Saddle slipping forwards on a flat backed cob - what to do?

[almrc]

Hi All

Well I got a brief response about this topic when I posted on someone elses thread but thought I should do one of my own.

My cob is wide and flat backed. Shes a lovely chunky cob cob, not a welsh cob, but cob

I had a saddle fitter out who fitted her with a Thorowgood T6 Cob saddle. In summer it fits lovely. However, come winter when she puts on a little weight, the saddle slips forward onto her shoulders a little bit. The saddle fitter himself said theres nothing that can be done about this. He even explained to me why it happened - as she gets slightly wedge shaped it slips forward. I was probably naive at the time as now I would not have accepted this.

I dont want to use a crupper as I think that a saddle should fit and not move. SO...What do I do? Do you think another saddle wouldnt do this or should I get a different saddler out?

I would like a WH as its more straight cut on the shoulders, however as someone else said this wouldnt stop it slipping forward, but perhaps it would stop it affecting the shoulders as its only very slightly? Eeeek help!

 

[sidesaddlegirl]

I've got a chunky TB and unless my saddles have point straps, they go straight onto her shoulders. Have point straps put on your saddle, make sure it has flat panels (no curved banana shaped ones like Wintecs and Bates tend to have) and look to see if the girth straps are as forward to the points of the tree as possible.

Some makes have the girth straps places too far back for wedge shaped horses. I have a Classic Saddlery close contact saddle and the girth straps are well forward to the points of the tree. On the side saddle I just had made, the saddle put the girth straps forward to the points of the tree too (and he put a point straps on too).

Along with have point straps and saddles with flat panels and forward placed girth straps, I also use a Stephens gel non slip pad underneath my numnah as it also helps a little bit to keep the saddle put.

Even with all this, every saddle still moves forward a little bit (about 2") but not as bad onto her shoulders as if I didn't have all these things!

 

[almrc]

Well the saddle came with 4 different straps that you could put the girth on, so hers is on first and 4th on advice from saddler. I got the thorowgood non slip numnah too, absolute rubbish!

 

[pastie2]

I think that you have already answered this yourself, weight, why is the cob putting weight on in the winter? Are you riding less? If he has a loaded shoulder there is only one way the saddle will go! I do understand your problem, I had a cob mare and the same thing used to happen. It only improved with fitness and the development of a wither. Good luck.

 

[almrc]

Its just with everything that comes with winter, at the moment her work load is the same but in summer they are on restricted grazing, in winter they are not due to many issues including mud! When I say weight, it is only a little bit extra weight as expected with winter nothing much. I am not worried about her weight at all.

 

[Puzzled]

Try one of the sticky type gel pads, it worked perfectly when I had the same problem and my pony couldn't trot one lap of the arena before the saddle shot up her shoulders! Also use a girth with an elasticated end.

 

[sidesaddlegirl]

Hmmm, the girl who keeps her pony at my field has one of those Thorowgood Cob saddles with the 4 straps. I forget how the panels are shaped but she uses 1st and 2nd as her pony just refuses to lose weight even with a grazing muzzle on all day!

 

[Llewellyn]

Interesting you mention a working hunter saddle with straight cut back from the shoulder I had a friend with a welsh sec d and that was her solution. She had it made straight cut and 'front and back' girth straps. Still slipped but a lot better. But on the basis you've mentioned both those no more help sorry. Haven't seen a cropper in years.

 

[almrc]

I'm still considering WH, I know it wont stop it slipping, but as its straighter cut there will be less to interfere with the shoulder should it slip.

Hmmm I am dubious about those gel pad things, are they different to the Thorowgood non slip numnahs? As they do not work!

 

[almrc]

Have just found this! Any opinions?

http://www.fteltd.co.uk/wow/wowforegirth.htm

 

[sidesaddlegirl]

The foregirth shown in that link is basically a point strap which you already have on your saddle! But you can see how far forward the girth has to be to line up properly in your horses girth groove.

 

[almrc]

I give up! Thank you for your help though. I have emailed some saddlers, however we dont have many good ones down here!

 

[jinglejoys]

Don't know if you saw my answer to the other post.I have the same problem with my mule Malaga (no withers) and I found this works Supra Cinch
http://www.crestridgesaddlery.com/girths.html
I do use a V crupper too though

 

[Event rider]

I had a lovely morgan mare with the same prob-had the 4 strap saddle but was useless.Our saddler put flair bags into my saddle and it never moved.Good luckx

 

[Kallibear]

One of the biggest cause of the saddle sliding forwards is it's too narrow - they get narrower up the shoulder so the saddle slides in the direction of least resistance. So try the wider gullet in the saddle.

Secondly, using the back (balance) strap will just make it worse and is poor (and incompetant!) advice from your saddler. The girth usually wins when it comes to staying where it wants to be (usually right up under the elbows in cobs) and will drag the saddle forwards with it. So using the strap right at the back just drags the saddle all the more. Try using just the point and second strap so the girth lines up better with the saddle rigging.

