Should Hi-Viz be made legal for on the roads?

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Bright_Spark

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This may cause a hearted debate ;), but just wondering what people's thoughts are about it being compulsory to wear hi-viz while on the roads?

Although I imagine it would be difficult to police, but here are a couple of my thoughts:

If in an accident and not wearing hi-viz, insurance void and rider responsible for costs.
Drivers could be held more accountable for causing accidents if hi viz is worn ie, rider was taking every precaution to be seen
Obviously safer for riders, drivers and of course horses.

Perhaps this could also be compulsory for cyclists and bikers (but that's a whole other can of worms).

Let the debate begin :D
 
Yes it should for everyone using the roads, walkers that arent on footpaths, joggers, cyclists, motorcyclists, workmen and horse riders. There was talk of them passing a law about this a few years ago but dont know how far it got.

Dont know why people have such a hang up about wearing hi-viz its for their benefit as hats are. One boy from our town was walking home on a busy road at night and was kiilled as nobody could see him.

You also have to understand that the yellow hi-viz is not very good in bright sunlight as you can easily fade into the back ground so the orange or other colours are better.
 
Kaylum said:
Yes it should for everyone using the roads, walkers that arent on footpaths, joggers, cyclists, motorcyclists, workmen and horse riders. .
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I agree that if was introduced it would have to cover every cateogory to be consistent/fair not just horse riders and I guess that's where the difficulty comes in policing it. Not to mention the costs to market/educate people who don't currently ie the weekend/dog walkers

My bugbear with hi-viz, and near me it seems particularly prevelant amongst joggers, is that people seem to think that hi-viz can be seen at night! It can't - 7pm on wet cold December night it's no more visible than any other colour!! I see a lot of people with hi-viz style orange/yellow t-shirts but no reflective area and it's the reflective bit that drivers can see in the dark. Rant over :mad: sorry I went off on a tangent there!
 
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Highly unlikely that it ever will be but yes, I think all riders should be made to wear hi viz clothing of some sort. I never ride with out making sure both my horse and I are kitted out.
 
Yes it should..

Be seen be safe thats my motto.

The amount of riders round here than wear little to non, ride double file on our bend etc.

I always trot away from the bend as I am going round, give the up coming as much chance to see me as poss.
 
I think it should be that anyone using the roads should have one on. Round here it is not only horse and riders that are hard to see but the dog walkers. Strange lot they put Hi Viz collars or coats on the dog yet nothing for them selves.

When we were in Europe recently it is compulsory for cars to carry a Hi Viz for every seat in the car.
 
Yes it should. As for colours (picking up an earlier comment), the debate is endless. It's permanently ongoing in the diving community, as the inflatable markers we use after surfacing can come in either orange or yellow, and seemingly nobody can agree which is most visible against the sea! It has been suggested for a while now though that yellow is most visible against a darker background. I actually have a two-tone marker for diving, one side yellow and the other orange, which is what a lot of RNLI use.

I'm not suggesting everyone rushes out and buys multicoloured hi vis by the way - just that orange and yellow can have different visibility in different conditions . I prefer yellow for riding since I've never experienced conditions in the UK which are so bright that hi vis yellow would blend in - maybe that's just a northern thing though ;)
 
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Do we really need another law? Surely its common sense to wear it. I wouldn't go anywhere without it. I love my horses and want other road users to see us in plenty of time.
 
I presume the OP's title for this thread should have read
Should HI Viz be made "a legal requirement" to be worn on the roads
So far as I know, it IS legal for HiViz to be worn on the roads

(sorry, being pedantic!!)

and my answer is NO - whatever happened to personal choice and individual freedom for which this country is so famous?

I don't dispute the well worn advantages of Hi Viz - I would object most strongly to being forced to wear it by law - and don't you think the police have better things to do than drive up and down roads, looking for women on horses and checking their clothing (on the other hand, they might enjoy it lol!)

I think it would be another example of wasting Parliamentary time on making unenforceable laws, that the only people who would obey the law are the people who would wear it anyway

(see the further argument re horse passports)
 
Yes it should. I find it very irritating to drive up behind some rider I hardly saw as they were merging into the hedgerow. Somehow the local eventers seem to think it is only "novicey" or "livery yard" owners who need to wear High Viz. Which is silly really because their horses are probably worth 10 times what the others are.

