Redwings potential closure

Such sad news.
My little Shetland found on side of road by a local charity which went bust was transferred to Redwings ownership. They are so lovely but their field officer who used to come out to see her had to stop his visits due to funding issues. We now email vax and dental records.
Unfortunately this has meant that some unscrupulous people have passed on their Redwings horses as not controlled.
 
3OldPonies said:
So very sad to read this news. I confess to being a lapsed supporter owing to my own equine commitments. So much for 'the horse welfare issue being over'. Mind you, did they really need a new indoor school? Perhaps a revaluation of how they operate is needed.
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My thoughts too. It was supposed to be used to school and bring on horses and ponies but a big percentage of their rescues are non ridden so I do not know how useful it was. Seems a huge waste to me. Could they hire the school out to make some money? For things like dog agility etc. Small shows, clear round jumping, clinics etc.
 
A an indoor space is useful for more than just riding, especially if Oxhill makes significant revenue from visitors. You can take bookings reliably all year rather than just in the summer.

Maybe building it was a financial mistake but I wouldn't be assuming not building it would have solved all the problems.
 
Nicnac said:
Such sad news.
My little Shetland found on side of road by a local charity which went bust was transferred to Redwings ownership. They are so lovely but their field officer who used to come out to see her had to stop his visits due to funding issues. We now email vax and dental records.
Unfortunately this has meant that some unscrupulous people have passed on their Redwings horses as not controlled.
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Thats such a shame to lose the annual visits. I adopted two rescue ponies from Ada Cole ages ago, and then Ada Cole got taken over by Redwings, and the people who came to do the annual visit/checks were always so lovely. I had the ponies for over twenty five years before age finally caught up with them, and it was so good to know that the charity never lost touch with the ponies, a really excellent service.
 
smolmaus said:
A an indoor space is useful for more than just riding, especially if Oxhill makes significant revenue from visitors. You can take bookings reliably all year rather than just in the summer.

Maybe building it was a financial mistake but I wouldn't be assuming not building it would have solved all the problems.
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Not assuming at all that not building it would solve the problems, but they're not cheap to build and that money could have been spent on rescues, feed, vet, farrier bills, staff etc. I'm honestly not knocking what they do just pointing out that there are essentials and lovely to have non-essentials when money is tight.
 
smolmaus said:
A an indoor space is useful for more than just riding, especially if Oxhill makes significant revenue from visitors. You can take bookings reliably all year rather than just in the summer.

Maybe building it was a financial mistake but I wouldn't be assuming not building it would have solved all the problems.
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I doubt building it was the only mistake but its free entry there and there is a gift shop and cafe. Seems a real shame to close it with all the improvements they have made there. Such a shame.
 
3OldPonies said:
Not assuming at all that not building it would solve the problems, but they're not cheap to build and that money could have been spent on rescues, feed, vet, farrier bills, staff etc. I'm honestly not knocking what they do just pointing out that there are essentials and lovely to have non-essentials when money is tight.
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Yes but at the time the decision to build it was made, it could have been a sounder financial investment that could have paid for itself eventually. Maybe.

At our local rescue they wouldn't be able to hold any public facing events without an indoor space suitable for equines and people. Now, there are also stables in there and it isn't new or fancy looking so people are less likely to see it as a "nice to have" but it is genuinely essential.
 
I suspect it's not just the lack of donations but that there are increasing numbers of multi-horse rescues happening (due to the economic situation and the fact that despite the increase in length of sentence for abuse available to the courts that still isn't sufficient deterrent)

Redwings do seem to have a lot of TV adverts for funding in the last year or so that even at 'discount' cost for charity adverts (is that a thing?) will still potentially cost more than probably more effective on-line internet advertising.

I support WHW (have a pony) and also Bransby (thanks to much missed Hovis) and just don't have any cash spare after that for more equine donations.

Also, as mentioned above, there are increasing numbers of non-ridden equines requiring rehoming. These aren't popular due to the costs of keeping a horse meaning one that can be ridden is more viable to people. I think the cuts in staff at even the big rescue charities means the remaining staff need all their hours to rehab and care for the equines in their care and there is less 'spare' time available to convert non-ridden into ridden horses.
 
