RSPCA powers

[Nari]

Does anyone know where I can find out what powers the RSPCA actually have & what actions they can legally take? There doesn't seem to be this sort of information on their website - what a surprise! Need to find out quite urgently for a friend.

 

[marmalade76]

They have no more power than you or I.

ETA there is a website that tells you what they can and can't do and gives advice as to what you should do if they visit you, will see if I can find it..

 

[YorksG]

None at all. They have no power of entry, they can apply for a warrant to enter the property, but the police have the power of entry, not the RSPCA. They do not have the right to seize animals, again the police do that, also a vet needs to state that the animal is in need of urgent care, away from the property.
They apparently issue 'cautions' and 'improvment' orders as to animal owners conduct, however that is no more official than you or I writing out that we expect owner 'A' to do xyz, with or for their animals.
They have no statutory powers at all.
Hope that helps.

 

[amandap]

None at all. They have no power of entry, they can apply for a warrant to enter the property, but the police have the power of entry, not the RSPCA. They do not have the right to seize animals, again the police do that, also a vet needs to state that the animal is in need of urgent care, away from the property.
They apparently issue 'cautions' and 'improvment' orders as to animal owners conduct, however that is no more official than you or I writing out that we expect owner 'A' to do xyz, with or for their animals.
They have no statutory powers at all.
Hope that helps.

This is what I thought.

 

[marmalade76]

http://the-shg.org/The Law and the RSPCA.htm

http://rspcainjustice.blogspot.co.uk/2010/04/rspca-mislead-public-over-pet-seizure.html

 

[Nari]

Thank you, that's what I suspected but I wasn't sure

 

[Moomin1]

Perhaps a little more info as to what it is that you need to know they can or can't do exactly, may help more precisely?

The RSPCA can and do privately prosecute. Yes, they have no powers afforded to them, but you or I could act under the law and take a private prosecution with Joe Bloggs down the road who battered his pooch to death.

So whilst they do not have 'powers', they can and do still investigate and prosecute.

 

[Nari]

I'm afraid I don't feel I can put information up as it isn't mine to reveal. I'm aware they can investigate or prosecute but the information I wanted at this point is what the others have given & the link from marmalade76 is just what I needed.

Thank you everyone!

 

[Moomin1]

Fully understand.

Just to point out, YorksG is right in what she mentions, however she hasn't mentioned things quite as in depth as she could.

Under Section 18 of the Animal Welfare Act, in order for an animal to be taken into possession, or euthanased, a police officer, or local authority officer can do so (or arrange for it to be done) if a vet states that an animal is suffering or likely to suffer if circumstances do not change. They can however, do so WITHOUT a vet stating so, if it is deemed or thought to be inappropriate to wait for a vet. So, for instance, if an animal needs removing from a situation INSTANTLY.

However, YorksG also hasn't mentioned that quite often PACE Section 17 (power of entry) and Section 19 (Seizure) can and are used by police on RSPCA request in order to remove animals. In this case, no vet is needed whatsoever.

 

[YorksG]

Those cases SHOULD only be in extreemis, not as a regular occurance and the officers SHOULD believe that the animal is in imminent danger. Sadly the police tend to believe RSPCA officers will always tell the truth in these matters, which has been shown to not always be the case. If a person with a mental health problem is to be removed from their home, unless the police officer in the case, has evidence that HE/SHE believes that the person is imminent danger (eg that the patient has told others that they will kill themselves etc), then a warrant has to be applied for from the court, with evidence given by an Approved Mental Health Professional (who if a social worker is already an officer of the court), to knowingly give false evidence in this case is perjury btw. I find it hard to believe that the police will act more precipitously to 'rescue' animals, than to protect people with mental health problems, yet they appear to be acting to remove animals more quickly than deal with people. Perhaps one reason for this is that most people with mental health problems, have access to professionals who have their rights at the forefront of their minds, where as it appears that the RSPCA have few scruples with regard to the human rights of pet owners (as evidenced by the quotes in a number of articles, including the Times one)

 

[Moomin1]

