Seat and leg strengthening exercises

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emfen1305

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Last night the devil woman (also known as my instructor) made me do 30 mins no stirrup work in walk, trot and canter (rising trot with no stirrups?!). Anyway, what this threw up is Toby responds very well to a deep seat and he worked beautifully in the trot, something we have been struggling with for ages. I am aware of my terrible seat (i have a perched seat, legs too far back, upper body forward etc) and even weaker lower leg (i physically cannot keep it against his side) so what can i do (both on and off Toby) to help me to sit deeper and wrap my leg around him more to stop it from moving? It doesn't help that he is not the most forward going of horses (this is being looked at separately) so I feel like I constantly have to chase him..
 
Ooh will be following with interest as I have similar issues although my ins is not nearly so mean (so far anyway!) haha.

Stretches and core work unridden, Pilates type stuff. I don't, but keep meaning too, but I do do stretches and have booked myself in for shiatsu next week as the start of some body work.

Work without stirrups which you're already doing.

I suspect the leg problems and pitching forward are symptoms of trying to keep him straight and forward, and like me you may have resorted to nagging or in my case holding on too tight and locking up, which actually acts like a handbrake. Just started with a new ins who is getting me to take my legs off, relax through my body and joints (inc wiggling my ankle to release the leg), use my core, and take the weight out of my stirrups (toes) plus getting him going off a quicker aid, backed up with the whip if he ignores it. And remembering to release the aid to avoid me locking up.

Check your saddle and stirrup length too, I've just gone up a hole whilst we sort this out with the hope I can lengthen in time when I'm more flexible.

A lot of this is counter intuitive to me given how I've been riding, and it's a lot to think about, but after two lessons it already feels so much nicer and he's responding really well to it.
 
You don't have to keep your lower leg wrapped around the horse, it's the thigh that 'wraps' around, the lower leg should just rest against his side..yoga, Pilates are both good for lengthening and strengthening the body for starters...10 minutes with no stirrups when you're on your todd riding is good, imagine a piece of string coming out of the top of your head, check your tongue is off the roof of your mouth and mouth open if relaxed, count or recite abc to keep rhythm and keep you breathing...Sally swift books are good to read and practise ...it takes time but you'll get there if you're determined! Good luck..
 
Tipping forward is going to prevent you sitting deeper and will effectively stop the horse from moving forward as well as it could, riding without stirrups probably got you sitting up taller so everything else improved, keep on going without stirrups and the rest of the time look up ahead of you, most of us get too fixed on looking at the top of the horses head rather than looking up where we want to go, just keeping your head up should make a difference to your weight distribution and in turn he may be more forward going so everything else becomes easier.
 
You'll probably hate me for saying this but... do a bit bareback (if he's trustworthy enough). My seat has come on leaps and bounds since including regular bareback schooling sessions into my work! Start out small with 5 minutes of walk only and put a neck strap on, when confident start to add straight lines in trot and walk lateral work and build it up. It took me a year or more to get comfortable to canter a 20m circle but it really highlighted all my balance and seat issues. You have to learn to relax and 'sit' with the horse.
Depending on your area is there a mechanical horse with a biomechanics focused instructor who could do you a lesson? It allows you to work on you without worrying about your horse and because you're not disappearing 20m away they can really look at what you're doing.
I also hired a personal trainer to help me work through some of my strength issues and really develop my core. A lot of these things can be found online too and most don't require much in the way of equipment: squats, lunges, planks all help to keep that middle still and strong. A gym ball is a worthwhile investment and there are tons of things you can use it for if you use google as your friend. One of my greatest discoveries is the wealth of fitness videos available on youtube - it's completely free and there is something for what ever level you're at now.
 