Have to be honest their centre in Angus is in a very rural situation and is rarely open to the public which doesn't encourage local people to get involved, visit or spend money on sponsorship etc.
There also seems to be internal issues where they can't keep staff, they have a high turn over and advertise regularly, so I am not surprised it is earmarked for closure.
 
3OldPonies said:
So very sad to read this news. I confess to being a lapsed supporter owing to my own equine commitments. So much for 'the horse welfare issue being over'. Mind you, did they really need a new indoor school? Perhaps a revaluation of how they operate is needed.
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We had a uni visit to Oxhill shortly before their indoor school was started. It was needed so that they could then break/produce rescues which could then be rehomed as ridden equines. Oxhill could only rehome non-ridden beforehand due to the lack of facilities.

It was a wonderful place, but most of our group had a professional yard-based background and we looked at a lot of things with business hats on. E.g. the super smart gelding in the field that moved like a dream, and we were informed by a senior staff member that he would never be able to be rehomed as a ridden horse due to rearing in the field. Not many people want a 16.2 companion.
They had several horses with extreme needs, including an ataxic 2yo that could barely walk and a horse with a wry nose that struggled to eat and was extremely tricky to keep weight on. Funds were funnelled into them as they couldn't reasonably justify PTS to the public, but neither could be rehomed due to their issues.
They also had some fabulous traditional cobs that were rock solid with their groundwork, but couldn't yet be backed due to the lack of a school. They'd been at the centre for 5 years.

So much money has to be put into these centres and largely due to public perception (but also legislation, I'm sure) they cannot be run in a more business minded manner.
 
This sounds like complete madness, its perfectly possible to back a horse without an indoor or even a school. Rearing in the field, like normal horse behaviour?
Its perfectly possible and indeed responsible to PTS horses with such difficult problems.
The people running this rescue sound like loons. Perhaps not so bad they are closing for the horses sakes.
 
angel7 said:
This sounds like complete madness, its perfectly possible to back a horse without an indoor or even a school. Rearing in the field, like normal horse behaviour?
Its perfectly possible and indeed responsible to PTS horses with such difficult problems.
The people running this rescue sound like loons. Perhaps not so bad they are closing for the horses sakes.
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How are the rescues you work with run?
 
They take in horses and PTS when they nolonger have good quality of life. They rehome healthy individuals while retaining ownership. They train and back youngsters to make rehoming easier. They loan out youngsters.
You know normal horse rescue stuff.
 
angel7 said:
They take in horses and PTS when they nolonger have good quality of life. They rehome healthy individuals while retaining ownership. They train and back youngsters to make rehoming easier. They loan out youngsters.
You know normal horse rescue stuff.
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Genuinely glad some rescues somewhere have the resources for training and backing but thats not universal. Both our local ones barely have the man hours to get basic jobs done.
 
angel7 said:
This sounds like complete madness, its perfectly possible to back a horse without an indoor or even a school. Rearing in the field, like normal horse behaviour?
Its perfectly possible and indeed responsible to PTS horses with such difficult problems.
The people running this rescue sound like loons. Perhaps not so bad they are closing for the horses sakes.
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I think that is very unfair to be honest. Redwings is a good rescue and cares for a lot of horses and ponies.
I only question the sense of closing a centre with new and good facilities which must have cost a lot.
surely there could be ways of making the indoor school make money?
They will not be able to move the school anywhere else and I do not know if they own the land but I think there is a good chance it will go for housing etc.
Its a real shame if it closes.
 
angel7 said:
This sounds like complete madness, its perfectly possible to back a horse without an indoor or even a school. Rearing in the field, like normal horse behaviour?
Its perfectly possible and indeed responsible to PTS horses with such difficult problems.
The people running this rescue sound like loons. Perhaps not so bad they are closing for the horses sakes.
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Redwing are a fairly well known rescue and I would expect that the majority of donations they receive are not from people within the equine industry.

Small animals are kept alive with tricky conditions and people without an understanding of horses expect that horses can be treated in the same way - just think about the three legged foal.. every pts they do has to be 100% justifiable to people with no knowledge of horses.

