RSPCA, Jamie Grey and "Spindles Farm"

Fairynuff

Fairynuff

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There is so much stramach going on about this case that it is becoming surreal.Mr Grey will be sent on trial and may even be prosecuted but....there are a lot of people out there who should be on trial with him
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. How many "horsey people" have had their little scabby mare "jumped" by an equally scabby horse whos only treasure was the fact that he had "nuts in his bag"? Where in the name of God did all of these equines come from and how did he manage to buy so many? Cos they cost sweet fanny adams-the market is hoaching with them. So while we are all sat on our fat behinds, casting judgement and sucking our teeth with disbelief at how this could happen in such a horseloving country, I put it to you(and me), its OUR FAULT! Mr Grey is a product of our mistakes and we should all be up infront of the judge with him. Im sorry, its so easy to be good and rightious from afar, accepting our part in the story is another thing. Mairi.
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How many "horsey people" have had their little scabby mare "jumped" by an equally scabby horse whos only treasure was the fact that he had "nuts in his bag"?

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We're not quite so picky with our own species either are we? Since when should we judge other species? We don't impose restrictions on our own breeding, although perhaps we should!
I'm sitting on the fence on this one, but 'scabby' is a bit much, not all horses are bred to be wonderfully talented surely? Some just make good pets, same with dogs in my opinion.
 
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How many "horsey people" have had their little scabby mare "jumped" by an equally scabby horse whos only treasure was the fact that he had "nuts in his bag"?

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I have a feeling that some of the horses may not have been quite the scabby little things that you think. There were some decent horses in the bunch removed - sadly neglected and thought so little of as to end up somewhere like Mr Grey's. (Not, of course, that any of them deserved to be treated in that way).
 
Mairi I wholeheartedly agree with you on this and its not just horses where this happens either.


the motivation is, in most cases, money. Thats what it all boils down to. The loving owner with rose tinted specs on who puts the aged family mare in foal is not the one to blame in all this but there are certain people who, very purposefully, will breed over and over again from multiple mares JUST to get these unfortunate youngsters into the market asap. It doesnt matter what happens to them and their breeding or conformational faults are of no concern. They are a meat crop. Some are 'lucky' (debateable) to be picked up at sales by well meaning individuals but the number of animals that just go round and round from one sale to another is amazing.

Its a cash crop, just like some puppy farms.
 
It is the welfare and the way the individual horse is treated which is the point. Any horse whatever it's breeding deserves to be looked after humanely.

Unfortunately there are some ignorant and also some cruel people out there who should not be allowed to own or handle a horse.

I strongly believe that the time has come for every horse to be micro-chipped and registered on a central national database where a record of all its medical history is kept. Details of the horses breaders, it's current and previous owners and any dealers that it has passed through would also be recorded.

This would make it very much easier to identify the true history of a horses and how it was previously cared for.
 
whilst I agree with what you are saying I also firmly believe that without all these 'scabby' horses and ponies horse ownership would become something that only rich people could afford. What should be criminalised is the fact that these poor creatures are treated with a total lack of respect and kindness unless they happen to be bought by a loving owner. When I came back into ownership some years ago I paid 250 to a dealer for 2 of these scabby ponies because we felt sorry for them, when I learned that the dealer had paid 50p each for them straight off the moors it sank in. How many could she buy with the money I had given her, I just gave her fuel to carry on with the horrors she was inflicting on the (literally) hundreds that she had. My ponies have known nothing other than love and respect, and have homes for life, but I will never forgive myself for giving her funds to put even more of these animals through it.
 
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How many "horsey people" have had their little scabby mare "jumped" by an equally scabby horse whos only treasure was the fact that he had "nuts in his bag"?

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I have a feeling that some of the horses may not have been quite the scabby little things that you think. There were some decent horses in the bunch removed - sadly neglected and thought so little of as to end up somewhere like Mr Grey's. (Not, of course, that any of them deserved to be treated in that way).

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just to support this, we have a young gelding, bought from one of 'this type' of dealer at a local sale, 5 year old hanoverian, by Welser (Weltmeyer), he is the dead spit of his dad and would be worth far far more than we paid were he ever to be sold on, moves like a dream. We got him for next to nothing, I have nightmares that he may have passed through Amersham on his way here.
 
Ive had my fairshare of "scabby ponies" in the past. I dont berate them nor those who own them and love them. I berate the "breeders" of said equines-there are far too many in existence
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. Sadly, they have to end up somewhere and whether you like it or not , the MR Greys of the world are here to clear up behind US. These people have a role to play in the way of things too, unpleasent that it is(for us) Before we condemn him and his like , lets hear what he has to say and lets try and change in a sensible way the future of Rag Tag and Muffin (and the occasional Milton who falls through the trap).
 
I agree with this whole train of thought. It is too easy to breed and to easy to own horses, and in some respects horses are too cheap.

I am not advocating that the sport should be for the rich, far from it, as that would immediately remove me from the frame, but while it is possible to buy a trailer load of Exmoor's or New Forest's at a local sale for next to nothing, then the trade will continue and it is not helped by the attitudes of the well meaning either.

I have a very close friend, who is passionate about this subject, yet regards any horse priced at more than a few hundred pounds as a pure rip off. He thinks that a friend of my wife's, who paid £2,750 for a Section D mare is barking mad.

