Recovering vets costs

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angelish

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Hi 👋
Just wondering if it is possible to recover the cost of vets fees from another horses owner due to a kick
Horse has now required vet treatment 3 times now from a kick by another nasty horse in the field , horse is known to kick other horses and is the only other horse in the field with shoes on
My horse in now on box rest again with lost entry frees and a rather large vets bill for stitches on a bank holiday weekend :(
Has anyone successfully claimed from another horses owner/insurance
Both horses are insured
Just to add I have asked to move fields I'm unwilling to put my horse back in there to be kicked again
Thanks
 
Thanks for replying
Sorry wasn't very clear I didn't know it to be like that when I originally put my horse in that field or I wouldn't have put her in there , since she's been in there it has now become clear that the horse is just plain nasty and will kick
I now know it is likely to kick so she won't be going back in the field with it as quite rightly I would know the risk and invalidate my insurance likely
May even mean a yard move tbh as owner won't remove horses hind shoes and YO is reluctant to have a horse on its own (fair enough) as they haven't the grassing but me moving mine won't really solve that problem as understandably no one wants to share with that particular horse now
 
I agree with amymay. I did once have a fellow livery try to get vet costs from me but as it turned out that she hadn't called the vet until after the hack, when she said that my mare had kicked hers as she collected her from the field, I cut her off pretty quickly. You would have to prove negligence on the part of the other horse's owner, which you can't. You accepted the risk in putting your horse back into the field after the first kick.
 
Probably the best you could do would be to talk to your insurance company. If they want to try a cost sharing arrangement with the other company then that is something they are quite used to sorting out for themselves. Liability under the Animal Act is strict which would mean in theory you should have a chance of making a claim through the small claims court - but in practice you would almost certainly find the horse world too small for you. There is no harm in asking of course - but I'm not sure any YO would then let you livery with them as the risk of getting sued - whether you won or not - would just be too great.
 
You assumed the risk when you put the horse in the field .
It’s a management problem on the yard though which the manager or owner should get and sort .
 
It's a risk you take owning horses. Unless you are prepared to turn your horse out on individual turnout for the rest of it's life, you need to be prepared for injuries. Accidents happen and for all you know they could have been playing, just abit rough.
 
It us unfortunate but it's just part of owning horses if they are kept in groups on livery, if the horse is known to kick and the yo and owner are aware they should have not put other horses out with it, when I ran a yard I had a few that were just plain nasty to other horses so they went out alone.
 
Who turned your horse out in the field? If the horse is a known kicker and you weren’t warned the YO could possibly be negligent, but they could argue that all horses are kickers, they all have the potential anyway so you should have been aware of the risk.

Someone I know nearly lost her horse because of a kick, but apart from being more careful in future, didn’t think anyone had been negligent for it to happen.
 
Like others have sadly said its a risk you take. Mine got kicked years ago, actually had a fractured bit of bone come of the tibia. The vet stapled and told me to turn out and ride after a few days for the bruising to go down but I could see after a few days she was lamer than she should have been for a simple bruised bone so I got the vet out to xray when the fracture was found. Luckily the actual place where contact had been made and the cut stapled hadn't hit the main nerve which I was warned it could have caused her to not be able to extend her leg fully and she had a few weeks box rest until the sequesta was absorbed by the body and she was sound again.

Since then she's been on individual turnout with neighbours on both sides and is able to interact with them over the fence to a degree. I much prefer individual turnout, so many more yards are going this way these days, I don't know of many in our area that actually have horses in herds as common practice. Most owners prefer individual turnout for the safety factor.

I hope your horse makes a full recovery soon.
 
After having vets bills of over 10K and years of time off from other people's horses injuring mine I now will NEVER turn my horses out with other people's. Others may think that is mean but I don't want to be spending thousands of pounds due to other people.
 