Out of the saddle, I swear by Pilates and Yoga for general core strengthening. I used to go to a class for a couple of years, but I found it increasingly difficult to fit in with a horse on DIY livery, a full time job alongside family and friends. So I know just practise at home, but use YouTube videos as well. I do go to the gym and find that cardiovascular work has helped with my general fitness for riding – I’ve not been able to go routinely the last few weeks and definitely noticed a difference. I’m back on it now :D

I’ve also recently had two lessons with an EquiPilates instructor and the difference this has made to my riding and my horse’s way of going is absolutely immense. It turns out that I was inavertedly blocking some of my horse’s movement, so you may find that as your seat improves your horse’s forward-ness improves too  Plus, it sits really nicely and compliments my regular trainer way of training.
I can feel such a difference in my riding in only a few sessions, so would highly recommend that too – it also really helped me bridge the gap between getting it right on the mat and it all going wrong on the horse, which I found happened *all* the time.

I really want to have a mechanical horse lesson too – but need to save up some pennies before this, the problem with having a real horse is that the pennies don’t always go far enough!
 
Don't rush into the mechanical horse lesson. I had one when the years wanted to check I could ride, it was useless apparently my riding is faultless!! I wish!

The lesson was to check my riding before I had the private lunge lessons I wanted, I went somewhere else for me lunge lessons I was so disappointed at the lack of teaching and waste of my money!
 
Bernster said:
Ooh will be following with interest as I have similar issues although my ins is not nearly so mean (so far anyway!) haha.

Stretches and core work unridden, Pilates type stuff. I don't, but keep meaning too, but I do do stretches and have booked myself in for shiatsu next week as the start of some body work.

Work without stirrups which you're already doing.

I suspect the leg problems and pitching forward are symptoms of trying to keep him straight and forward, and like me you may have resorted to nagging or in my case holding on too tight and locking up, which actually acts like a handbrake. Just started with a new ins who is getting me to take my legs off, relax through my body and joints (inc wiggling my ankle to release the leg), use my core, and take the weight out of my stirrups (toes) plus getting him going off a quicker aid, backed up with the whip if he ignores it. And remembering to release the aid to avoid me locking up.

Check your saddle and stirrup length too, I've just gone up a hole whilst we sort this out with the hope I can lengthen in time when I'm more flexible.

A lot of this is counter intuitive to me given how I've been riding, and it's a lot to think about, but after two lessons it already feels so much nicer and he's responding really well to it.
Click to expand...

My colleague at work keeps pestering me about yoga classes but I suppose I could do something like that at home a couple of times a week!

Yes that's exactly my problem! I basically throw myself at him to try and get him to go and stay forward but I know how counterproductive this is but i just can't help myself haha! In my head I keep thinking sit up, look up and use your hips but it all falls apart when he backs off. Unfortunately he is a rebellious chap, the whip makes it worse, he does this kick/pathetic buck but does anything but go forward (this is being looked at as a separate issue to make sure there isn't anything going on physically!)

I ride too short so I've lengthened to try and get my heels to stay down so i can use my legs properly! I will definitely give the yoga and pilates a go though and carry on with the no stirrups!
 
Micky said:
You don't have to keep your lower leg wrapped around the horse, it's the thigh that 'wraps' around, the lower leg should just rest against his side..yoga, Pilates are both good for lengthening and strengthening the body for starters...10 minutes with no stirrups when you're on your todd riding is good, imagine a piece of string coming out of the top of your head, check your tongue is off the roof of your mouth and mouth open if relaxed, count or recite abc to keep rhythm and keep you breathing...Sally swift books are good to read and practise ...it takes time but you'll get there if you're determined! Good luck..
Click to expand...

I had very achy thighs last night so that must hopefully mean something is happening! I'll do some pilates and I'll ride the home stretch of my hack with no stirrups (as long as the killer pigeons are not around!) - i'll look into the books thanks! the counting for rhythm is a good idea too, i do find myself tensing up which i know defeats the point really!
 
be positive said:
Tipping forward is going to prevent you sitting deeper and will effectively stop the horse from moving forward as well as it could, riding without stirrups probably got you sitting up taller so everything else improved, keep on going without stirrups and the rest of the time look up ahead of you, most of us get too fixed on looking at the top of the horses head rather than looking up where we want to go, just keeping your head up should make a difference to your weight distribution and in turn he may be more forward going so everything else becomes easier.
Click to expand...