A working huter will make no difference. It's the points of the tree that will be uncomfortable, digging into the top of her shoulder blades, when the saddle slides forwards. WH saddles have the exact same position of points as a GP saddle - the different design is lower down by the knee rolls. A WH saddle won't stop the saddle sliding forwards and it won't stop the points digging into her shoulders. A WH saddle will interfere a bit less with her shoulder coming back but the effect is minimal and unless you grip tightly with your knees, or the saddle is far too overflocked, it's not going to be pressure point and is mostly cosmetic.

 

[Janette]

Ditto Kallibear.

If you are thinking about a new WOW, you'll need about £2000.....

Prolite non slip pads are excellent - better then a gel pad in our case. Flair flocking and a prolite pad solved the problem in our case. I had the fit of my saddle checked and it was fine, it was the action of the shoulders which caused it to move in our case.

 

[the watcher]

I have explored most types of saddle as I have a very broad Highland pony - no wither, chunky shoulders - a challenge to fit.

I discovered that brands like Wintec and Thorogood just didn't work for her, Saddle Company saddles do though as they are completely adjustable by a fitter and the flocking can be altered by your local saddler too.

 

[Bowen4Horses]

I think that you have already answered this yourself, weight, why is the cob putting weight on in the winter? Are you riding less? If he has a loaded shoulder there is only one way the saddle will go! I do understand your problem, I had a cob mare and the same thing used to happen. It only improved with fitness and the development of a wither. Good luck.

pretty sensible answer.

also, cob saddles are cut back at the shoulder already so are almost working hunter cut anyway.

did your saddle fitter mention anything about your horse's 'girth groove'? if they have quite a forward groove it can pull the saddle forward. try a curved girth. so the girth can sit in the groove under the belly but 'curve' back allowing the saddle to sit slightly further back?

hmmm.... cobs can sometimes be like this to fit. it's not necessarily your fitter's fault.

good luck! i'd defo try a curved girth to start with, any probs, PM me. i'm out all day but will reply later xxx

 

[Bowen4Horses]

Secondly, using the back (balance) strap will just make it worse and is poor (and incompetant!) advice from your saddler. The girth usually wins when it comes to staying where it wants to be (usually right up under the elbows in cobs) and will drag the saddle forwards with it. So using the strap right at the back just drags the saddle all the more. Try using just the point and second strap so the girth lines up better with the saddle rigging.

your fitter may have had their reasons for telling you to use point and balance (1&4) straps. so it doesn't necessarily mean your fitter is incompetant... but you can try girthing on different arrangements (eg 1&2) and see if it makes any difference. don't accuse your fitter of being incompetant though!

ps where are you? i'm sure you can get a recommendation on here for a good fitter. xx

 

[jenz87]

Im having similar problems with my girl, its fustrating!!

Ive had my girl for a year and a half now, and been using a wintec pro dressage saddle just fine. She has varied in shape, over this time, but is now a good shape. I fell off about 4 weeks ago and so my boyfriend has been schooling her whilst im off, he is a professional rider, whilst im just a hobby rider and he has been soing alot of fittening work with her and shes improving dramatically, however, in the last few days when going into canter her saddle shoots forward onto the shoulder.
It has never done this before....we thought maybe she had changed shape so we got out the wintec measurer and she is still measuring as before medium wide. Im not sure what to do about it, weve tried a riser pad, weve changed the gullet and no luck.
Is there any other solutions besides a crupper? shes 14.1hh and going to be doing novice dressage soon and i dont realy think its the "right look" for a dressage test, will just make her look like a stumpy pony, which she is not!!!


Any advice will be welcome!!

 

[the watcher]

Ive had my girl for a year and a half now, and been using a wintec pro dressage saddle just fine. She has varied in shape, over this time, but is now a good shape. I fell off about 4 weeks ago and so my boyfriend has been schooling her whilst im off, he is a professional rider, whilst im just a hobby rider and he has been soing alot of fittening work with her and shes improving dramatically, however, in the last few days when going into canter her saddle shoots forward onto the shoulder.
It has never done this before....we thought maybe she had changed shape so we got out the wintec measurer and she is still measuring as before medium wide. Im not sure what to do about it, weve tried a riser pad, weve changed the gullet and no luck.
Is there any other solutions besides a crupper? shes 14.1hh and going to be doing novice dressage soon and i dont realy think its the "right look" for a dressage test, will just make her look like a stumpy pony, which she is not!!!

I'd be very surprised if your saddle had the required fitting for a crupper on the back of it anyway. Have a look at your flocking, if you have been using this saddle very regularly perhaps it has gone a bit flat.

 

[elvisbabeey]

hey, i have the same thing with my new forest every 5 mins i have to get off and re do the saddle! i have got a limpit non slip numnah and it really helps, if you dont put a normal numnah on just the saddle and the non slip limped numnah xx