Sale trial terms? Advice much appreciated! :)

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Cerries

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Hi everyone!

Due to a change in circumstances, I'm having to sell my boy (absolutely gutted - but it is what it is :( ).

The family who would like to buy him have asked for a trial (of six weeks, to give him time to settle etc). I'm totally happy with that - I'd rather him go to the right home. I know the yard he's going to (it's local), and know a couple of liveries who are also there. So I'm quite comfortable with the situation. They are serious buyers, and are known locally (the girl recently lost her horse, so is in the local 'horsey circle' :) ).

But I'm just wondering if there are some 'terms' I should maybe lay out ahead of them collecting him on Friday?

Maybe even something for us all to sign? Or is that a bit OTT?

I'm going to have to keep paying for his livery while he's on trial, so I don't think it's unreasonable for them to cover that cost?

I'd be keeping the passport until the sale is complete.

If anyone has any guidance or experience they'd be willing to share, I'd be most grateful.

Thank you! <3
 
You must give the passport to them as it has to go with the horse. It does not indicate ownership.

As for the rest, I would not be letting him go without a full loan contact in place. What happens, for example, if they injure him, return him and he is no longer fit to sell?
 
ycbm said:
You must give the passport to them as it has to go with the horse. It does not indicate ownership.

As for the rest, I would not be letting him go without a full loan contact in place. What happens, for example, if they injure him, return him and he is no longer fit to sell?
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Thank you ycbm! I hadn't realised that about the passport - that's good to know, thank you!

They have told me verbally that they will take care of any vets bills incurred etc during the trial, but I'd definitely prefer to have it all in writing. Exactly for that reason...better to be safe than sorry!
 
Meredith said:
I am probably being overly cautious but, heaven forbid, what would happen if your horse was broken irreparably? I think a lot of owners will not allow trials because of this.
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I completely understand that, Meredith. And probably better to be over cautious! The only reason I've agreed to it is because I know where he's going, have eyes on the yard, and have done a little homework on the family buying him.

But as you say...there's always a risk. I want to make sure he's a good fit for them (the last thing I'd want is for him to go to someone who sold him on straight away!) - but I also want to cover my bases :/
 
Personally I'd take full payment then offer a full refund if not suitable.

It gives you the most protection, after all you have the most to lose
 
catroo said:
Personally I'd take full payment then offer a full refund if not suitable.

It gives you the most protection, after all you have the most to lose
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This. Simple document saying " x amount revieved as full payment for xyz horse. Horse may be returned within 6 weeks from today's date, if found to be unsuitable. To be eligible for refund horse must be returned in same condition as currently which is sound and in good physical condition"
 
Years ago I had a horse on a 4 wk trial, their condition was I had to insure her before they let her come to me. I was a genuine buyer but looking back Im actually shocked they agreed to it. Anything could have happened to what was still their horse, a kick in the field etc and I could have just returned her. As it turned out, they pushed me after 3 weeks, as their livery was due, I agreed to buy and months later found out she'd previously had 12 mths off through injury and had Navicular!
 
I wouldn't even consider it. What if he goes lame? They break him? They will hand him back sharpish and you will be left with him. Offer them to come and try him at yours as often as they want if theyre that keen.
Or take full payment and only refund if he is returned saleable - that will concentrate their minds on whether they are serious buyers.
 
I'd also want payment in full, with a note that they can only return the horse in the same condition. I'd also insist on additional trials before it goes to them- the biggest risk is always a dramatic change in behaviour, caused by them, which they try to say is an existing issue and return the horse as a rearer, serial bucker, etc. I'd give a very detailed description of the horse, and perhaps get and keep videos if the new rider on board, and insist on bloods at vetting.

You also open yourself up to issues where an existing condition (arthritis etc) isn't picked up at vetting, but the horse then goes wrong in the coming weeks. If it passes the vetting, I think you need it in writing that it can't then be returned for reasons of unsoundness or ill health.
 
Very very risky. They most likely are genuine people but as we all know so many things can and do go wrong with horses.
Accidents illness injury whatever.
If you go ahead with this you need to cover yourself.
Who pays any vet bills? Insurance?
What happens if God forbid the horse gets colic or something?
You could be lucky and all go to plan but really be very careful.
 