One local lady has 4 eventers and she always exercises them in winter wearing a brown coat. Local people have to complained to ME about her, as if I could do anything about it. We occasionally meet up and you can see she is embarassed to be riding along with me in my pink get-up. I think it is polite to other road users, particularly in country lanes where a horse takes up a good part of the width of the road.
 
I always wear hi-viz myself and think it's very important BUT:

as someone already pointed out, if such a law were passed, it would have to apply equally to pedestrians, cyclists, dog walkers, kids kicking balls in residential streets, etc., etc.

Imagine trying to enforce this. And what would be the punishment if you were caught without hi-vis? A fine? How much? And how much for repeat offenders? Do we really want police focusing on this or on more serious problems?

Also agreeing with the comment that many people are ignorant about hi-viz being worthless in the dark. Only the reflective stripes can be seen in the dark. A LOT of people don't seem to realise this!
 
No. I don't think we should be forced into wearing something by law, it is personal choice if u decide or not tO wear it. I think many road accidents are caused due to speeding and being seen at the last second, rather than not being seen at all. I would not want to wear hi viz when out riding, I agree it would be a waste of time and money trying to enforce. I understand for many it is an integral part of their riding attire, and no doubt has saved lives, but to pass a law to make it compulsory would not be plausible.
 
I assume you are asking whether Hi-viz should be made compulsory by law, it is of course perfectly legal to wear hi-viz on the roads :)

In answer, no I don't think Hi-Viz should be made compulsory. I will always wear it but I will not accept that a higher duty should be imposed upon riders than exists for walkers or cyclists or motorcyclists or even cars.
 
No no no no no no. WHY must people be babied by laws? Can no one think through a scenario and make a choice anymore?

Completely ridiculous idea.
 
Lorries have to have hi viz styles strips down their sides, for increased visibilty when pulling out of junctions

Maybe cars should have hi viz markings too - or reflective ones - so that they can be seen better


Joking apart, the cost of enforcing this proposed law - and the impracticality of it - makes it impossible.

How would you define the hi viz - minimum one arm band, or reflective strip sown into clothing, or one tabard......? If all road users have to comply (as has been suggested to make it fairer and consistent).... An elderly woman walking through her village to pick up a paper, steps onto the road to avoid a pushchair - policeman sees her at that point - charges her with not wearing hi viz? Do you have to be a "habitual" user of the road eg runner - or just an occasional one?

To make something law has to consider every eventuality - IMHO the parameters are too unclear to make it possible
 
Milanesa said:
I think many road accidents are caused due to speeding and being seen at the last second, rather than not being seen at all.
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I think that's the point of hi vis though - it gives drivers longer to react as the horse and rider are seen SOONER. I don't think anyone was ever killed by not being seen at all!

A rider on a bay horse with a hedge in the background or under trees really is almost invisible until the last second. I often pass a local pair of riders, one wears hi vis and rides a grey; her friend does not wear hi vis and rides a bay. Trust me, I have often thought there was only one horse and rider until the last second. And guess which one it was?

I completely agree about nanny states, freedom and choice and all that, but wasn't that argument used when seat belts became compulsory? How many lives have been saved by that? And who even questions it now? I know for a fact I would be furious if I was involved in an accident because the rider wasn't in hi vis. Fine, if people don't want to protect themselves and their animals that's one thing, but don't then expect me to write off my car (or worse) as a result.....
 
Milanesa said:
No. I don't think we should be forced into wearing something by law, it is personal choice if u decide or not tO wear it. I think many road accidents are caused due to speeding and being seen at the last second, rather than not being seen at all. I would not want to wear hi viz when out riding, I agree it would be a waste of time and money trying to enforce. I understand for many it is an integral part of their riding attire, and no doubt has saved lives, but to pass a law to make it compulsory would not be plausible.
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That is the best argument FOR wearing hi-viz, it gives drivers a few extra seconds to register that you are also on the road and take evasive action.

As to OP, I think rather than passing another law which would be very difficult to police, insurance companies should make wearing hi-viz on roads a condition of their cover.

I cannot understand any-one who says that they prefer not to wear hi-viz, they are risking their own and their horse's lives every time they go onto a road.

