Sensitive soles or Laminitis??

[dressagecrazy]

Hi, my old TB boy nearly 22yo. Keeps becoming extremly footy & is lame on a circle & sound on the straight. He had a bad incident with a farrier over 12 years ago which left him with paper thin soles.

His soles are no longer paper thin but the lameness started on/off 2 weeks ago when the ground 1st went quite hard. My farrier has had a good look & can see no reason why his soles would be so sensitive, as they are not paper thin. When he puts his foot down even on the smallest stone or groove in the field he goes hopping lame & then walks it off. He is sound when trotted up straight, but becomes quite short when put on a circle. The vet cant find a reason either.

Im starting to think he could be suffering Lami as well, have been checking digital pulses every day & there has been on occasion a raised pulse. Ive got him confined now to a small very level paddock that has no grass & he can't trot round in, he's got soaked hay & he is up to weight but deffo not over. Sounds cruel but until i can find out what it is i just dont want to risk him out 24/7 on a field of grass that could make him worse, not that ive got much any way.

Im also putting keratex hoof hardener on. BTW he also gets raised digital pulses when he has badly bruised his soles in the past. So you can see why im becoming confused as to whats wrong!!

All this has only come about since the ground went hard, he is shod all round. He's a very fit & active 22yo most people think he's around 12yo, just trying to build a picture up for you of his condition. He still competes in affiliated Dressage, well was until went lame, atm he's out of a night & in of a day.

Is there any other thoughts as to what this could be?? Or any advice??
Do you think it could be Lami or do you think its a bruised sole combined with over sensitive soles?? Or to put a spanner in the works do you think he could be suffering Lami as a result of bruising?? I know im driving myself crazy lol, would you be treating this the same as me?

 

[AmyMay]

What's his grazing like and weight.

It does sound to do with the hard ground to me to be honest, but you know your horse best.

 

[Llwyncwn]

You are saying that the vet cant find a reason. Has he been x-rayed?

Also has the farrier tested for an abcess?

These would be my first port of call, farrier first.

 

[dressagecrazy]

Hi, no he hasnt had x-rays. He went like this last year & we put Pads on he improved greatly. His weight is just about right. He's on a small level paddock that very little grass, so he's being fed soaked hay. Paddock is very small to limit him from running round thus causing more damage.

Im just taking precautions if you like. If there is no improvement then X-rays will obviously be done. Vet does no what his soles are like & the fact he went this way last year on the hard ground makes him belive that its just sensitive soles, but im wondering if its Lami as well.

 

[dressagecrazy]

Whoops meant to say also yes Farrier has tested for an absess. Had my farrier out twice last week checking. But nothing!! Vet just thinks very sensitive soles.

 

[dozzie]

My 29yr old came up the same last week. i am treating for laminitis just to be on the safe side. Not really sure either! Maybe there was a flush of grass. My garden grass grew about 4 inches in six days so i suspect this has caused it. Getting farrier to check tomorrow for absesses again!

He could also have sensitive soles. Is he lame on a circle in a school?

 

[Walder]

how weird - im having vet out in the morning for the same thing! fine in walk farrier cant find any thing wrong no heat or swelling in legs or feet - very worrying!

 

[Tia]

What is his Digital Pulse doing and does he have a temperature?

 

[dressagecrazy]

Tempreture is normal, No digital pulses felt today. Some days they have been slightly raised but only on one never both fronts at the same time. But either fronts can be affected.
He's very fed up in his small paddock bless. In fact he walks out fantastically well until he hits a stone or does a turn. In Trot you wouldnt notice him to be lame until he does a turn.

He is much better today & im going to keep treating him for Lami. I'll give him till Thursday & if no improvement at all will get the vet back out.

Funnily enough i spoke to someone today who's had the same trouble with one of her horses. He had a bruised sole & then came down with Lami.

Im keeping going with the Hoof hardener as well so if it is sensitive soles that may help??.

 

[Spot1]

From what you are describing I would be very surprised if it were laminitis. A strong digital pulse does not necessarily mean laminitis, pain or inflammation in general can cause it. I take it that your farrier tested the sole and couldn't locate the position of any pain, was this done with the shoe removed? I would pay particular attention to the heel area, particularly if the heels low or under run. Are there any signs of bruising at all? The soles do not have to be paper thin to be vulnerable to bruising particularly in a T.B. and even more so if they have a flat footed conformation. Continued bruising can lead to pedal ostitis (confirmed by X-ray)so you are wise to be concerned, if pads help you could continue to use them during the summer or ask your farrier about wide webbed seated out shoes. I hope this is of some help.

