Selfish Owner or Caring owner?

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niagaraduval

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There is a woman at the yard with an Arab. The Arab is beautiful. She is looked after well by her owner. But, all the other horses (3) are turned out 24/7. The yard is a good 10 mins walk from the field. The little Arab stays in 24/7 and she is so desperate to get out with the others. She lives in all on her own. She's completely chewed the inside of her stable, she's ALWAYS weaving, head banging, turning in circles.. When i bring one of the other horses up, when i turn them back out she goes mental in her stable. The horses are always neighing to each other. The other horses only get brought in to be ridden/groomed 3 times a week, so the mare doesn't have any other horse contact. I feel so sorry for her. She's so 'hot' . I know she's an Arab but i am convinced that she would be a lot calmer if she was out with the others.
I and 3 other people, have told her she needs to go out, but the owner is against the idea. She said horses are stable creatures.
She buys this mare a huge box of sugar cubes each week...
The mare has to be 'perfect' She's constantly dieting her then adding more food.. it's ridiculous i find.


What should we do? We have tried talking to the owner but she doesn't want her to go out.
She's there to look pretty.

Help?!
 
sounds cruel to me too.
what about the horse`s mental wellbeing?
does it not get to roll in the mud,feel the sun and socially interact with other horses?
 
your yard owner should get involved here. none of ours would be allowed in 24/7 without a very good reason, i.e., box rest, especially if they were going to show such signs of stress and destroy their boxes.

F x
 
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What does your yard owner say?

This sounds like cruel confinement to me.

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The yard Owner said the same thing. ''She needs to go out''.
We (the YO, Yard worker, and I) Have said several times she should go out. I even considered turning her out myself, although thought about the consequences and decided against it. Whatever we say she won't listen. She doesn't know what's best for her mare.
The horses are on a 7acre pasture (there are 3 of them) so there is room for her. The horses are all friendly and they all lived in together during the winter. So, i don't think she would get hurt..
I think it's more to do with the way she thinks. She came from a huge posh Yard where the horses are kept in all the time..
I think personally, she can't be bothered to go catch her/turn her out. Although that's what the Yard worker is employed to do..
We feel so sorry for this little mare..
 
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sounds cruel to me too.
what about the horse`s mental wellbeing?
does it not get to roll in the mud,feel the sun and socially interact with other horses?

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No, she doesn't. She stands in the Barn on her own all day. These are American stables, and the wall to the stable is right in front of her, so she doesn't even get to watch the tractors come in and out.. The owner chose that stable although there were 3 stables spare..
 
well, imho, this horse is treated worse than somebody who has their horses out and doesnt bother with them ,at least they get to be horses.

sounds like it is a prisoner on solitary confinement,i would tell the stupid woman how cruel she is.
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Is very cruel and can cause huge problems.

In one of her last homes April was limited to 1 hour of turnout a day and I think as a result she developed a terrible habit of turning and booting anyone who tried to catch her!!!!
I know her very first owner and I know she didn't have this problem before poor little soul. It's mental torment IMO.

It took me and her owner over a year to cure it properly (am glad to say she is now perfect to catch and comes straight down to me almost every time
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)

Someone has to get involved here in more stonger terms! Poor little Arab
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Of course, she's selfish. Maybe not materially or financially because her outlay on hay, straw, shavings, feed etc must be enormous, and she must spend a good few hours a week mucking out, but her desire to imprison her horse like this is shameful. Does she ride? I would suspect she's frightened of it, and is too scared to take it out of its stable in case it misbehaves, which creates a vicious circle of frustrated horse leading to badly behaved horse leading to horse that mustn't be given any freedom. Her comment about horses being "stable creatures" is too laughable to remark on!! Does the poor thing get no grass? There are all sorts of calmers available, or her vet could suggest a sedative, to enable to horse to get used to being turned out with the others. I would have thought the YO ought to have stepped in before now, particularly if the stable is being chewed to pieces.
 
Has the YW said that she will happily get the horse in/turn the horse out?

I am not against stabling horses at all, but if they are stabled then they did exercise, daily!
 
This is very sad but unfortuntely there is nothing you CAN do! the horse is obviously being fed & watered and has its feet cared for? looks healthy? then the RSPCA cant get involved and it just going to torment you so you can either offer to buy it from her or move yards so that you don't see whats going on.
 
It sounds like she's being over protective of her horse & doesn't realise. Even prisoners get more exercise than this horse. A strong intervention by the YO nees to be made here really.
 
do the RSPCA cover France to intervene and advise the owner?

It's cruel, the poor horse, no wonder she's slowly going out of her mind, to be able to see other horses out interacting and not join them, I don't put it down to her being an arab tbh, I've seen lots of them that are lovely quiet neddies, I'd put it down to how she's kept, to say they're stable creatures is ridiculous, if she wants to be really technical weren't arabs designed to roam on the desert sands.......:(

the stupid thing is it'd actually save her work, stable done in morning, neddy out, neddy not in to wreck stable up so has to be done at night, I'm stumped as to how to get her to realise she needs to be allowed out to interact, horses are social animals, they have the herd instinct naturally, she's being denied this the poor thing, no doubts her owner puts her behaviour down to 'being an arab' though....:(
 
The YO and YW have told her the horse must go out.
The owner comes 2-3 times a week to ride her. The mares hooves are good..
She doesn't muck the horse out, and the annoying thing is, her horse is stables all the times she gets hay/straw/hard feed and i pay the same amount and Niagara gets nothing. All he gets is grass.
Like i said non of us can get the lady to listen to us. We have tried (we are constantly 'nagging' her to turn the horse out). We even offered to turn her out/bring her in for her.. some people.. grrr..
 