Thank you all for the replies I did think as much but another livery planted a seed that I may be able to claim some help in paying the bill from the horses owner
I don't really want to get into suing the YO etc
I except accidents happen and in my opinion once would be an accident this is the 3rd time the horse is nasty it will spin and double barrel lashing out for no reason without so much as putting its ears back so they get no warning
Sadly if the YO is unwilling to separate this horse I will just have to look around for another yard as I'm not willing to risk my horse again
 
hopscotch bandit said:
Like others have sadly said its a risk you take. Mine got kicked years ago, actually had a fractured bit of bone come of the tibia. The vet stapled and told me to turn out and ride after a few days for the bruising to go down but I could see after a few days she was lamer than she should have been for a simple bruised bone so I got the vet out to xray when the fracture was found. Luckily the actual place where contact had been made and the cut stapled hadn't hit the main nerve which I was warned it could have caused her to not be able to extend her leg fully and she had a few weeks box rest until the sequesta was absorbed by the body and she was sound again.

Since then she's been on individual turnout with neighbours on both sides and is able to interact with them over the fence to a degree. I much prefer individual turnout, so many more yards are going this way these days, I don't know of many in our area that actually have horses in herds as common practice. Most owners prefer individual turnout for the safety factor.

I hope your horse makes a full recovery soon.
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I'm sorry to hear that about your horse
Luckily she's just had to have a few stitches as it had hit a small blood vessel it looked more dramatic than it was
It could have been so much worse
 
angelish said:
Thank you all for the replies I did think as much but another livery planted a seed that I may be able to claim some help in paying the bill from the horses owner
I don't really want to get into suing the YO etc
I except accidents happen and in my opinion once would be an accident this is the 3rd time the horse is nasty it will spin and double barrel lashing out for no reason without so much as putting its ears back so they get no warning
Sadly if the YO is unwilling to separate this horse I will just have to look around for another yard as I'm not willing to risk my horse again
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You have to do what is best for you and your horse.

In years gone by my horses would all have been out in shod herds. I actually got lucky and had no major accidents or vets bills from kicks.

As the years have gone on and I have had more expensive horses for competition I have become far more precious about them. I still firmly believe that group turnout is best but unfortunately it is difficult to control on livery. These days anything shod behind is on individual turnout with a conscious effort to give them unshod group ‘holidays’ to be a horse.

Ironically the only time I have incurred vets bills from a kick was about this time last year when another livery caused mayhem by running through a line of electric fence and a number of individually paddocked horses getting loose. Cost me about £700 to deal with the choke (tubing) and wallop to the hock (X-ray, steroid and a month off).
 
angelish said:
Thank you all for the replies I did think as much but another livery planted a seed that I may be able to claim some help in paying the bill from the horses owner
I don't really want to get into suing the YO etc
I except accidents happen and in my opinion once would be an accident this is the 3rd time the horse is nasty it will spin and double barrel lashing out for no reason without so much as putting its ears back so they get no warning
Sadly if the YO is unwilling to separate this horse I will just have to look around for another yard as I'm not willing to risk my horse again
Click to expand...
I think you are being very sensible and hope you find somewhere soon where your horse is safe.
 
I am surprised that other liveries haven't taken exception to a known kicker being out with back shoes on in the herd.
Its really an issue for the YO- but if they won't deal with it, unfortunately you will have to do the right thing for your horse.
Hope she gets well soon
 
Thank you all
She so precious to me (as is hopefully everyone's horses) I don't have a lot of money to spend on horses and manage to strike really lucky to find her and she's turning out to be my dream horse that I'll never be able to replace , I just won't be that lucky again :(
At the same time I don't want her to live a life of solitude in a paddock on her own and that just isn't an option in my area anyway , the best I can hope for is for the YO to move the other horse out or ask the owner to remove its back shoes
Looking for another yard is an option but the best I could hoped for round here turnout wise would be mares and geldings seperate and I wouldn't know if I'd be putting her in the same situation
It's just a nightmare
 
I have a pony here on livery she has bullied and kicked other horses several times so now she's in her own field there's no way I would risk other horses just so she can be out with others.
 