Re the rearing, they would have to disclose it when advertising the horse which would put off a lot of potential adopters. If they didn't disclose it, and the horse reared in its new home and someone got injured, by not disclosing it they would be opening themselves up to a lawsuit that a rescue can't afford to have. And as for the facilities, it's a health and safety/risk assessment/insurance thing. Not necessary from a practical perspective, but essential from a pencil pusher perspective - it all has to be spot on on paper.

It sounds like absolute tosh and my classmates and I were pretty disappointed with the whole thing as we could so clearly see where they could make changes to run it more efficiently. As a cohort, we really disappointed our behaviour lecturer who took us on the trip 😅
 
Jinx94 said:
It sounds like absolute tosh and my classmates and I were pretty disappointed with the whole thing as we could so clearly see where they could make changes to run it more efficiently. As a cohort, we really disappointed our behaviour lecturer who took us on the trip 😅
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I'm not going to say I've not also felt this way but there is also a reflexive instinct saying "well you bloody do it yourself then"

If you don't like how things are run, don't support them. If you don't support them then don't complain when rescues aren't available and every horse, no matter if they are healthy, rideable, safe, sane or sound gets PTS when they are in an unlucky circumstance.
 
smolmaus said:
How are the rescues you work with run?
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I know someone who worked for a large animal charity in the horse section, and when the animal was admitted it was assessed to see if it was practical to re home or use it on site as RDA, if not they kept it a few weeks if it had no severe health issues and had it PTS. She was the manager of the section. I do not give to horse charities because when you see what they are treating with no chance of a good outcome, its madness.
My friend rehomed her horse to the Blue Cross because of her mobility issues. It was a ridden warmblood, vet checked as ridable before it left,she was told they would advertise for loan, but was PTS in less than three weeks. She only found out because the loan advert was taken down. In their opinion it was not sound, she was upset because she had the idea they would keep him indefinitely and paid a rehoming fee. I think charities have to be open about their policies
 
honetpot said:
I think charities have to be open about their policies
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In an ideal world. In reality, the more open you are, the more chances you give people to disagree and withdraw support. You've just said one charity has the right idea to PTS if it's not an easy rehome, and criticised another for doing the same thing. If a rehome is "easy" is entirely subjective. Your friends horse could have become less sound in between vet checks.

If you want a horse rescue to exist then you have to accept it's run by human beings and not a Perfect Outcome For Everyone algorithm. If no horse rescues existing is a better outcome for you personally then don't support them, I respect that more than "yes they should exist but if I give them money (or even if I don't) I also get to have an input on every decision they make".
 
smolmaus said:
I'm not going to say I've not also felt this way but there is also a reflexive instinct saying "well you bloody do it yourself then"

If you don't like how things are run, don't support them. If you don't support them then don't complain when rescues aren't available and every horse, no matter if they are healthy, rideable, safe, sane or sound gets PTS when they are in an unlucky circumstance.
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Completely agree.

Our suggestions would probably have caused the charity to be vilified, leading to a drop in donations which would result in them being unable to carry out more charitable work. We thought that pts of the ones we viewed to have poor quality of life, getting someone in to back all horses that could be and then sale of appropriate horses to fund further charitable work was a smart move.

I don't think our ideas were wrong, but we definitely didn't take public perception into account or appreciate all of the red tape that they have to go through.

Charities seem to be between a rock and a hard place at all times.
 
Charities have very little money lots come in a very bad state some never even get that far. They are assessed by a vet ASAP if a vet decides they cannot be rehabbed (which does not mean just rehabbed for riding) or their condition deteriorates which in some cases is possible due to neglect then they are pts. They may look well when they come in but most come in for a reason. If a ridden horse comes in they may look sound for the first few weeks but like any horse this may not be the case. As soon as an equine is signed over it costs the charity money. It's not a case of get the equine in pts. You see a high number of charity cases being pts because they have been neglected and it's not fair to prolong their suffering further. They do a hell of a lot of behind the scenes work that never gets shown because of data protection.
 
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