Those cases SHOULD only be in extreemis, not as a regular occurance and the officers SHOULD believe that the animal is in imminent danger. Sadly the police tend to believe RSPCA officers will always tell the truth in these matters, which has been shown to not always be the case. If a person with a mental health problem is to be removed from their home, unless the police officer in the case, has evidence that HE/SHE believes that the person is imminent danger (eg that the patient has told others that they will kill themselves etc), then a warrant has to be applied for from the court, with evidence given by an Approved Mental Health Professional (who if a social worker is already an officer of the court), to knowingly give false evidence in this case is perjury btw. I find it hard to believe that the police will act more precipitously to 'rescue' animals, than to protect people with mental health problems, yet they appear to be acting to remove animals more quickly than deal with people. Perhaps one reason for this is that most people with mental health problems, have access to professionals who have their rights at the forefront of their minds, where as it appears that the RSPCA have few scruples with regard to the human rights of pet owners (as evidenced by the quotes in a number of articles, including the Times one)

YorksG, the Animal Welfare Act states a POLICE OFFICER OR LOCAL AUTHORITY OFFICER can take into possession, or arrange for the euthanasia of an animal without a vet's opinion if it is deemed inappropriate to wait for a vet to give an opinion on the matter - NOT the RSPCA officer. So it is down to the police or local authority inspector to make that judgement.

 

[YorksG]

YorksG, the Animal Welfare Act states a POLICE OFFICER OR LOCAL AUTHORITY OFFICER can take into possession, or arrange for the euthanasia of an animal without a vet's opinion if it is deemed inappropriate to wait for a vet to give an opinion on the matter - NOT the RSPCA officer. So it is down to the police or local authority inspector to make that judgement.

Indeed it is, but they are often 'advised' by RSPCA officers, police officers are more likely than LA officer to take RSPCA 'advice' as they are less likely to have animal knowlege.
However it appears that the OP has got the information they require, so all is well

 

[Moomin1]

Indeed it is, but they are often 'advised' by RSPCA officers, police officers are more likely than LA officer to take RSPCA 'advice' as they are less likely to have animal knowlege.
However it appears that the OP has got the information they require, so all is well

Well then, that is the fault of the police officers then isn't it? No police officer should use powers without knowing what they are using them for or knowing why.

 

[YorksG]

Well then, that is the fault of the police officers then isn't it? No police officer should use powers without knowing what they are using them for or knowing why.

I quite agree, although I am sure we do not expect Police officers to be animal experts, they believe they are being advised by experts. By the same token, no-one should pretend to powers which they do not have. The other thing that the OP should know is that if you allow RSPCA personel into/onto your property, they MUST leave if and when you ask them to, that is also the case if they are with the police, unless there is a warrant which grants them access with the police.

 

[PandorasJar]

If the ops friend is not doing anything wrong... Calling another welfare agency may be helpful? We solved our problems with rspca by getting vet reports and bhs involved (through legal line but came out as agency) who agreed they were fine and that the person reporting would be advised that they don't take kindly to wasting their time... Not had a problem with rspca since.

Animal welfare act gives all info you need... But it doesn't cover all eventualities in detail from recollection. I'm pretty certain they can be seized as evidence in a case not to do directly with welfare and held (it's covered but very loosly in the act).

 

[tabithakat64]

I'd get your friend to read the animal welfare act as its surprising what is considered an offence.
There's a bit which says a person commits an offence if they are responsible for an animal and failure of another person to act causes suffering.
There's another bit which says its an offence if supervising another person could have prevent suffering.
In most cases the RSPCA think the only form of action is veterinary treatment, even if the animal is underweight with no health issues and you can be deemed responsible for someone else's animal if they share the same premises as yours or you have tried to help out someone in a difficult situation by feeding, checking or watering their animal even if its just for a couple of days.
As you can see from the above Notifying the owner that their is an issue is not good enough either.

 

[JinglebellJessi & MistletoeMagic]

I didnt know that they didnt have the power to traipse all over private land. The are always wandering around mine and the other liveries fields, moving thing, opening any unlocked doors. All because on one of the fields, at the front there is a old retired tb that keeps getting complaints.

 

[Ellies_mum2]

Crikey So they don't have half the powers they would like us to believe they have then

So next time anyone catches an 'officer' mooching around being nosy they can be told to sling their hook as they are trespassing? As long as its private property? Bit more difficult if you have a footpath running through your fields though.

If they can access your field via a public footpath and are not accompanied by a police officer then can I assume they are not allowed to then go all round your fields examining whatever takes their fancy as the only PUBLIC part is the actual footpath?