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It sounds like she's being over protective of her horse & doesn't realise. Even prisoners get more exercise than this horse. A strong intervention by the YO nees to be made here really.

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I agree, its so sad the poor little arab. Show her this post it might make her see sense. I think the YO should sort it out, or the YO should just turn her out - say that she was doing herself harm. So sad, horses should be allowed to be horses. I agree that a horse left out all the time and only seen once or twice a week would be better off.
 
So she only comes up 3 times a week? do you know what days? I would just put her out on the days she dosn't come. Unless she is grey of course then the grass stains might be a give away :-)
 
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do the RSPCA cover France to intervene and advise the owner?

It's cruel, the poor horse, no wonder she's slowly going out of her mind, to be able to see other horses out interacting and not join them, I don't put it down to her being an arab tbh, I've seen lots of them that are lovely quiet neddies, I'd put it down to how she's kept, to say they're stable creatures is ridiculous, if she wants to be really technical weren't arabs designed to roam on the desert sands.......:(

the stupid thing is it'd actually save her work, stable done in morning, neddy out, neddy not in to wreck stable up so has to be done at night, I'm stumped as to how to get her to realise she needs to be allowed out to interact, horses are social animals, they have the herd instinct naturally, she's being denied this the poor thing, no doubts her owner puts her behaviour down to 'being an arab' though....:(

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I agree. The horse is in perfect condition though. The perfect weight, perfect feet, her coat is so glossy and shiny..
So i don't think i can call the RSPCA.
 
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So she only comes up 3 times a week? do you know what days? I would just put her out on the days she dosn't come. Unless she is grey of course then the grass stains might be a give away :-)

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hah! No, the lady comes at random times.. so i don't think that's possible !
 
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The yard Owner said the same thing. ''She needs to go out''.

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Well the YO may like to be reminded that he/she actually has a duty of care towards this animal - and if it cruely confined then they must take action.

It is an apalling thing to do to any animal - and if the YO won't take action I'm afraid that I would.

You can ring the BHS welfare line for advise.

Bugger - just realised that you are in France. Do they have any welfare laws??
 
Since typing this and posting it I've read Niagaraduval's further posts, this poor horse is being treated every bit as badly as those left in fields for weeks on end. This woman actually sounds as if she ought not to have horses if she doesn't care about their mental wellbeing, which is every bit as important as their physical care, and their need to be with others. I think the YO has got to take a stronger line here, and get this extremely selfish woman to see sense. You could say the Yard rules are that all horses on the yard must have (unless instructed otherwise by a vet for medical reasons) turnout for at least part of every day; point out that the other horses in the field have no trouble interacting safely with their mates, and that after an initial gallop around they will settle. The poor thing must be longing for a roll in the mud. The care of this horse is shameful, and the owner might be better advised to give up horses. Tell her I said so too, and show her all these posts!!
 
Well said Daffodil - i think it is shocking. She should not have horses.
Your YO should have a rule that all horses have to go out for a certain amount of time everyday unless it is for medical reasons or if the weather is restricting turnout. It makes me mad there are some people that would love to have turnout 24/7 but it isn't aloud at certain yards.
 
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[ QUOTE ]
The yard Owner said the same thing. ''She needs to go out''.

[/ QUOTE ]
Well the YO may like to be reminded that he/she actually has a duty of care towards this animal - and if it cruely confined then they must take action.

It is an apalling thing to do to any animal - and if the YO won't take action I'm afraid that I would.

You can ring the BHS welfare line for advise.

Bugger - just realised that you are in France. Do they have any welfare laws??

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I'm not sure about any of the Welfare laws concerning horses here. Maby a few of the other forumers from France could advise me?
 
Hi, as you mentioned earlier she came from a big yard where turnout didn't happen so she obviously has this mind set. I don't know if this would work but (if she is French) could you point out that top French riders such as... turn there horses out, or that people like Carl Hester (is she's English) believe that horses have to have the mental stimulation of chill out time even if it is for a short period a day.
Sometimes I think re-education is more important than nagging etc. But then if it was my YO she'd a thrown a fit by now about the state the stable was getting into!
 
I would rather see horses dumped in a field for any length of time (with feed, basic care etc) than one left in a stable - entirely uinnatural (unless for good reason, which she doesn't have.

She says horses are stable animals, now where in the wilds of arabia have arabs constructed their own american barns, pray tell? Plus doesn't sound like her poor horse is very 'stable.'

I would just turn it out, and suffer the anger from her owner. I wouldn't care what she said to me...
 
Interesting post and replies.

Some horses do manage perfectly well stabled 24 / 7 provided they are given sufficient alternative methods of physical and mental stimulation. However tha fact that this horse is displaying stereotypic behaviour implies that this is not the case.

Regarding welfare organisations, they should not just consider the physical needs but the mental ones too: most use the Five Freedoms as a guideline:

1. Freedom from Hunger and Thirst - by ready access to fresh water and a diet to maintain full health and vigour.

2. Freedom from Discomfort - by providing an appropriate environment including shelter and a comfortable resting area.

3. Freedom from Pain, Injury or Disease - by prevention or rapid diagnosis and treatment.

4. Freedom to Express Normal Behaviour - by providing sufficient space, proper facilities and company of the animal's own kind.

5. Freedom from Fear and Distress - by ensuring conditions and treatment which avoid mental suffering.

It sounds as if the YO is sitting on the fence. She should not be getting in cahoots and gossiping with other liveries but tackle the situation head on. Either ignore the situation and tell every one else its none of their business, or advise the owner that if she does not provide the horse with sufficient excercise then the yard will do this using whatever means fit. Of course she then runs the risk of losing a livery so boils down to whther she is prepared to put her money where her mouth is.
 
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