You could approach the YO/horse owner and ask if it could be done through your insurance companies, then it wouldn't be personal, but let them sort it out. That is why we have insurance. TBH, I don't think you will succeed but it might be worth a go.
 
Does the horse regularly kick all the horses in the group?
Again I am pro group turn out when ever possible, but some horses are better in just a pair or careful group if they are kickers I feel. I used to know a horse who would only get on with one other. He would injure any others. So of course yard owner kept only them together (luckily you could basically tell over the fence if this horse would dislike them and also knowing the personality of the other horse).

Accidents happen and some horses will be dominant (I have a mare who is always the most dominant, but she just has to threaten and touch wood has never seriously injured another horse and I’ve had her in different groups for 9 years, she actually helps keep herds in order!) but this is not acceptable
 
pippixox said:
Does the horse regularly kick all the horses in the group?
Again I am pro group turn out when ever possible, but some horses are better in just a pair or careful group if they are kickers I feel. I used to know a horse who would only get on with one other. He would injure any others. So of course yard owner kept only them together (luckily you could basically tell over the fence if this horse would dislike them and also knowing the personality of the other horse).

Accidents happen and some horses will be dominant (I have a mare who is always the most dominant, but she just has to threaten and touch wood has never seriously injured another horse and I’ve had her in different groups for 9 years, she actually helps keep herds in order!) but this is not acceptable
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She's kicked mine 3-4 times in about 18 months (one time wasn't 100% sure it was her to be fair) she runs backwards double barrelling and screaming
My horse doesn't try to challenge her for top boss or anything I think she's just been in the wrong place at the wrong time :(
She has been seen to try and kick others they have just been a bit quicker to get out of the way
This time the owner had left the horse muzzled for nearly 24hrs and I think she's lashed out at mine out of frustration
 
Your have no chance, horses will be horses at the end of the day. Move yards or don't turn her out if its that bad.. thats the answer your get, i'd put money on it, unfortunately. :(

I speak from experience, I was previously at a yard with 16 mares turned out in one big paddock. ONE mare was a chronic kicker, for no reason and was really a nasty type. She put mine on box rest and 2 others from bad kicks within a few weeks. The YO wasn't interested and said horses would be horses. Owner was vile and no help at all, wasn't worth a court case for a £500 bill. My mare then got her back a few weeks later, apparently someone saw her do it, right on the bone emergency vet etc obviously I didn't pay the bill either but the owner wasn't happy.

I'd look into moving yards.. it takes the fun out of it when they're constantly being kicked or you're terrified what your turn up to!

I was always pro herd turnout, but I have had SUCH bad luck I'll never turn my horses out again in a herd. One of my gelding has a permanent muscle damage (looks awful and won't ever heal as the muscle is damaged itself) to the side of his neck from a bad kick, he was grazing and was simply kicked for no reason by another. My mare was covered in scars too and was on box rest multiple times for injury.
I'm on a yard now with pairs/individual turnout (well big 3 acre field for my 2 geldings) and its heaven. They don't care about being in a field with other horses, they have each other and friends next door. I haven't had a single kick injury since moving them to the new yard, funny that!
 
angelish said:
Thank you all
She so precious to me (as is hopefully everyone's horses) I don't have a lot of money to spend on horses and manage to strike really lucky to find her and she's turning out to be my dream horse that I'll never be able to replace , I just won't be that lucky again :(
At the same time I don't want her to live a life of solitude in a paddock on her own and that just isn't an option in my area anyway , the best I can hope for is for the YO to move the other horse out or ask the owner to remove its back shoes
Looking for another yard is an option but the best I could hoped for round here turnout wise would be mares and geldings seperate and I wouldn't know if I'd be putting her in the same situation
It's just a nightmare
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I have looked after numerous horses over the years and most got turned out together most of the time without issue, as a yo it's just a case of knowing the horses and pairing them up accordingly then most live quite happily, you do get the odd one that is the exception and then they go out on there own, if your current yo won't let you move field or remove the kicker I would find another yard.
 