I try so hard to tell myself head up, look up and ride from my seat but it just seems to go to pot when he starts dropping back and I start flapping like a chicken!! I think I've ridden like this for so long and managed to get away with it (always had forward horses) so now I am being punished! I'll just carry on with the no stirrups, a bit every time I ride and see how we go! thanks :)
 
Another one recommending yoga here. It'll help with flexibility, balance, relaxation. I go to a class because I haven't got the self-discipline to practise from youtube videos...
When I remember, I try to do stretches with my heel below my toes, to help with keeping heels down.
 
MuddyMonster said:
Out of the saddle, I swear by Pilates and Yoga for general core strengthening. I used to go to a class for a couple of years, but I found it increasingly difficult to fit in with a horse on DIY livery, a full time job alongside family and friends. So I know just practise at home, but use YouTube videos as well. I do go to the gym and find that cardiovascular work has helped with my general fitness for riding – I’ve not been able to go routinely the last few weeks and definitely noticed a difference. I’m back on it now :D

I’ve also recently had two lessons with an EquiPilates instructor and the difference this has made to my riding and my horse’s way of going is absolutely immense. It turns out that I was inavertedly blocking some of my horse’s movement, so you may find that as your seat improves your horse’s forward-ness improves too  Plus, it sits really nicely and compliments my regular trainer way of training.
I can feel such a difference in my riding in only a few sessions, so would highly recommend that too – it also really helped me bridge the gap between getting it right on the mat and it all going wrong on the horse, which I found happened *all* the time.

I really want to have a mechanical horse lesson too – but need to save up some pennies before this, the problem with having a real horse is that the pennies don’t always go far enough!
Click to expand...

Definitely going to start some videos I think, everything at work thinks I must be amazingly strong and have great core strength but its all a lie haha! Interesting about the EquiPilates, I'll have to look into that. I definitely must be blocking him in some way because he show's these glimmers of Valegro in amongst the Blackpool Donkey but only when I get off his case. Unfortunately I have also made him this as I've been schooling him (badly it seems!) for 2.5 years so he also goes like a donkey for good riders! Will have a look around for the EquiPilates definitely thanks :)
 
wren123 said:
Don't rush into the mechanical horse lesson. I had one when the years wanted to check I could ride, it was useless apparently my riding is faultless!! I wish!

The lesson was to check my riding before I had the private lunge lessons I wanted, I went somewhere else for me lunge lessons I was so disappointed at the lack of teaching and waste of my money!
Click to expand...

Ah that's a shame, Toby's physio does the mechanical horse lessons but she has also watched me ride so she knows my faults anyway (i twist my pelvis so my right leg sits further forward and my left leg is horrendously weak) but might be something to consider so I only have to focus on my position rather than Toby too!
 
TheOldTrout said:
Another one recommending yoga here. It'll help with flexibility, balance, relaxation. I go to a class because I haven't got the self-discipline to practise from youtube videos...
When I remember, I try to do stretches with my heel below my toes, to help with keeping heels down.
Click to expand...

Right, definitely going to try Youtube first this weekend and look for some classes as well!
 
Definitely yoga, running, aerobics....

.... however, if you want to improve your seat.... I used to say Sylvia Loch or Heather Moffett but now I would also add Mary Wanless... Look her up, look her books up. Very sensible and very relatable!
 
I know your pain. My horse sounds similar to yours, not very forward and I sometimes feel like I am constantly pushing and shoving. I do the tip forward thing like you, in the hope he will come with me and my interlocutor is always telling me to push my hips forward. What surprisingly helped me was, I had a side saddle lesson. Things I learned in the lesson I have been using in normal riding and feel he is more forward. As I wasn't able to use both legs to get him going side saddle, I found myself sitting up more and using my seat and once he got going he maintained a lovely rhythm and I didn't have to keep nagging. We put it down to the side saddle making me sit further back and the instructor kept telling me to think of the triangle between my belly button and shoulder and keeping that all structured. I thought I might fall off if I didn't hold it all together and so managed to maintain it for longer than when I ride astride. Was in agony the next day though!!!
 