It is only by making a horse an animal of value, that you remove a proportion of the meat trade mentality that seems so pervasive in certain quarters of the horse world
 
Unfortunately IMO, horses for many people are too 'throw away'. Maybe if people took responsibility for the entire life of their horses there wouldn't be so many floating around in nowhere land!!
 
I agree Mairi. If more people did the honourable deed for their old, ill or infirm horses, then there may not be so many of these poor coat-racks going through sales and ending up in hell-holes.
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Hmm difficult one - I agree that breeding a bad confo mare with a bad confo stallion is nto agood idea, the offspring would be likely to end up in the trade and subjected to conditions I hate to imagine... but then again to remove all the heinz 57's and the ugly ducklings of this world would surely sooner or later cause problems in the gene pool.

We all know what happens to chickens bred to be intensively farmed - they grow so fast their legs can't support them properly, even if reared in a free range environment. There is another breed of chicken that the cockrels (sp?) routinely "rape" their hens, resulting in feather loss and injurys - they were bred for a nicer tail. Obviously horses aren't chickens, but do you get my general gist? Take dogs - the accidents, the cross breeds are often healthier and stronger than purebreeds.
 
I do agree that breeding should only take place between the best possible mares and the best possible graded stallions, and that any colt that isn't up to grading should be gelded. Eventually the price of horses would go up, but hopefully not beyond the purse of the average horse buyer, in the long term there would just be slightly fewer horses but of overall good quality out there.
 
Thanks Mairi for telling it like it is!

I'm one of the walking poor, and can't live without a horse, but would give up owning a horse for the rest of my life if it would stop the Jamie Greys of the world...the thing is it won't.

I can't believe that the shame-game that finally put a bit of a break on the puppy mills hasn't seemed to have reached the horsey set. I also believe that the best riding horse in the world is a gelding. A snip at the right time isn't the worst thing that can happen to a horse. I think films like The Black Stallion did so much harm. Everybody wants a black stallion, just ask any kid.

Foals are cute, but go visit a farm to see foals and keep a mare or gelding unbred. Much better for the world.

Glad to see this being discussed!
 
Agree Honeypots, I am one of those people who have things for life, my dogs, my cats, hopefully my husband (!!!!) and without doubt my horse, who incidentally is in foal. I hope I wont be branded an indulgent rose tinted person breeding from their old mare, because she is apurebred RID and in foal to the same. Hopefully I will produce a decent horse, if it is a colt I will probably have it gelded and look forward to having a gelding riding horse in a few years' time.

My mare is 15, she has had intermittent lameness and will probably never stand up to decent ridden exercise. However, I would never part with her, she will spend the rest of her days with me as long as she is happy and I hope I can say the same about the foal. The thought of my mare ending up at Jamie Grays makes me want to cry.

I have never sold or parted with an animal or a horse. A lot of people treat the horses that enter and leave their lives rather as cars, something to fill a gap and then get rid of. I know I am a sentimental old fool but horses give you so much because they want to please, and they deserve respect and thoughtfulness in return.
 
"but while it is possible to buy a trailer load of Exmoor's or New Forest's at a local sale for next to nothing"

I don't know why this happens as I would like to add that exmoor and NF are lovely ponies not scabby or low quality at all and in the right hands make superb riding ponies for adults and children.

I have a 5 yr old NF pony and he was not cheap but everyone who meets him says he is one of the most genuine uncomplicated ponies you could ever meet.

My friend has an exmoor again who gives her a great deal of pleasure. As adults both of us plan to keep our ponies forever as we will never grow out of them.

The NFPS is encouraging NF breeders to register and halter break their ponies so they are worth more than meat and also encourage people to promote them as the superb riding and driving ponies suitable for adults and children that they are this should push their prices up.
 
Although I agree with all the sentiments. I think one of the worst is the breeders of race horses. How many end up being sold because they don't make the grade. Most of these are registered breeders. More end up for sale to be ' re-trained'. Most are not trained to start with. They have a saddle chucked on and made to run as fast as they can.

Then sold on for re-schooling which some people may be lucky enough to have one that's not a total headcase.

I actually agree with selective breeding but for temperament as well as confirmation.
 
Whilst I do agree with most of this and I am not just trying to make excuses to make us horse owners feel better about our selves, I think that what we need to remember is that the reason Mr Grey is being prosecuted isn't because he sell's horses into the meat trade (which we all know goes on) but the way in which he treated them whilst they were in his "care". If the things which were said about him are true, such as running horses down in motor vehicles, that is just pure sadism on his part and no amount of blaming the breeders of the poor horses can account for that. The only thing that they can be blamed on is the sheer scale it was carried out on.
 
What about people who buy a horse because they think it is 'cool' to have one, get something totally unsuitable and then flog it off to the nearest person once it bucks them off / stands on their foot / kicks them in their stupid head and the horse gets the reputation for being 'bad'. If I had a quid for every time I saw some stupid idiot ruining a perfectly good horse through ignorance... My own mare was one of them - her owners were so keen to get rid of her that I paid £1 (and that was me insisting that I paid them something to make the transaction legal) because she was 'stroppy' and 'wild'. She is a lovely, intelligent mare with a great sense of humour and a streak of individualism. And I wouldn't want her any other way. How easily she could have ended up where those poor creatures in Amersham were... I shudder to think.
 
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