My RC has a rule that every-one on an organised activity should wear hi-viz on the road - that includes hacking to shows. It also includes Fancy Dress rides (we do a lot of them!), so then the horses usually wear boots. The traffic often crawls past looking at the outfits though - so perhaps we should all just wear fancy dress all the time.

Dog walkers round here drive me mad, frequently neither they nor the dog have anything to give away their presence on dark winter evenings - and many of them let their dogs run loose on a 40mph road!
 
YES YES YES

Had this arguement with my friend the other eve, her horse is black and she had dark clothes on, we have to come through a dark area into the light and I was trying to explain that the cars couldn't see her, she was saying they could aaaaarrrrgggghh

They can see me though lol, we have on between us (me and my horse) :


Pink hat band red flashing light on the back
Pink tabard (but will invest in a polite one cos I like)
He wears a pink hat with ears fly hat thingy, think its v bandz
Neck strap with pink flo and a blue flashing light
Pink flo back boots, legacy ones
Westropp brushing/knee boots with pink flo wrap over the top
If raining, pink exercise sheet with 360 degrree visablility
Pink hi viz on bridle nose and brow bands
The reaction time of cars approaching is definately better, they see my from WAY off lol


I get laughed at on my yard but I DON'T CARE, hopefully it won't be me who's hit by a car, I also find it handy for riding in woods cos dog walkers can see you sooner and bikers except when they hurtle round a blind bend and nearly hit your horse and not even say sorry when they frighten your horse
 
spacefaer said:
Lorries have to have hi viz styles strips down their sides, for increased visibilty when pulling out of junctions

Maybe cars should have hi viz markings too - or reflective ones - so that they can be seen better


Joking apart, the cost of enforcing this proposed law - and the impracticality of it - makes it impossible.

How would you define the hi viz - minimum one arm band, or reflective strip sown into clothing, or one tabard......? If all road users have to comply (as has been suggested to make it fairer and consistent).... An elderly woman walking through her village to pick up a paper, steps onto the road to avoid a pushchair - policeman sees her at that point - charges her with not wearing hi viz? Do you have to be a "habitual" user of the road eg runner - or just an occasional one?

To make something law has to consider every eventuality - IMHO the parameters are too unclear to make it possible
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Spot on.

It would be ridiculous to enforce consistantly. It should however be a matter of common sense that for your own and your horse's safety you wear high-viz and reflective clothing when riding outside the school. Hi-viz is sensible when riding in open country too as it makes it easier for you to be seen by cyclists, walkers, helicopters, tractor drivers, off-roaders and the emergency services.

It is also hardly a hardship to wear is it. A hat band and a mesh tabbard are cheap and lightweight and comfortable.
 
I cannot understand any-one who says that they prefer not to wear hi-viz, they are risking their own and their horse's lives every time they go onto a road.

No, everyone that goes riding takes a risk, especially if out hacking as we are reliant on other road users also using the roads in a proper way. You cannot say that hi viz is a must, I agree i am sure it helps riders be seen, but speeding is a far greater risk IMO to us horse riders. I will not agree that I am risking mine or my horses life by not wearing high viz, what a nanny nation!! Load of tosh. I am more than happy to see peOple out wearing hi viz, well done you if thats what you prefer to wear, but there is no way you can make other riders feel guilty for not weAring it!! Freedom of choice people!
 
Milanesa said:
I cannot understand any-one who says that they prefer not to wear hi-viz, they are risking their own and their horse's lives every time they go onto a road.

No, everyone that goes riding takes a risk, especially if out hacking as we are reliant on other road users also using the roads in a proper way. You cannot say that hi viz is a must, I agree i am sure it helps riders be seen, but speeding is a far greater risk IMO to us horse riders. I will not agree that I am risking mine or my horses life by not wearing high viz, what a nanny nation!! Load of tosh. I am more than happy to see peOple out wearing hi viz, well done you if thats what you prefer to wear, but there is no way you can make other riders feel guilty for not weAring it!! Freedom of choice people!
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I wonder if you are a driver?
If not then perhaps you do not appreciate how much difference a few more seconds stopping time make.