 

[dressagecrazy]

Thanks Spotties you have helped. Yes this is my concern ther farrier has only tested his sole with the shoes on. He also has low heals. He didnt show any soreness what so ever when the farrier tested but again this was done with shoes on. Typical farrier he was in a rush.
I know every time he has had bruising in the past ive also had Digital pulses. He also is lame on Turns & circles when he has bruised soles before.

Ive limited the paddock so he's on a flat & level patch, he also can't run around as much. Damage limitation. But yes i do think the pads back on would be the best thing for him, but my farrier hates pads. Even though he knowns in my case they help.

 

[alisonpook]

May be worth looking up a recent article in Horse and Hound which mentioned pads for horses with sensitive feet. Seem to remember Richard Waygood recommended some that were an improvement on the average pad and which allowed his horse to keep eventing during the summer. I have a 28 year old 16.3 who had a Cushing's laminitis attack back in 2004 . He also has sensitive soles and low heels and would be crippled without shoes after a day or so. Have been painting a eucalyptus oil /iodoform mix on his soles in recent weeks and this and the dry weather have toughened them up considerably. He also could since his 5 year old days be sound on the straight but drop on a circle on the very hard. We had him xrayed and it was mild navicular and in the 23 years since I bought him we found the time he started feeling the ground got a little earlier each year. I now just have him on one Danilon a day partly to help with any little aches and pains and partly as an anti inflammatory. Touch wood he's very comfortable at the moment despite the hard ground . His digital pulse can vary according to time of day and weather and I have half a mind that concussion from the hard ground does aggravate it too. I have got into a habit of checking morning and night. Hope you can your boy back to being comfortable

 

[AmyMay]

[ QUOTE ]
He went like this last year & we put Pads on he improved greatly.

[/ QUOTE ]
There's your answer then. Pop pads back on. My TB suffered enormously with the hard summer ground. Around us the grass is certainly not growing as we simply have had no rain - and think the rest of the country may be the same. So think it unlikely that your horse has laminitis. Certainly from your description it sounds as if the hard ground is the problem.

 

[gothdolly]

Join the club!!

Domino went lame in early February (after bolting with a friend on a stoney lane and then being turned out on frosty ground). The vet diagnosed bruised hooves and Domi was on box rest.
Then he was turned out but with wide webbed shoes.

Subsequent vet visits have confused me - the vet has suggested that Domi has Equine Metabolic Syndrome, that I should treat him as if he was at risk of laminitis (although he is not fat) and that he may also have pedal ostiitis or navicular bursitis. X-rays would prove which. If he has not improved in about 4 weeks time he has to go for x-rays. He has a low heel, thin soles, is "footy" and only sound on level ground. No digital pulse though, and the farrier says no signs of laminitis in the hoof.

Im very very confused, and very worried.

My vet suggested pads, but I dont think my farrier liked the idea either - he said that they sweat under the pads and that can cause other problems.

I just bought rubber matting at the weekend for his stable to see if that helped with hoof comfort.

Maybe we should form a "thin soles bruised hooves possible lami" support group, LOL!
Cassandra

 

[Nari]

I've got similar problems with my ID - despite an excellent farrier he has flat feet, sensitive soles & low heels. I find I crucial to have him regularly shod by a good farrier who will take the trouble to propery balance his feet (had a few difficulties with farriers last year that are still causing problems now), regular use of Antibac to harden & disinfect his soles & frog also helps a lot and I'm careful about where & how he's ridden. The farrier really is the make or break element though!

I recently had front feet x-rays done as he's been on-off wrong on one foot for nearly 3 months now, initially thought abcess & bruising but after so long the vet wondered if it was something more - possible chipped pedal bone or navicular. Results were clear on navicular bone, no chip on pedal bone but slight roughening of the bottom of the pedal bone which apparently is quite commomn in flat feet & thin soles & is part of the reason they can be footy. Maybe this is the problem you're having? I also find he gets a raised digital pulse with bruising.