We have always had our horses on herd turnout even my 2* (now 3*) competition horses. I personally wouldn’t have mine on individual, maybe paired at a push but still wouldn’t be keen. YO should step up IMO, if we have a horse on the yard that has been known to kick or shows any aggression the YO tells them that the back shoes have to come off or it’s not allowed back out. We’ve had no kick injuries in 7 years *runs off to find some wood to touch* of course it helps that the herd is well established and they have plenty of space to get away from each other. Sorry I think once a horse goes out in the field it’s not possible to claim vets fees back. I would only expect to pay/be paid vet fees if a horse kicked another whilst the owner was in control of it at the time i.e. riding or leading, otherwise it’s probably best to just find somewhere else to keep your horse
 
angelish said:
She's kicked mine 3-4 times in about 18 months (one time wasn't 100% sure it was her to be fair) she runs backwards double barrelling and screaming
My horse doesn't try to challenge her for top boss or anything I think she's just been in the wrong place at the wrong time :(
She has been seen to try and kick others they have just been a bit quicker to get out of the way
This time the owner had left the horse muzzled for nearly 24hrs and I think she's lashed out at mine out of frustration
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I think the fact that you’ve been turning your horse out with this one for 18 months, despite it kicking yours on several occasions, negates any claim you could have potentially had.
 
Horrible situation and yes of course it happens from time to time with mixed herds so really not something you can ask other owner to chip in with vet costs IMO. I think you plan to move to another yard in view of YO's refusal to put either this renegade in its own paddock, or give you your own is probably the best outcome.

Just a small point here - thinking if horses have their back shoes removed then none of the herd will suffer serious injury is just ridiculous. I have seen a herd of unshod horses with a particularly aggressive gelding double barrel another field mate right in the head between the eyes. the other poor horse dropped dead like a stone, admittedly probably an unusual occurrence but dont underestimate the velocity of a very aggressive horse determined to assert its dominance over other field horses even without shoes.
 
angelish said:
Hi 👋
Just wondering if it is possible to recover the cost of vets fees from another horses owner due to a kick
Horse has now required vet treatment 3 times now from a kick by another nasty horse in the field , horse is known to kick other horses and is the only other horse in the field with shoes on
My horse in now on box rest again with lost entry frees and a rather large vets bill for stitches on a bank holiday weekend :(
Has anyone successfully claimed from another horses owner/insurance
Both horses are insured
Just to add I have asked to move fields I'm unwilling to put my horse back in there to be kicked again
Thanks
Click to expand...
I been in your shoes, and my mare got a fractured splint bone in 19 pieces, I just had to suck it up but nearly lost my mare. She went onto box rest, and when turned out 3 more times over the up coming weeks , she got kicked another 2 times ontop of the surgery place, in the end I kept her on box rest 4 months till we moved, walking and lunging only



Personally in your shoes I would
a. ask not to be in the field with this horse
b. move it is not worth your horse being fatally kicked.
c. see if they can take the shoes off the kicker (prob wont though)

It would be different if someone turned your horse out with a kicker while away like a girl I knew who had the owner of the yard turn the girls mare out and then turned the kicker out, her mare got kicked, and no one knew how bad till she went up on the morning of moving to my yard, and found the rubber mats everywhere and the horse standing there with one leg hanging. He had got down after 3 days of standing, and in the process of getting up the leg shattered. RIP Alfie. This happened a while ago but still happened.

To add this kicker should be on it's own - I would insist this or ask them to move to a yard where they do individual turnout. This may not be the only horse injured then it comes on the yard owner not to keep All horses safe.
 
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I don’t think you can claim at this point. You knowingly put your horse back out with one known to be a nasty kicker.

I used to be rabidly pro group turnout, but after being on livery I can see why people don’t (I used to have my own place) and I currently have one on individual turnout on livery.

My lad is on individual turnout because whilst he is not a kicker he can be somewhat of a bully. I do not want him to hurt anything nor him to be hurt because he drove another horse to the point of retaliation.


If your YO won’t do individual turnout for your horse or for the kicker then you need to move yard.
 
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