Saddle issue- Kent and masters

scats

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I had a new Kent and masters fitted to a new horse last summer. Saddler brought van full of saddles and it was the Kent and masters that fitted, with medium gullet fitted. Rode in it very briefly and it seemed ok. Saddler said to see how I got on and ring if any problems.

Horse was in very light hacking work for first 5-6 weeks. I remember, particularly once in trot, that I found the saddle kept putting me into a chair seat. This is never a problem I’d suffered with position-wise before and I hated it. No matter what I did, I couldn’t get into a normal position, particularly in trot. I also noticed that there was uneven grease/hair under the saddlecloth- notably to the back, showing that there was obviously more weight at the back of the saddle. I also felt the horse was starting to hollow. I spoke to the saddler again and they came back out. They said that the horse had gone up a gullet size and that might explain the tipping back. So they changed to a wider gullet and told me the saddle was pretty much a perfect fit now. I questioned that the tipping back and uneven wear had been noticeable pretty much straight away after the last visit, so I wasnt sure it was to do with needing a wider gullet. Saddler said it could well be my horses conformation doing this then and not the saddle.

They told me to ride in it a few weeks and see what happened. To be honest, I didn’t feel much difference in the way it sat me at all but a few weeks later, the horse needed some time off over winter so I didn’t get the saddler back until horse returned to work earlier this year.

Horse had gone up a gullet size again so they sorted that but I’m still having the same problem with the dreadful chair seat, the horse is hollowing and when I checked my saddlecloth-





The wear on the saddlecloth may well be because the saddle is throwing me to the back of it, but I just can’t seem to sit in it any other way. When I tried the horse I don’t remember having this problem at all, so I don’t think it’s the horses confirmation, as the saddler said.
I have a Thorowgood on the Diva and that sits me absolutely perfectly. The same saddlers fitted this for me and have fitted several others of mine over the years with no problems.

Is this a common problem with the Kent and masters??

I’m now after a reccomendation for a saddle fitter in the north west, if anyone knows any. To be honest, i want shut of the thing and a different saddle fitting, but I’d be interested in getting another opinion on it while I’m at it.
 

be positive

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I am no expert but to my mind these adjustable saddles are ok but they only widen the gullet at the front, if it is not wide enough along the whole of the spine making it wider at the front will potentially unbalance it and I suspect that is what is going on, it probably was only just wide enough on day 1 and as the horse has muscled up it is not fitting well however wide the front.
As for comments about her conformation, isn't it the job of the saddle fitter to take that into account and fit a saddle to suit the individual, unless she is deformed I don't see how they can blame the horse for the saddle not fitting.
 

Frumpoon

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I am no expert but to my mind these adjustable saddles are ok but they only widen the gullet at the front, if it is not wide enough along the whole of the spine making it wider at the front will potentially unbalance it and I suspect that is what is going on, it probably was only just wide enough on day 1 and as the horse has muscled up it is not fitting well however wide the front.
As for comments about her conformation, isn't it the job of the saddle fitter to take that into account and fit a saddle to suit the individual, unless she is deformed I don't see how they can blame the horse for the saddle not fitting.

This with bells on

Adjustable saddles are a croc
 

coss

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i believe K&M and thorogood are the same essentially. Doesn't sound like it's a suitable fit for your horse with the tipping back and the marks on the saddle cloth.
I bought a k&M dressage last year and have been very happy with it after having saddle company and various other makes before that. i have got a very awkward shaped horse so was delighted when the K&M went on and looked right and felt good!
Has the saddler adjusted the flocking as well as the gullet width?
 

scats

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Thanks. Yes the saddle was flocked aswell as the gullet change. I’m leaning towards thinking that the saddle doesn’t fit me properly- perhaps stirrup bar placement. Anyway, I’ve decided I don’t want it on my horse back again, so I have someone else coming next week to fit a new saddle and get their opinion of this saddle.

Do Kent and masters sell on easily? It’s in immaculate condition.
 

vam

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I had a K&M for my young horse thinking he would change and an changeable gullet would be the way forward. It was a jump saddle and it put me in an tipped forward position, I didn't notice that much at first as he changed shape it got worse. In the end I said to my saddler about it and her reply was 'its a jump saddle, thats what they do' I changed saddlers after that. The saddle didn't fit really and was bridging, I never did need the gullet changing either.
I wouldn't bother with them or changeable gullet saddles, it took a while to sell mine and I gave it to a saddler to sell in the end as I couldn't be bothered with the hassle.
I would get rid and try again, I would rather go through a couple of secondhand saddles than do the whole gullet thing again.
 

scats

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I had a K&M for my young horse thinking he would change and an changeable gullet would be the way forward. It was a jump saddle and it put me in an tipped forward position, I didn't notice that much at first as he changed shape it got worse. In the end I said to my saddler about it and her reply was 'its a jump saddle, thats what they do' I changed saddlers after that. The saddle didn't fit really and was bridging, I never did need the gullet changing either.
I wouldn't bother with them or changeable gullet saddles, it took a while to sell mine and I gave it to a saddler to sell in the end as I couldn't be bothered with the hassle.
I would get rid and try again, I would rather go through a couple of secondhand saddles than do the whole gullet thing again.

