really worrying behaviour - need advice/thoughts please :(

[sophiebailey]

Hi guys - this might be a bit long winded but want to give you all the facts!!!

Problem - my usually placid, wimpy, bottom of the herd 20 year old gelding today spent 20 minutes chasing down the 12hh pony he was in the field with before cornering him, knocking him over and trying to trample him - traumatic and disturbing, had to hit him with an electric fencing stake to get him to stop trampling and jumping/rearing on the ponies neck :-(

He has NEVER displayed an ounce of aggression since i've had him. He will pull faces but has never kicked out or bitten another horse so this has really shocked me!

The back story - Bailey has been in with Mare 1 since end of october on their own. Due to waterlogged pony field, 12hh pony (gelding) and 12hh pony (mare) have had to bunk with Bailey & Mare 1. They were introduced on Xmas Eve. Bailey didn't bother with them at all but ponies spent all day pushing him off his hay pile and chasing him.

Horses all in Xmas Day (all day) with double feed, double hay and xmas carrot treats.

Horses turned out this morning (boxing day), Bailey goes nuts straight away and attacks gelding pony (chases mare pony but doesn't bite her).

What could of caused my usually placid boy to do this? I was very shocked and upset as was the woman who owns pony. He was wringing wet afterwards and really off - wouldn't let me near him in the field for half hour and was trotting around like a fairy.

I thought it could have been him getting territorial over his mare, any ideas? So worried because it's just not like him, he's the easiest going dobbin you could ever meet and usually when the others are having a little fight he'll run to the gate to try and hide

Any input welcome! please help

 

[Honey08]

Perhaps it was pent up energy due to having extra food the same day that you didn't turn out ~(pretty silly plan really!!) and the fact that they had barely met. That combined with the fact that he is an older gelding and some of them get a bit riggy around mares, herding them away from other horses (I've had a few older chaps go like that over the years). Perhaps the new pony got in the way?

 

[sophiebailey]

So it is quite common for geldings to get possessive? I didn't have a choice about not turning out yard rules so he had extra hay to make up for the grass he couldn't have. I did wonder too about his energy levels, but with him being old he's usually very lazy no matter how much he's had to eat and how much turnout he's had

 

[Pearlsasinger]

How scary/worrying for you!

My guess is that Bailey got fed up of being chased off the hay and wasn't going to let it happen again. I also wonder if he had too much energy from being given his normal feed on Xmas Day, without t/o.

To avoid any more trouble, could you split the field with electric fencing and put the 2 ponies into one half and Bailey and his companion in the other half?

 

[sophiebailey]

They're separated now but he's still very grumpy over the fencing to them!! I can understand him chasing them around due to high energy levels because he had no chance to burn it off on Xmas Day, it was just the massive amount of aggression I couldn't get my head around when he's usually such a soft touch it's this that's worried me I suppose, thank you for your inputs I appreciate your advice xxx

 

[Honey08]

They can often get possessive.

More hay when they are in is one thing, double hard feed is not a good plan - it should be decreased when they're not exercising. I'd have at least taken him for a ride or walk out in hand, but thats a whole other thread!!

I agree, definately section him off from the others if you can..

 

[sophiebailey]

Okay I get where you're coming from. He was turned out for 10 mins on Xmas Morning while we mucked out and then we took him for a walk down the lane to the house for some carrots and back so he did stretch his legs for half an hour xxx

 

[rockysmum]

My old gelding is usually a soft touch, he lets the two mares get away with most things. I have only seen him show real aggresive behaviour a couple of times.

The first was in his mid twenties, he only had one of the mares with him then. Another gelding jumped into his field and started chasing the mare. He actually went for it and landed a couple of serious kicks, he would have done more damage if it had not been faster than him.

The other time was when a little shetland was in with him, he put up with weeks of it standing between his front legs and eating his food (it finished its own first). One day he just turned, picked it up in his teeth by the neck, gave it a good shake and threw it away. Luckily the little guy got up, and being a shitland went back for more

So I suppose any horse will have its limits and it sounds like yours reached his. Its difficult if you cant identify why.

 

[sophiebailey]

Thanks Rocky's mum. I concluded today it was a combination of territorial display/high energy gone wrong but wondered if any of you clever horsey people had some insights into behaviour like this and luckily you do! I'm glad (without sounding awful) that yours has done something similar, i'm not AS convinced he's the spawn of the devil now thanks xxxxx

 

[Pearlsasinger]

No real harm done then. It just shows that even the most laid back can be pushed too far.
Just a note for future reference though, if it's necessary to keep him in his hard feed should be reduced/cut out.

 

[Stacey6897]

My usually placid, gentle gelding went for my mare the second day they were turned out, wasn't nearly as bad as yours but was quite shocking, they'd previously got on well but never shared a field, I turned them out together and they were fine but on the second day he chased her and bit her, ripping her rug.

I've put it down to him being possessive of me, so I go see him first, then tell him stand when I go see her, or drop carrots on the ground

 

[Foxhunter49]

Often when a horse is at the bottom of the pecking order and finds that he can boss something then they will really go for it and beat the heck out of whatever he can.

 

[Rose Folly]

I don't think it has much to do with the extra feed, or keeping in, though that was unfortunate.

You've got a straightforward case of jealousy, territorialism etc. It can be very scary, and needs to be dealt with competently.

A livery horse I had here for a couple of years was just as you describe. He was the most laid back of souls with the horses who were in residence when he came. He was simply appalling with other new horses when they first came. He hunted them down, cornered them and attacked them. This was depsite all the usual formalities having taken place. They would be gradually introduced from separate paddocks etc. He would appear to be fine when they were eventually in together (we use herd 24/7 grazing) then suddenly he'd flip his lid and go crazy.

He would behave the same way if a horse left the herd for any length of time. He appeared to forget he knew them. A little Dartmoor mare went away for a month. When she came back she was overjoyed to see her old companions, and they her, but the nutter hunted her down and drove her under the road bridge that spans the stream as it leaves our field (luckily good clearance). She was saved by my cob mare - the herd matriarch - who stormed in and drove the attacker off (very impressive as we humans couldn't get near them).

In most cases it's geldings jealous over mares, but it does work the other way round as well. You need to take precautions that your firend's pony is not victimised any more, whatever grazing problems etc. it may cause you at this time of year.