she may have been abused before we got her?
whats the best way to overcome this shyness?

thanks

 

[soulfull]

It doesn't mean she has been abused just because she won't allow you to touch her

Do you have experience?

You don't say what she was like when you went to view her or what if anything she has done, age etc

Presuming she isn't off the hills or straight out of breeders field?

Sounds like you need to find a way to catch her. Personally If she has been stabled previously then I would keep her in for a few days and spend as much time with her as possible. Don't 'pussy foot' around her as this will make her worse.

 

[jeruselem5]

my partner has a lot of experience from years ago. getting back up to speed currently.

when we viewed her she was shy but we assumed this was as we were new to her. she is six and a half.
the previous owner told us that she was being bullied by the larger horses which we saw an example when she went for feed she was snapped at by the others then she backed away.
she gets on well with our 3 year old. they dont leave each others side often.
when we groom the 3 year old who loves it she shows interest and comes close but shys away behind the younger one.
we've havnt tried to push her into anything as shes getting used to her new home.
But were not sure how long before we have to impose ourselves and try harder with her?

 

[soulfull]

Personally if she had been used to being handles by previous owner I would be insisting on contact before now.

 

[jeruselem5]

yes. ok
thanks.

 

[soulfull]

if you struggle to get her to listen it would be worth getting an instructor to come and help, sooner rather than later too

good luck

 

[Urban Horse]

hi,
one of our horses which weve had for a few weeks takes food from us at full stretch but wont allow us to stroke or brush or touch her and backs of with the slightest movement towards her.
we think she may have been abused before we got her?
whats the best way to overcome this shyness?

thanks

At the moment, you're rewarding her for staying away from you.... she's starting to think that in order to get the treat she has to keep clear of you.

 

[Palindrome]

At the moment, you're rewarding her for staying away from you.... she's starting to think that in order to get the treat she has to keep clear of you.

She would only think that if she had a previous bad experience.

It sounds like she hasn't been handled much. I would get a riding instructor to come and help handle her as it will be much faster if she has a good experience from the start. He could also possibly lunge her and assess if she has issues from past abuse or is in pain.

 

[jeruselem5]

tried to get near her today and failed. she spots the rope or collar straight away and just skips away im sure she thinks its a follow me game!
just stays at full stretch sniffing distance. as soon as she sees your foot move towards her she spins and skips off with head up!
looks like we may need the help of a pro. just cant see how theyll start, wish i had a fresh alternative approach.

 

[Urban Horse]

She would only think that if she had a previous bad experience.

It sounds like she hasn't been handled much. I would get a riding instructor to come and help handle her as it will be much faster if she has a good experience from the start. He could also possibly lunge her and assess if she has issues from past abuse or is in pain.

She is doing exactly what she thinks is expected of her.... she is being given a reward for stretching her neck towards her new owner (refer to fburtons replies on the thread that, I think, refers to treats and a biting horse). Horses are far faster than humans about making these associations in their minds, and once the association is made, she has to go through an entirely new learning experience of actually moving closer before the reward is given.

Were she my mare, I'd be inclined to make her approach closer by going very passive and making her work out for herself, how to get the reward... as I'm physically quite large, this approach I find to be particularly effective with smaller horses and ponies, going passive and small makes them feel far less threatened, and more likely to come closer.

Getting help, as you say, may well be the ideal solution, but at this stage I wouldn't lunge, as that's something that has to be learned by the horse and at this stage of her life I'd be inclined to say that it might be a little too advanced for her, and cause more problems than it solves... added to which lunging won't tell you if a horse has been abused... there are plently more signs to look out for well before then.

It sounds like the OP is doing fairly well already, and whether the horse has been abused or not, is largely irrelevant... the tactics used in starting and unhandled horse, and a horse that has previously suffered abuse are broadly similar. Time and trust are the key elements in both cases.

 

[Palindrome]

tried to get near her today and failed. she spots the rope or collar straight away and just skips away im sure she thinks its a follow me game!
just stays at full stretch sniffing distance. as soon as she sees your foot move towards her she spins and skips off with head up!
looks like we may need the help of a pro. just cant see how theyll start, wish i had a fresh alternative approach.

It might take several people holding ropes to get her to a corner and then someone go in and put the headcollar, but that's a last resort really. What happens when you take away the youngster? Do you have a stable or small paddock where you could keep her once you have caught her and while you are getting her used to be handled? If you need to keep a headcollar on her, there are fieldsafe/breakaway headcollar that will break if she gets caught on something with it, that's much safer than using a nylon headcollar (some people also use a cheap leather headcollar as leather will also break).

It sounds like the OP is doing fairly well already, and whether the horse has been abused or not, is largely irrelevant... the tactics used in starting and unhandled horse, and a horse that has previously suffered abuse are broadly similar. Time and trust are the key elements in both cases.

I haven't seen other threads but it is very relevant to know if horse has been abused or is unhandled. An abused horse can for example completely freak out when seeing a whip, an unhandled horse just won't know what it is.


