Saddle fit - attempt 7...! Opinions (high withers)

[rendre_la_justice]

Posted a couple of times already. You get to the stage you are clutching are straws as every darn saddle is a no no. May have been more than 7 if I count the borrowed and not bought or exchanged ones

I want a cheapy saddle to do until he's back in work and gives me chance to save for my dream saddle the one made by native pony, they have a pheonix symphony I rather adore, but dont have the funds right now.

This advice is not to replace that of my saddler but give me a rough idea whether this one is worth paying to get her out for her to advise/adjust accordingly. How much can they adjust also?

My opinions (which count for little as I'm no expert) I am a tad concerned the rear gussets not deep enough so will sit too low with rider aboard (see last pic). Rear riser? worried whacking a pad will make it too tight fitting. Sorry for terrible pics had no helper and pony would not stand square so back shot is wonky.

Gives the wither clearance I need - but is it at a cost? Clear over spine but it's an old saddle and its not lumpy or rock hard but can feel the tree in the gullet.

He is flat backed BUT has very high withers AND muscle wastage behind withers which is not visible on pics but it's flipping obvious in person and with saddle off. So he's much narrower around withers than shoulders hence I wanted something fairly straight. He's also short backed so this is 15". I have a rider lined up and she's a small 16 year old. She's not big but obviously no child.

Getting back person out to him too but would like opinions before I ring my saddler as she charges £35 before she even starts so thoughts on whether it's worth getting her out to look at this one on him?



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[coss]

could be due to small pic but it looks high infront and looks like it'll put you near the back of the seat towards the cantle rather than in the middle.
Not sure if the saddler can change that though..

 

[Dirty_D]

I dont know a great deal but i think its too narrow going by photo 3

 

[PonyIAmNotFood]

Can't tell too much but saddle is out of balance, sitting too high in front and too low at back and looks too narrow, you shouldn't fit into muscle wastage but fit the horse he should be and pad until he fills the saddle himself Imo. There's a few saddlers on here who will be able to tell far more than that though!

 

[rendre_la_justice]

Thank you that's helpful. I suspected a too narrow. This is medium wide. Everytime I have tried a wide it sits well and looks balanced, until ride is aboard and then sits on his withers. I can't seem to find a happy medium. I'm not sure that the shot is a good reflection of how it sits as it has a half cut back head so think it looks higher than it is....argh I am fed up with this!

 

[longdog]

Looking at pic 1 - the saddle is too high in front & will tip rider back.
Pic 3 - confirms saddle too narrow at front - will cause further muscle wastage.
Pic 4 - confirms much too low at back - when rider seated will press down on spine.
Def not worth paying £35 to confirm not suitable, sorry!

 

[longdog]

Just read your last post - astonished if really is M/W. Looks much narrower in pics!

 

[rendre_la_justice]

don't be sorry I am pleased, thank you!

Has anyone had a wintec pro dressage saddle? My saddler on phone suggested a wintec and I've seen a wintec pro (15") which has a slight cut back head and then at least it's adjustable? Thoughts?

Dont' want to ruin pony as not had him long and obviously muscle wastage is proof of badly fitting saddles in the past. He's so good natured he'd put up with anything, but I don't want that I want him to be comfortable and work correctly when back in work.

 

[rendre_la_justice]

Just read your last post - astonished if really is M/W. Looks much narrower in pics!

Bought this on ebay and it's not the only thing she's not be honest about. Bit miffed. However these 15 inch saddles are so perplexing. The wide I had (farrington and was confirmed wide) didn;t really look wide to me, but is it because I am used to 17 inch saddles that do look wide when stamped wide?!

 

[muffinmunsh]

I haven't read your previous post but have you thought of a Thorogood high wither / veteran saddle? My gelding has very high withers, dips and a downward sloping back and this is the only saddle we could get to fit him ...

 

[flyingfeet]

Yep agree with the above - does not look right, and I'd eat my fleece hat if that is not bridging on his back

My advice, if you want a cheapy, is to get an adjustable gullet synthetic and then pad it up well at the front to fill out the "ice cream" scoops either side of the wither.

I'd probably go for a multi padded prolite pad given a choice

If you fit the gullet to his shape right now, he won't be able to build up the muscle.

 

[be positive]

He looks as if he would easily carry a 16 inch and will need to if he is going to be ridden by a 16 year old, unless she is very short.
The one in the photo is not a good fit as others have said, it also does not look m/w.

 

[muffinmunsh]

Wintec saddle did not work at all on mine... In order to get the front up high enough the gullet would have had to be too tight and pinching ...

 

[cremedemonthe]

You've already sussed out what's wrong with it so no need for me to tell you!
Try another saddle.
Oz

 

[rendre_la_justice]

Yep agree with the above - does not look right, and I'd eat my fleece hat if that is not bridging on his back

My advice, if you want a cheapy, is to get an adjustable gullet synthetic and then pad it up well at the front to fill out the "ice cream" scoops either side of the wither.

I'd probably go for a multi padded prolite pad given a choice

If you fit the gullet to his shape right now, he won't be able to build up the muscle.

Thank you this is wonderful advice. So possible get wintec as saddler suggested then get her out to advise me how much and what to pad out? I have seen the prolite ones with the different inserts.