TBH if you want to risk your own life, which admittedly, you could be said to do every time you ride, that is fine. It is the risking of your horse's life, which you do every time you go onto a road without hi-viz, and the lives of other road users, which I object to.
 
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I think it would be impossible to police but think that the insurance companies could help by making it a condition of cover on the road. I live in a forestry commision area and NOBODY leaves mine on bikes or horses without reflective gear. Speed is the major issue round our lanes but then the whole point of Hi Viz is that you are seen earlier no matter what speed they are doing. I would never forgive myself if one of my animals or kids were hurt because we couldnt be bothered to put on HV.
On the other side I also drive round my area a lot (kids taxi service) and although I dont speed have had several close calls with people riding with no HV. On a bright sunny day the shade in the forest completely hides a bay horse with riders in dark clothing.
I also wear a HV jacket when walking down to the bus with the kids on grotty days so perhaps I am trying to be too carefull but I wont live with regrets
 
Some very interesting points made.

And yes, I did mean "should it be a legal requirement" (it was late:o)

I admit that it would be very difficult to enforce, and perhaps a blanket law would be required for all non- veichle road users. Then again, maybe it could only be enforced if a rider is involved in an accident?

Although it is common sense to wear hi-viz, many don't which is why I posed the question really. I don't think it is any more nannying than motorcyclists having to wear helmets, or car drivers having to wear seat belts, but maybe that's just me.

Perhaps, as has been suggested, it could become an insurance clause, although then insurance would need to become compulsory for all riders who use the roads.
 
http://www.cla.org.uk/media_files/Short days and horses.mp3

Wearing reflective clothing can give motorists vital extra seconds notice that a horse and rider are ahead.

According to rural watchdog, the CLA, there are around three million horse riders in Great Britain , many of whom ride on the road. Although they prefer not to do so, riders often have no choice because they need to reach to bridleways and other off road facilities.

The CLA in the Midlands says it is safer not to ride on the road at night or in poor visibility, but if you do, make sure you wear reflective clothing and your horse has reflective bands above the fetlock joints. It says that a light which shows white to the front and red to the rear should be strapped to the rider's right arm or leg and the Association strongly recommends that a fluorescent tail guard is also worn by your horse.

Accurate statistics for road accidents involving horses are not available, but it is estimated that there are 3,000 horse-related accidents each year, about half of which occur on minor roads. Tim Barnes-Clay caught up with CLA equine expert, Sylvia Hull


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6TguLKMJjso
 
I don't think it would be right to only enforce it if a rider was involved in an accident. You would be penalising someone further for having the misfortune to be involved in an accident which may well not be their fault, and in which hi-viz (or lack of) may not have been in anyway causative.

The wearing of hi-viz is about managing risk (just like wearing a seatbelt) wearing hi-viz could completely prevent an accident, it could reduce the severity of an accident (the driver sees you earlier and is able to swerve or brake and therefore hits you at a slower speed or only a glancing blow rather than a direct hit) or it could make no difference at all (for example when a driver comes round a blind bend too fast or overtakes and couldn't have seen you even if you did have hi-viz on). I can't understand why anyone would choose not to wear something that could prevent or significantly reduce the severity of a potentially fatal accident, when there is no downside to wearing it. It is MORE of a no-brainer than wearing a seatbelt. The arguments against wearing a seatbelt included the fact that in some types of accident the wearing of a seatbelt will worsen the injuries sustained, it was decided to make them law because of a careful balancing of the number of accidents where they would help versus those where they would make things worse and the likely severity of those accidents. It is considered preferable to risk bruises from a seatbelt or a broken rib for the sake of avoiding the serious injuries where people are forceably ejected from cars.

As I have said before I don't think it would be fair to impose a law on riders that didn't apply equally to other road users, and to apply it to all would be unenforceable. I also don't think that you should need to impose a law to get people to take such basic steps for their own safety (we don't legislate to make sure people tie their shoelaces before walking down stairs).
 
we get coments too one of liveries in orange the other in yellow


i use pink for my girls and yellow for the boy

i use reflective ex rugs
leg bands
flashing lights on horses legs
tabard or reflective coat
i carry a reflective whip to make cars go round us
horse-hatz
hat bands
reflective gloves
reflective glove sleeves
noseband and brow band straps
martingale tabard
 
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