Regardless of the risks it's in affect a short term loan.
I believe if you look on BHS website you can get a free loan agreement that you can adapt to your purposes and will point you to some things you haven't covered.
 
A word of warning.... if they "break" your boy, he could come back you you broken...and unsellable. My advice, for wgat its worth is to NEVER lrt a horse go out on trial....sorry. NO WAY... MONEY UP FRONT OR NO HORSEY...
 
Not madness at all.
But you do need to be aware of the risks and try and minimise them.

If you are going ahead I would suggest they vet the horse before it leaves your yard - that way there is independent evidence of the condition of the horse before they receive it.

A loan agreement in place - you can download from BHS

Full insurance including LOU in your name, they pay the premiums

Alternatively they pay in full and get a refund if horse returns in same condition
 
If you agree to the trial (and I agree with others that full caution is needed), then get a proper loan agreement drawn up. Insist that the horse is vetted before he leaves your care, and the buyers/loaners (not you) should pick up the tab for that.

It would be less risky if they trialled him from your current yard. If he's insured, make sure that the insurance co is kept in the loop.
 
It's the minor problems they can cause - behavioural, not being caught, napping etc which they could so easily cause, rather than the major ones like injury. I never let a horse go on trial - as others have said, LWVTB (with all the conditions including term and price set out in an agreement) or share for a period at your yard. Otherwise it cold all go so horribly wrong in the little ways.
And as with any loan, do a full homecheck first, especially looking at any horses they currently own and the relationship with them.
 
As has been said insure the horse in your name and they pay the premium it is the only way to protect yourself,them insuring it in their name does not cover you.Personally I wouldnt agree to a trial in the first place.There are other ways !
 
Why would anyone want a trial of six weeks? You are not a dealer, and they should not expect this however, 'nice' they are.
Six weeks is a long time in winter and with changes in management you horse could go wrong pretty quickly. The cynic in me thinks it will be out hunting over the holiday. Cheap entertainment.

Its human nature, people never look after something as well as if its theirs, I have had plenty of experience from the nicest homes, with a contract. When you ask, why they have or have not done something, 'I thought you wouldn't mind, but our friend, instructor, YO , thought it would be better with.....', but they never pick up the phone and ask you.
I would get them to pay for it.
 
I would have a loan agreement signed. The horse MUST stay on current yard and trial is for one month only MAX (if livery is paid monthly it seems fair) and I would be sitting at the yard most days to keep an eye on things. Six weeks trial is way too long (a month is too long to be honest!) moving the horse is risky (new environment, new turnout buddies, field accident, broken horse, back to you as unsellable! No thanks!!!)

OP I would rethink this.
 
I'd had my youngster 31 days when she suffered a career ending injury in the field, and just months later was PTS.

I owned her, but still many people close to me felt the seller was liable. The reality was I'd just been incredibly unlucky. I quickly discovered I'm in the minority in being the sort that doesn't seek to blame someone else in these situations.

It's all well and good for the buyer to verbally say they'll cover any vet bills that arise, but I would go into this expecting to foot them yourself whether or not you have a contract in place, then at least you can't be disappointed.
 
I can see why you are doing this and it could pay off. However 6 weeks is far, far too long a period. 2 weeks would be best but even 4 weeks would be better than 6. Honestly - do not allow 6 weeks.

Otherwise, I would insist on a vetting before he leaves the yard and that they pay in full. They will be responsible for any vet bills and need to insure him (not that I would cancel your own insurance, just in case).
 
I'd ask why he needs 6 weeks to settle, most horses are asked to travel to a new place to do a low level dressage test or sponsored ride and they are not allowed settling in time.
I would insure yourself (so any payments come to you) rather than ask them to insure (so no debate about who keeps the pay out) - they can give you the premiums. If he is valuable (more than £3-4k) then I'd insure for loss of use.
Full loan contract with rights for you to collect him before the end if you don't think it's working, specify food, who can ride (not all and sundry), whether they are allowed to compete/ hunt etc in that time
They pay all costs while he's away (inc shoes if due in that 6 weeks - specify your farrier)
Totally agree with them paying for the vetting before he goes, then there is no debate about whether he was lame before he left you or not (as there would be if he was vetted after 6 weeks)
Good luck - being a buyer I know the value of a trial, but I can also fully understand why no sellers would want to do it.
Personally I think a couple of weeks at the sellers yard (and a seller supervised trip out if required) is more than enough to decide.
 