Being able to drop your leg down and round (or inability to) isn't your core, it's your hip flexors. Whilst having a strong core and lower leg will help with stability etc (and I spend a lot of time in the work gym to build this as I don't ride enough horses), if your hip flexors are tight it is physically impossible to drop your leg into a dressage type length. If I know I'm having a dressage lesson I'll do a session focusing on my lower back and hips beforehand, makes a massive difference.
 
I've been working on a lot of no stirrup work mainly out hacking as it's a bit easier (not sure whether its brave or stupid) but actually what Lanky Loll said about it being the hips rather than the core definitely rings true, i find it physically impossible to drop my leg down and round so we have been working on some in and out of saddle movements to relax my hips and pelvis. I now do 5-10 mins of no stirrup work in walk and trot at the beginning of every ride to try and reinforce this leg dropping action which has seemed to help, it does mean i have to faff around with my stirrups a bit more but I have noticed he has been much more responsive to my leg for the rest of session, probably because i am using it properly rather than just digging my heels into him!

Still need to find the time for the yoga but maybe now can be more focused in the lower body area rather than just my core!
 
Totally agree about riding bareback.
Improves your balance. Strengthens your core and allows a much better feel of the horse. It deepens your seat.
Contrary to some opinion it is not bad for the horse. Quite the opposite.
It also reduces the weight being carried by around 10Kg.
Again rising trot is perfectly possible.
The other is to do lunge work again no stirrups.
 
Try and remember that you shouldn’t have your heels pushed down in the stirrups, they should be level, resting in the stirrups..hips loose, knees off, no gripping! Heels only really come down when jumping, just before you jump/go to fold...
 
I tip forward. My instructor told me to stick a large pair of socks/gloves down the front of my jods to get me to sit where I should (I am not a bloke....). Immense improvement in how I sit though I feel/felt incredibly daft doing it.
 
More no stirrups, and standing up in your stirrups. I hate my instructor when she makes me do this but trotting while standing up really makes you get your weight down into your heel and stop gripping with your knee.
 
I totally feel your pain here, as it's taken the best part of this year for me to crack similar issues.

I haven't RTFT but echo those that say pilates, but make sure you're doing the exercises properly else you'll only end up tightening the muscles you want to be more supple, which kinda defeats the point. My biggest breakthroughs came from forcing myself to do no stirrup work every time I schooled, starting at a couple of laps of sitting/rising trot on each rein, until I could get up to 10mins, and believe it or not, sitting on a balance/wobble cushion at work. I had the typical rider combination of tight hips, weak glutes and honestly can't begin to tell you what an impact that cushion has had almost from the word go! Might hips are looser and I find I can now stretch my lower leg, whereas before try as I might I found myself drawing my legs up.

I also have found the latest Mary Wanless book "Rider Biomechanics" to be really insightful, as has a fellow livery who had similar struggles.
 
https://imgur.com/a/7R2Hk

These were all taken over the course of just over a year. The top was the day I viewed Pops. My stirrups were far too long and I was bricking it having watched her be a spooky madam for the pro rider. Bottom left was the first time I rode M and bottom right was a couple of weeks ago. We're still not perfect (who is?!) But we're definitely improving :)

ETA - I give up on embedding the pic :D
 
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Go to a physio. I have just started and after a few sessions we have really narrowed down what the problems are and specific exercises to help.
I had been to a mechanical horse before, good fun and a laugh with friends but yes you end up a bit perfect on the perfect horse.

The physio I'm seeing now is not a horse physio but a horse rider and specialising in back problems and symmetry. We started with a non-mounted session where she quickly identified weaknesses, got the saddle out to confirm how I sit. Had treatment and exercises with next session on horseback. Found more issues, had treatment and exercises. Next step is probably taping so I have a physical reminder when I'm riding to engage certain muscles.
 
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