Riding on the bit

J

JTeighty

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Hi,

Not sure where to put this thread. I've been trying to get my horse on the bit for the past couple of months but to no avail. I know my horse can do it as have seen more experiences riders putting her on it. I've tried loads of stuff but I can't seem to get it. My instructor says I need to create the energy with my leg and keep half halting with my outside reign, making sure to always give a leg aid with the half halt. He said its all about timing. ive tried this for ages half halting after the leg aid, simultaneously the leg aid, after the leg aid. I have suppled her up by riding with a loose reign and doing loads of bending n some jumping. Can someone please explain to me how exactly I should be giving the aids? I've been riding for about a year now at least 2/3 times a week.

Thanks so much.

J
 
No amount of playing on your pony's mouth is going to get him "on the bit". He needs to be working properly over his back, supple and forward, and head position is the last thing to worry about. Generally, working on lots of transitions, lots of back and forward within each pace, leg yielding/SI to activate the hind quarters and riding into a soft, supportive contact will help him get to the point where his head carriage will fall into place without fiddling.

I think you should get a new instructor - if they can't explain it to you so you understand, they're not doing their job properly.
 
JFTD said:
No amount of playing on your pony's mouth is going to get him "on the bit". He needs to be working properly over his back, supple and forward, and head position is the last thing to worry about. Generally, working on lots of transitions, lots of back and forward within each pace, leg yielding/SI to activate the hind quarters and riding into a soft, supportive contact will help him get to the point where his head carriage will fall into place without fiddling.

I think you should get a new instructor - if they can't explain it to you so you understand, they're not doing their job properly.
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I second this...

Loads of transitions working from your seat. Work on tempo and impulsion, make sure the horse isn't behind your leg and is straight etc.

Like JFTD said, I would get a new instructor to guide you through it :)
 
JFTD and BorgRae thanks a lot for your replies. My instructor was great up until this point where now I've stopped progressing and have stayed at this level trying to work on the bit for a few months. It's made me lose a lot of interest in my riding as used to be obsessed about it and now it seems to be more of a hassle as I'm kind of lost as have no aim. Problem is that a condition of my share (who I've been with for about 5m) is that I must take lessons occasionally with this instructor and I'm worried if I look for a new share and instructor ill mess myself over and be left with neither. Ill have to have a word with my instructor and explain how I feel and we'll need to come up with a solution. I don't come from a horse riding family and none of my friends ride so I'm not in contact with any horse related people and I don't know what I'm meant to so in such a situation. Another disadvantage is that I'm on a private yard and there's no one to hack with so its very boring. Do you have any advice? I'd be really grateful.

Thanks

J
 
Do you achieve it whilst in lessons with the instructor but can't replicate it outside them, or are you just not there yet? How old is the horse and what is it like?
 
mandwhy said:
Do you achieve it whilst in lessons with the instructor but can't replicate it outside them, or are you just not there yet? How old is the horse and what is it like? [\quote]

I've had quite about 5 lessons on it. In the first 2 my instructor tweaked the reigns from the ground and formed the outline (and I could feel how different it was when the hind quarters were so much more activated-easier to sit the trot, could feel the hind legs tucking right under and the front end rise a lot higher). I kept it for a few minutes then she fell out of it. The other lessons the instructor kept telling me to create energy by squeezing the legs meanwhile half halt continuously to get her on the bit. He said I was about 80% of the way there but I still didnt get it or once or twice I got it for a second.

How long should it take for me to get the hang of it. I've been trying for the past 2/3months at least 2/3 times a week but to no avail.

She's an 8 year old warmblood. Very powerful and full of energy. Her steering is very sensitive. She's the best ride I've ridden. Have ridden other horses but they've all been a lot 'heavier' than her. She's got good paces and also jumps really nicely. She's very moody though and isn't a very warm and loving horse. She'll share breath occasionally and lick me but she doesn't often show emotion.
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First things first... Drop the 'on the bit' terminology, its giving you the wrong mental image, you can even see this by your post.... You talk of other people 'putting her on it'. This is wrong.