I think it totally depends.

I have just bought. Horse was 11 and 3-4 hours drive away. I rode him 4 times before purchase, took an experienced friend who rode him, took my instructor who rode him, and taught me a bit on him, hacked him, saw owner ride him. (Over space two weekends). He was home having passed a five stage vetting within ten days of advert coming out.

I bought him early November. I&#8217;d say he&#8217;s taken at least a month to settle in, and was quite unsettled in his stable for a while.

Some horses turn into different horses in new homes which is neither the buyer or sellers fault. Same as some horses change with a yard move and same owner. Bit of a lottery.

I am selling my 15 year old, tireless but slightly quirky small horse. Having realised he really isn&#8217;t the right horse for me. I want him to find one hopefully perfect long term home, I really want to get it right. Loaner rode him 5 times before having him on loan &#8211; slow hack, fast hack in company, hacked alone, schooled, had lesson. I wanted to be sure she knew quirks and were a good match. I have agreed to loan with a view to buy at the end of January. He went in September. This way we can both be absolutely sure all are happy in new home. If he thrives and she is still enjoying him end January (I am sure will be) then can be as sure as can be that is a good home.

Of course are risks. But I am not seeing him as my asset. I am seeing him as my friend that I want to do right by. I know if sell are no guarantees, but by doing a winter loan with a view to buy, I am hopefully that I find him the right long term home, and he isn&#8217;t back on the market aged 16 / 17.

What you do is a personal decision as horses are much loved pets as well as assets.
 
I think in these circs OP has a slight problem in that she presumably can't afford on-going livery etc if horse is returned broken in some way.

I completely understand the desire to verify that horse has a home that is the best fit possible and, also, I do see that settling in a new yard to *live* is a bit different than settling for an hour or two's competition or clinic.

So, agree with the posters suggesting that horse is vetted first and, if it passes, is sold at the point with a refund 'if doesn't suit' but is returned fully sound and with no vices as per point of vetting.

That way OP doesn't get back something she can't afford to keep and won't be able to sell. Obviously there is the risk that if horse did get kicked in the field or similar the new owners wd discard it (PTS/low end sale/whatever) but having just invested they are more likely to be willing and able to see it through a small amount of rehab probably.
 
It's a nope from me.

You say the yard is local so why can't they trial from your yard? Take the horse out a few times to various arenas or whatever so they can see him in various conditions and that should be enough. 2 weeks max
 
Tricky! I had my old tb on a weeks trial, the owners kept his insurance going and we agreed what I could do in that week (which was pretty much anything I wanted). They delivered him to my yard and checked out they were happy with everything. I allowed a lovely connie mare to go on loan with option to buy, I knew the family quite well and was more concerned that she had a nice long term home than the money, however, actually getting any money out of them was like pulling teeth. I would never do it again. Money up front or horse stays where he is! Also, 6 weeks is a very long time for a trial, perhaps i've been lucky but I've never had a horse or pony turn into a loony because it has moved homes, I've had the odd one that has been very quiet initially though. If the potential owners are quite close I'd just them them come to try the horse as often as they like from your yard but keep the horse on the market and warn them that if you get another buyer, you will go with them.
 
The only direct experience of trials (not my horse) was on my old yard: 6 week trial at the seller's yard. New teenage 'owners' arrived every day to ride and had a fabulous summer. Then disappeared at the end of the summer never to be seen again! They had the relevant paperwork drawn up- none of it was enforceable.

I agree with those who say expect payment upfront which you can refund if horse is unsuitable. And they should pay your livery if the only reason you need to keep a stable is in case he comes back.

Not quite the same situation, but when I was selling my pony a family wanted me to take him off the market while they arranged to come back up again to trial him. I only agreed on the basis of a 20% deposit which was only refundable if the pony was not as described.
 
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