ETA: it sometimes help if you don't look the horse in the eyes when you go in to catch, but don't go sheepishly either as they then think something is not right.

 

[Guerrero]

Rather than letting her take a treat outstretched could you take a step back so she has to step towards you, even if it's only a small step then reward? It'd be a bad idea with a pushy horse but might work with a nervous one

 

[jeruselem5]

if the youngster moves from her sight she panics and runs to find her. we have a couple of small areas but dont really want to corner her (but it may come to that). earlier when i walked towards her as my partner closed in slowly from another direction and she jumped away quite fast and violently.
will just keep trying the slow calm approach for a bit
tried standing and looking away showing no interest and she came sniffing around my pockets but slightest movement and shes off.
struggling to take their attention away from starring at rabbits and cats in the field tonight. they both stand totally still intently watching them from 50-100 yards away! dont think they were scared, just fascinated!

 

[Urban Horse]

if the youngster moves from her sight she panics and runs to find her. we have a couple of small areas but dont really want to corner her (but it may come to that). earlier when i walked towards her as my partner closed in slowly from another direction and she jumped away quite fast and violently.will just keep trying the slow calm approach for a bit
tried standing and looking away showing no interest and she came sniffing around my pockets but slightest movement and shes off.
struggling to take their attention away from starring at rabbits and cats in the field tonight. they both stand totally still intently watching them from 50-100 yards away! dont think they were scared, just fascinated!

That's because as a group of two, you were being a little too 'predatory' for her. Like humans, horses have a 'personal space' that they like to maintain, but unlike ours, theirs is divided into two regions, which when viewed from above would roughly resemble two ovals. When you get close to the outer oval the horse starts to pay attention to you, but rarely feels the need to move away. However, when you reach the inner oval, the horse feels the need to move away...often at speed. With an unhandled or feral horse these ovals are obviously much larger than they are with our domesticated horses who have given their permission for you to enter the inner oval at any time... that is part of the trusting relationship that should be in place between any horse and its handler.

There are numerous sites on the web, and many books that give methods, hints and tips about catching horses... sadly without seeing you and the horse in the flesh, I honestly can't say which would work best for the pair of you, so it might be a case of search the web, then try the method described until you find one that works for you. Good Luck.

 

[Urban Horse]

It might take several people holding ropes to get her to a corner and then someone go in and put the headcollar, but that's a last resort really. What happens when you take away the youngster? Do you have a stable or small paddock where you could keep her once you have caught her and while you are getting her used to be handled? If you need to keep a headcollar on her, there are fieldsafe/breakaway headcollar that will break if she gets caught on something with it, that's much safer than using a nylon headcollar (some people also use a cheap leather headcollar as leather will also break).



I haven't seen other threads but it is very relevant to know if horse has been abused or is unhandled. An abused horse can for example completely freak out when seeing a whip, an unhandled horse just won't know what it is.

ETA: it sometimes help if you don't look the horse in the eyes when you go in to catch, but don't go sheepishly either as they then think something is not right.

I very rarely use whips in training, and certainly woudn't dream of carrying one in the very earliest stages of building a relationship with a horse.

One of the biggest mistakes that a lot of horse people make is to worry too much about abuse. Abuse can take many forms... mental, physical, underfeeding or even overfeeding and within each category an individual horse will carry completely different mental scars to another horse rescued from the same place at the same time. When we worry too much about the horse's background we unconciously change our body language and mental processes and that's not good for either the horse or you. After spending many years re-training abused horses, I found that the best method was not to be told anything about the horse's previous life, but just work with the horse that was in front of me. All the horse wants is to re-start its life, become a well loved member of its new herd, and be treated in the same way as the rest.

 

[AdorableAlice]

OP, you are making life difficult for yourself. All you need to do is, with help, separate the horse and drive it into a stable that has a deep bed and plenty of hay. Book some time off work, get a deck chair and a book and settle yourself down in the stable. Ignore the horse and wait for it to make contact with you, do not use titbits.

It will take as long as it takes and then you can move onto to getting a leather headcollar on with a length of rope left on the halter. When you feel the horse is ready to go back out put it with a friendly companion or two in a small paddock. The companions will come to you and bring the baby with them. Have a look at my young horse thread, my next equine project. The first few pages detail how I dealt with a petrified Shire.

 

[Exploding Chestnuts]

How did the horse get to you OP, my guess is that force was involved and this is the outcome.
I agree with the stabling, but with a companion alongside and it can't be a permanent situation.
My foal was uncatchable without force for nearly two months even though it had a foal slip with a bit of a rope end on it, it took 6 weeks before I got a lead rope attached over the stable door, and all went fine after that.
She had no curiosity when I sat in the stable reading as she was with the mare who sheltered her from me.
But if you can stable that is one route to handling, do not feed unless she comes to you, I would use a bucket rather than a stretched hand to begin with. It is essential to set up a daily routine, so that your approach is consistent and this is less scary for any young horse.
The bonding with another cn be used to help you, but be aware that at some time they need to be separated.