An instructor is good, but only so long as they can translate what they are trying to describe as something meaningful to you and that horse, that isn't to say this instructor is bad, she can probably teach you many other things, it just seems to me that coupled with your mental image of 'on the bit' and the instructions from your trainer, things are getting lost in translation.


Imagine yourself picking up an ornament and placing it on the shelf.... You are 'placing' it. That's what your current concept is, you are using your hands to put it in the required position.

What you need to replace 'on the bit' with is something more appropriate, it will help you change your way of thinking and so your approach to the situation. I think of it as 'encouraging a horse into a contact'. Don't imagine for a second that this contact has anything to do with pulling the horse into an outline... You are driving the horse into it.

Your first step is as jFTD said to get the horse working the rest of her body properly first. Now you can do this in the school or on a hack, but what you need to be doing is encouraging that back end to be the driving force (imagine rear wheel drive car) once this happens, you will feel like the horse has grown a hand... I call this the powerhouse, the back rises, the horse engages its hindquarters, tracking up and it's back literally does rise. This step is achievable with lots of transitions, two of my favourites being canter down to walk, canter up hill, this gets the back end working, and halt then rein back, then walk on, again the quarters engage.

Now when you have the horse in rear wheel drive with the powerhouse up and running, don't think this automatically means the horse will be working in an outline... I start these methods on a long rein, helping the horse to stay as relaxed as possible whist I get what I'm asking for and the horse builds up strength, later on I start to take a 'contact'. With a contact, you do not ever imagine you are drawing the horse into a contact, merely establishing a clear line of communication with the horse. Keep your hands nice and still and repeat the above steps, slowly the horse will eventually build up strength and for want of a better phrase step into the contact herself. Your main focus, maintain communication with the rain and use your leg and transitions and work to encourage the horse forward. You will not get anything out of the horse without engagement first.

A couple more pointers, hands together, encourages a higher head carriage that demands more of the horse, hands a couple of inches wider apart than normal encourages the horse to accept the contact more readily and step into it, it is an easier requirement. Finally, allow your horse to stretch out, not just at the end of a hack or schooling session, but for example three mins of 'work' and one min on a long rein... This helps the development of the strength and flexibility of the horses muscles, doing this will ultimately make it easier for the horse to work as you are asking.
 
What a great, well thought out answer. I constantly fiddle with my hands, even though I know its wrong, so that has given me a different way to think about it. Thanks!
 
In defence of your riding instructor, teaching someone to ride correctly into a contact is one of the most difficult stages. It is one of those really watershed moments in learning to ride that makes a huge difference but is difficult to get the feel of, a bit like learning rising trot.

OP don't despair you will get it, you are doing pretty well already. Many leisure riders never get the hang of riding in an outline, and often it takes them many years!

JFTD and Queenbee have given you some excellent advice. I would suggest that you also read a couple of books to help you understand half halting snd riding in an outline/into a contact. Sylvia Loch or Sally Swift would be books to look out for.

Maybe explain to the horse's owner that you are enjoying thd share and are keen to have lessons and progress but would like to try a couple of lessons with a different instructor if they don't mind. Say it isn't that there is a problem with the current one but you would like a different perspective. Your instructor sounds fine, he is explaining correctly, but not in a way that works for you. Quite often I find that if I hit a sticking point a lesson with a different instructor sorts it out. A slightly different method of explaining or setting up a movement can help you get something.

In the meantime for me a half halt needs leg, hand and seat aids to be applied together and then when the horse responds you allow forward with the hand and seat and push forward with your leg. To get a horse "on the bit" what I do depends a bit upon the horse but generally lots of turns and circles, lots of transitions, lots of half halts and flexing the horse both ways. Some horses need a still steady contact to work into, some respond better to a still outside hand and the inside hand "working" a little (I don't mean fiddling the head down) for some starting off with a wide low hand position and then bringing them up works well.

One common mistake is not actually holding enough contact to contain the energy you are creating and give the horse something to work into. It is easy to get so fixated on not hauling the head into a shape that you let go if the front end all together! It is a difficult balance to strike!

It might be worth asking the horse's owner how they get him into an outline as it maybe that he is used to something a little different or they may be able to help you understand what to do better than your instructor.
Good luck!
 