I've had very little success with pads & find hardening his soles works better for him. However if they work for your horse then go for them! Incidentally his bruised feet & footiness don't stop him charging round the field like a lunatic - watching him on so called "rest" makes me wonder why I bother being careful when I ride!

 

[Doublethyme]

It might be worth you doing a search for Low Grade Laminitis - particularly on the Enlightened Equitation Barefoot Forum - there is loads of information on there, which will help shod horses too. Many barefooters are finding that horses who previously were footy over stones (in or out of shoes) and were diagnosed as having thin soles etc etc, are in fact suffering from what is being termed Low Grade Laminitis. This isn't what we usually associate with laminitis, but the very very early warning signs, which it seems many horses have with shoes on, but we just don't know till it becomes full blown lami in some cases. Some don't evolve into full blown lami.

It may not be this, but might be worth reading up on it anyway. Magnesium supplementation seems to help and getting the diet right with no cereals/low sugar/starch. Soak hay 12 hours to leach out as much sugar as possible.

I would definitely treat him as a laminitic for a few weeks and see if that improves his comfort levels. Pads may just cover up the early warning signs if it is laminitis, so I personally would want to make sure that it isn't before doing this.

Horses do not have to be the classic fat, cresty pony to suffer from low grade laminitis. My own mare is a fit TBxWB, not carrying any extra weight, but she is currently muzzled in the field during the day and I just feed her extra soaked hay/suitable hard feeds to keep her weight right. Without the muzzle she comes in with pulses and if I let it continue goes footy, even though she has rock hard thick soles and good feet.

It has been a bad period for laminitis because people don't think the grass is growing - you would be surprised with all the sunshine we have had, even without the rain!

 

[dressagecrazy]

Wow didnt think i would get this many replies. Thank you everyone for your input!! To those who are also having problems i hope your horses get better soon.

Cassandrarose - very intresting your horse sounds very similar to mine. Suppose the only way i will find out for sure is X-rays. Thank you for posting.

Doublethyme - I am aware of Low grade Lami, all my horses are on SS feeds, Murphy has soaked hay as well & Mag-ox, he's also on a small paddock with hardly any grass. Until i get a definative answer i wont take the risk & im treating for Bruised soles & lami.

But after speaking about it on here im also starting to belive that it is just bruised soles. Ive not had much luck with this horses feet for years, so it would make more sense. I suppose im just worried in case it was Lami & i missed it.

He has been free from any digital pulses for the last 2 days. But he is still lame but it has improved slightly. Rung farrier today to tell him to get some pads, he wasnt impressed!! lol...

I dont want to go down the route of pads either but last time he only wore them for 6 weeks & then managed without. Maybe they will do the same this time!! Fingers crossed.

 

[Doublethyme]

Certainly sounds like you have things well in hand, hope something sorts itself for you and your boy.

As a note of interest, whilst I know many horses do really well on SS feeds, I am 100% certain that it made my horse footy and kept pushed her into LGL come the Spring. IE she was on it all winter, but as she was "transitioning" to barefoot, her footiness over stones was put down to that. Spring came and she showed definite signs of laminitis. A marked improvement was seen once she was off the SS feeds and my footy horse who I thought was just like that because her feet weren't tough enough started making huge improvements over rough ground and now even though her pulses can sometimes be a bit erratic on her hinds, is 100% sound on any surface being ridden without shoes!

I put her on SS feeds cause I thought it was the bset thing for her, but it turned out to be the worst! As I say though I know loads of barefoot horses who do really well on the feeds and can't cope on the Top Spec products that I have had success with, so its just what suits yours. Thought it worth a mention though just in case its the combination of the SS feeds in particular lucerne/alfalfa and Spring, which was certainly the case in my mare's case.

Good luck - hope you get things sorted.

 

[dressagecrazy]

Thanks Doublethyme

- Yes i have heard reports of this sort of thing happening with SS-feeds. However my boy hasnt been fed Lucerne. I feed Purabeet & ruffstuff with Instant Linseed Plus Baileys Lo-cal. Not feeding Linseed atm & Only in the depths of winter do any of mine get Lucerne. ATM he gets a mouthful of food which is Ruffstuff & Lo-cal just so i can add his Mag-ox & joint supplement in. Plus they put on weight fast this time of year. Im a cruel mum lol.