 

[Goldenstar]

Those cases SHOULD only be in extreemis, not as a regular occurance and the officers SHOULD believe that the animal is in imminent danger. Sadly the police tend to believe RSPCA officers will always tell the truth in these matters, which has been shown to not always be the case. If a person with a mental health problem is to be removed from their home, unless the police officer in the case, has evidence that HE/SHE believes that the person is imminent danger (eg that the patient has told others that they will kill themselves etc), then a warrant has to be applied for from the court, with evidence given by an Approved Mental Health Professional (who if a social worker is already an officer of the court), to knowingly give false evidence in this case is perjury btw. I find it hard to believe that the police will act more precipitously to 'rescue' animals, than to protect people with mental health problems, yet they appear to be acting to remove animals more quickly than deal with people. Perhaps one reason for this is that most people with mental health problems, have access to professionals who have their rights at the forefront of their minds, where as it appears that the RSPCA have few scruples with regard to the human rights of pet owners (as evidenced by the quotes in a number of articles, including the Times one)

It was in my experiance very easy to remove a horse all it took was a vet to say it was necessary and a call to the police who would attend .

 

[Goldenstar]

If the ops friend is not doing anything wrong... Calling another welfare agency may be helpful? We solved our problems with rspca by getting vet reports and bhs involved (through legal line but came out as agency) who agreed they were fine and that the person reporting would be advised that they don't take kindly to wasting their time... Not had a problem with rspca since.

Animal welfare act gives all info you need... But it doesn't cover all eventualities in detail from recollection. I'm pretty certain they can be seized as evidence in a case not to do directly with welfare and held (it's covered but very loosly in the act).

Your own vet on your side is always protection providing you have nothing to hide .

 

[Goldenstar]

Crikey So they don't have half the powers they would like us to believe they have then

So next time anyone catches an 'officer' mooching around being nosy they can be told to sling their hook as they are trespassing? As long as its private property? Bit more difficult if you have a footpath running through your fields though.

If they can access your field via a public footpath and are not accompanied by a police officer then can I assume they are not allowed to then go all round your fields examining whatever takes their fancy as the only PUBLIC part is the actual footpath?

Yes you can tell them to swing their hook but then don't be surprised if they return with a police officer who does have powers of entry..

 

[Polos Mum]

Yes you can tell them to swing their hook but then don't be surprised if they return with a police officer who does have powers of entry..

The police only have power of entry if they have a warrant (issued by a court) just being a police officer does not give them any more right to enter a property than you or I.
BUT clearly if the RSPCA give them evidence of an issue/ concern they can get a warrant pretty quickly/ easily.

Supprising how many people don't realise when the police come to your door and ask to come in you're perfectly within your rights to say no.

 

[Goldenstar]

The police only have power of entry if they have a warrant (issued by a court) just being a police officer does not give them any more right to enter a property than you or I.
BUT clearly if the RSPCA give them evidence of an issue/ concern they can get a warrant pretty quickly/ easily.

Supprising how many people don't realise when the police come to your door and ask to come in you're perfectly within your rights to say no.

Not so if they think an offence is taking place they can enter to take action.I have never been involved when a horse was taken with a warrant all it took was for the vet to say to the PO it's a case the officer would say on you go.

 

[widget]

If your friend has done nothing wrong then she shouldn't have anything to worry about. May be best to get her own vet to Check her animals for piece of mind. Depending on the nature of the problem

 

[PandorasJar]

As goldenstar says PM - You then have the right to take them to court for damages etc if you think they've acted wrongly.

 

[Polos Mum]

Just checked with OH (serving police office) - only entry without a warrant to protect life, limb or property (depending on circumstances)

So in the case of animal welfare police officer would have to see horse with blood pouring out or one leg missing type injury - certainly not in a 'your neighbour thinks your horse looks a bit skinny' type issue

What normally happens is the RSPCA apply to a magistrate to get their own warrant and then the police only attend to prevent a breach of the peace. I can apply to a court to get a warrant to enter someones property if I want to (although I suspect I'd have to have some kind of evidence!)

 

[PandorasJar]

It's extreme but not necessarily bleeding out extreme. A skinny collapsed horse could be removed etc.

It's all in the welfare act - they have to be in immediate need of attention. It's not your average outcome but does happen. They can also be seized without a warrant if you are living with someone banned from keeping animals etc. So where there welfare is immediately compromised.

 

[PandorasJar]

^ their

 

[Polos Mum]

Lets hope that's not the situation for the OP's friend.

 

[PandorasJar]

As much as they annoy the hell out of me from my dealings with them. They've never done more than notes and talking... To start acting I think there is normally a reason.