I sometimes wonder whether that question about "on the bit" really means having relaxation of the lower jaw. If your horse braces against the contact, maybe he needs to learn that relaxation. You can teach that from the ground - apply a fairly gentle pressure on both reins in the direction of the saddle - the INSTANT he relaxes and gives to the pressure, release. Do that over and over so that he is learning to give to the pressure and in the process, relax his lower jaw.
That is only part of the story though - if you are driving with your legs and holding the front, physically he cannot relax and lower his head, you have forced him to hollow his back. Practice the relaxation, take it to the saddle by rewarding the relaxation by a slight release, and work on engagement exercises - circles, transitons, serpentines. Look at western riders - they often have an "outline" with absolutely no contact whatsoever.
And can I suggest you find another instructor - your current one seems to have taken you as far as they know how and aren't progressing you to another stage.
 
Here's something to try when you are riding on your own you can do this hacking in fact hacking is best .
Get into a really good strong walk and take a good contact on the rien think of the contact as a wieght to follow it won't hard the horse if it's more wieght than you aim for in the end .
Check your position is correct .
Straight line ear shoulder hip heel
And shoulder hanging straight down from the shoulder joint when at rest then a line elbow hand down rien to bit.
When the horse is in a good strong walk overdo the following with the hands really get those arms elbows following moving in time to the walk .
Now really concerntrate hard of feeling for changes in the wieght and feel in the rien train your self to follow the feel in the rien and keep it the same .
Give the horse lots of breaks and pats if she finds it strange .
If is a difficult stage and it can take ages to get .
Try not to stress and the better your postion is the easier it is to learn so perhaps some work on the lunge would help.
Don't be disheartened .
 
Hi guys,

Thanks so much for your responses! Especially Queenbee for the really in depth explanation and to JFTD and Kat. I'm going to have a long chat with my instructor tomorrow and i will tell him exactly how i feel and will mention a lot of things you all said.

Thanks once again to everyone.

J
 
Good luck. If you're not happy with his response (it doesn't seem "right" - i.e. relies on excessive force, or you still don't understand it / it doesn't help), do consider seeking new tuition. Not all instructors are worth their salt. Not that I'm dismissing him before you've given him a chance, of course - he could be great :p
 
JTeighty said:
Hi guys,

Thanks so much for your responses! Especially Queenbee for the really in depth explanation and to JFTD and Kat. I'm going to have a long chat with my instructor tomorrow and i will tell him exactly how i feel and will mention a lot of things you all said.

Thanks once again to everyone.

J
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No worries, hope it helps. Good luck for tomorrow x

JFTD said:
Good luck. If you're not happy with his response (it doesn't seem "right" - i.e. relies on excessive force, or you still don't understand it / it doesn't help), do consider seeking new tuition. Not all instructors are worth their salt. Not that I'm dismissing him before you've given him a chance, of course - he could be great :p
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Absolutely this!
 
JTeighty said:
JFTD and BorgRae thanks a lot for your replies. My instructor was great up until this point where now I've stopped progressing and have stayed at this level trying to work on the bit for a few months. It's made me lose a lot of interest in my riding as used to be obsessed about it and now it seems to be more of a hassle as I'm kind of lost as have no aim. Problem is that a condition of my share (who I've been with for about 5m) is that I must take lessons occasionally with this instructor and I'm worried if I look for a new share and instructor ill mess myself over and be left with neither. Ill have to have a word with my instructor and explain how I feel and we'll need to come up with a solution. I don't come from a horse riding family and none of my friends ride so I'm not in contact with any horse related people and I don't know what I'm meant to so in such a situation. Another disadvantage is that I'm on a private yard and there's no one to hack with so its very boring. Do you have any advice? I'd be really grateful.

Thanks

J
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Don't despair - it was the hardest thing for me to do but one day it just clicked - as well as riding forward from the leg the right amount of consistant contact needs to be there as well.

Make sure that your hands are softly still and that you don't drop the contact as you rise to the trot.

Have a look at this as it shows how it all happens
RidingbyNumbers.jpg
 
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