Just to confirm is his muscle wastage because he's been ridden in ill fitting tack? His old owner swears she had a saddle fitted for him, then he began bucking I haven't worked him since having him as wanted to get this right first. He didn't buck at all when we tried him though so he's a patient chap. Has the potential to be a great pony

 

[longdog]

Think the Thorowgood T4 High Wither would be good - in either GP or dressage. How big is horse as would worry that a 15" saddle would be far too short & too small for 16 yr old rider - no matter how petite

 

[coss]

i ride a mare with dips at the withers- used a prolite pad that you could add extra padding in - started with one pad on one side (as she was lopsided) and now it depends what numnah i use as to whether i need the prolite or not (some numnahs have wither pads in built )
That saddle really doesn't look M/W - a cut back head may help with the high wither and getting a saddle slightly wide and adding padding so the horse can fill out is what i'd be looking for, very difficult when you need such a small seat (i thought i was bad needing a 16.5" )

 

[rendre_la_justice]

Wintec saddle did not work at all on mine... In order to get the front up high enough the gullet would have had to be too tight and pinching ...

This is exactly and always my issue. How did you solve it?

It's all made worse because he's so short backed and so can't go bigger than 15.5 inch and no high iwther saddles are made that small. Kent and masters pony ones are a different cut to the large ones and still have same issue with them. I am losing the will to live with regards to this. Had ponies for 20 years, never had one so special!!

ETA he is only 13hh Section B. A 16.5 inch drowns him he looked ridiculous but maybe a smaller 16 inch as they all come up differently....

 

[nixxyz]

hi, i had the same problem with my last horse, basically a wintec sat too low at the front and was too banana shaped for her back. in the end i went for a GFS genesis same adjustable gullet just a flatter tree and an open seat did the job nicely

 

[rendre_la_justice]

hi, i had the same problem with my last horse, basically a wintec sat too low at the front and was too banana shaped for her back. in the end i went for a GFS genesis same adjustable gullet just a flatter tree and an open seat did the job nicely

ahhh see was watching one on ebay this morning before this saddle arrived. I didn't bid as wanted to wait for this and it went for only £108! What a shame as that was my preferable seat size too at 15.5"

 

[scally]

Have you considered a saddle company saddle, we have one that is high withered with chronic muscle wastage, and the only one to fit was a saddle company one, needed a lot of adjustment but fits fantastically now and has allowed room for the muscle to develop. Fully adjustable (not just the front gullet as throwogoods and wintecs) and has been adjusted as horse has developed. You have a fantastic saddle company fitter near you.

 

[rendre_la_justice]

Have you considered a saddle company saddle, we have one that is high withered with chronic muscle wastage, and the only one to fit was a saddle company one, needed a lot of adjustment but fits fantastically now and has allowed room for the muscle to develop. Fully adjustable (not just the front gullet as throwogoods and wintecs) and has been adjusted as horse has developed. You have a fantastic saddle company fitter near you.

can't find one cheap enough budget is £200. Do you mean Lynn from the bridleway?

 

[jhoward]

do you have a piccie of horse stood with no saddle?

the saddle you have put on is far to narrow.

what people but on ebay as medium etc varies so much.

looking at those pics id say in a striaghter cut saddle, like a VSD you could go to 16/ 16.5 inches.

in the case of a flat back wither but large barrel, you need something that has good clearence over the spine and shorter rounder pannels, so they meet the horses back.

rather than paying loads on things that dont fit on ebay pay the money to get a saddle fitter out, try a few makes, then hit ebay/saddles direct/rideaway etc looking for the same model. YES it may of had the flocking etc changed but if your doing cheap you at least have the base model to work on.

again.. as your struggling id suggest a saddle fitter.

 

[scally]

No the saddler we use is Poppy Webber her facebook page is bowen4horses, she is one of the 5 "associate" saddle company saddle fitters, she often has cheaper part x ones in, or she may know of a client that has one, a shame as I have just sold my 15 and a half inch one for £150.

She also does all other makes and models and is a saddle fitter not just saddle company, she is well worth just ringing and having a chat to as this really was the only answer for our problem. It gets so disheartning.

 

[be positive]

As he has muscle wastage have you had any physio to help , I would probably leave getting a saddle for a few weeks and lunge or longrein him every day to really start building him up, a month should see a real improvement and then it may be easier to get a saddle that fits, it should not need changing so quickly either.

 

[rendre_la_justice]

Thank you guys. You are SO right. I've wasted loads now to no avail. Will just get my saddler out although will also look at poppy webber and see as mine is very busy but she's only 2 miles away from me!!

 

[rendre_la_justice]

As he has muscle wastage have you had any physio to help , I would probably leave getting a saddle for a few weeks and lunge or longrein him every day to really start building him up, a month should see a real improvement and then it may be easier to get a saddle that fits, it should not need changing so quickly either.

getting physio, well my lady does mctimoney and spoprts massage, no idea which is best physio, mctimoney my sister thinks I should work him in a pessoa for a few weeks then get one fitted. His little rider is very keen though, don't want to lose her as I have a young family and can't work him enough myself and be so handy to have some help, she's been patient so far though.

 

[sbloom]

I'll confirm that the tree is too narrow and probably too low in the rear panel as well. You may well need a wide fit but you'll need either a deeper panel (so it doesn't collapse in front when a rider is on board) and/or a correction pad, I far prefer Mattes to anything else, Prolite included. This is a good way to help muscles restore themselves and to lift the front of the saddle.

Bridging? I'd say most too-narrow saddles will bridge - a slighty bridging with no rider is often seen in well fitting saddles - once the horse is moving with a rider aboard the fit will be much flatter and may well be fine. That does not apply to this saddle though!

With a difficult to fit pony you really do have a job on your hands with a small budget - as I always say, try to keep things simple on three fronts - easy to fit pony/rider combo, no rush, and a decent budget - and saddle fitting is relatively easy! You have a tricky pony, a small seat size relative to the rider and a very small budget so you may need to wait a long time for the right saddle to come up second hand. Our Native Pony range would have something to offer but even on ebay you'd almost certainly not find one in your budget.