Interestingly, I have a Thorowgood cob on the Diva and find it puts me in a lovely position, but I have noticed the stirrup bars are slightly further back, perhaps because the saddle is straighter cut to accommodate cob shoulders?
I certainly won’t touch a Kent and masters again.

Hoping I can find something that won’t break the bank too much...
 

HufflyPuffly

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For a saddle fitter, I use Steph Bradley of Freedom Saddlery, based north wales but is fantastic and has managed to fit saddles to both my very odd shaped horses!

I have a K&M on Skylla and don't feel it's great for my position either, but then Skylla is such an odd shape that the fact we found anything to fit is a miracle :lol:, so she's staying in it until mature and then we'll find something I like too.

Though it doesn't cause uneven wear/ patches on Skylla so I think this is more a case it's not right for your horse...
 

coss

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Interestingly, I have a Thorowgood cob on the Diva and find it puts me in a lovely position, but I have noticed the stirrup bars are slightly further back, perhaps because the saddle is straighter cut to accommodate cob shoulders?
I certainly won’t touch a Kent and masters again.

Hoping I can find something that won’t break the bank too much...

Thorowgood are the same as K&M so maybe you would need a cob K&M if you were to go K&M. Doesn't sound like the K&M you've got is right for you but if a TG fits then a K&M should too
 

HelenBack

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I also had a K&M a while back and found it didn't put me in a great position. Lots of people seem to get on with them but I didn't find it comfy at all. It may be that it's the different model that you don't find comfy or perhaps it's the fact that it doesn't seem to fit your horse very well and that's putting you out of balance. I wouldn't write them off entirely but it's obviously not right on this occasion.

When I sold it on I did it through the local tack shop and they got rid of it within a couple of weeks and got me a really good price for it so hopefully you'll be able to shift it easily enough, especially with it being in good condition.
 

sbloom

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Just as a technical issue, the hair and dirt at the back is mostly from movement, the front of a saddle is held firmly against the horse, the rear is free to move as the horse bends around corners etc, and is entirely normal in most cases. You can't diagnose from a saddle cloth, dirt or sweat, so do get a hands on second opinion if you are concerned.
 

poiuytrewq

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Thorowgood are the same as K&M so maybe you would need a cob K&M if you were to go K&M. Doesn't sound like the K&M you've got is right for you but if a TG fits then a K&M should too
In theory yes, however!
I had a high wither T4 which I liked, I’d bought it at the time on a budget as a temporary measure as my saddler didn’t have any affordable second hand leather that fitted my new horse. I was surprised by how much I liked it so after a year or so upgraded to a K&M high wither, thinking it would be the same but better?!
Hated it. I had the opposite problem to the OP as I always felt tipped forward but it was horrible and very unsafe feeling. I sold it on and now have a decent second hand leather which I love.
 

atropa

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I've just ordered a K&M Compact GP for my mare, I tried it and found it really comfy and secure compared to what I've been riding her in..hoping that doesn't change once we actually get it and start working properly in it :\
 

scats

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Just as a technical issue, the hair and dirt at the back is mostly from movement, the front of a saddle is held firmly against the horse, the rear is free to move as the horse bends around corners etc, and is entirely normal in most cases. You can't diagnose from a saddle cloth, dirt or sweat, so do get a hands on second opinion if you are concerned.

I have Steph Bradley coming a week on Friday to have a look.
I’m a bit confused about your description. I was under the impression that the whole of the panel should lie in even contact with the horse. I’d be quite concerned if the rear of my saddle was this mobile? Have I misunderstood you?
 

whiteflower

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I had a k&m. Absolutely hated it, found the stirrup bars too far forwards and forced me into a old fashioned chair type seat and felt very insecure. Even if it fits your horse doesn't sound like it suits you either !
 

scats

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I had a k&m. Absolutely hated it, found the stirrup bars too far forwards and forced me into a old fashioned chair type seat and felt very insecure. Even if it fits your horse doesn't sound like it suits you either !

This is exactly how I feel, I can force my legs back under me in walk just about, but in trot they shoot forwards and I can’t do anything about it.
I had my video set up the other day and it didn’t make for pleasant viewing.
 
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