Showing- How important would you rate being on the correct canter lead

ester

ester

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showing- *sigh*.........

Went to a local show today, I am still off games and as sister was home decided to take the pony to do some showing as it wasn't raining this morning.

Now Frank isn't the flashiest of welsh D's, he is workmanlike in type but otherwise I think he has quite good confo, normally he is placed below anything that might go county but is well up the line, tracks up, on the bit, bends in right direction (a lot seemed to struggle with this today!) as we do a lot of dressage. But today 3 ponies who cantered on the wrong leg in the individual show were placed above him and I wondered how important you guys would think that was when showing as several of us on the ringside were surprised. One that struck off wrong was correct but the other 2 carried on regardless and did their extended on incorrect lead. I vaguely know the judge and was a bit surprised to be honest. It was such a shame as sister rode him well and he went really nicely, I can only assume she didn't like his type (and sis had to wear a black jacket as we didn't have tweed to fit her which I know isn't correct) but I was surprised that would come above him being balanced, well behaved (and not grossly overweight as one of them was
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) and on the right leg.

He was placed below something that cantered in the trot round, was very overweight, ridden in a pelham with roundings (was an open class) and then cantered all of one individual show canter on the wrong leg. Underneath the fat I think it was a nice type but...........
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I then watched the coloured class under a different judge and similar happened again, there was a nice looking cob, reasonable way of going (side saddle) lovely show correct show (one little canter hop in the trot but otherwise very nice), placed below 3 (4th, 5th, 6th) that all cantered on the wrong leg, again only one rider corrected.

Is my idea of showing all wrong??? back to the dressage and SJ asap
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The correct canter lead is very important, especially in a D class because they are not only judged on their looks but movement, temperment and overall use as a riding horse. If the horse does not go on the right leg, then it should be marked down, just like if a horse reared or was a little strong or lazy.
 
No, no, your idea of showing is correct!! Cantering around on the wrong leg should definitely be penalised, unless they were significantly nicer types, and got alot more marks than your boy for conformation for example. Its the woes of local shows I am afraid...less said about that the better
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We're new to this showing lark, but in daughter (and pony's) 2nd showing show, in a M&M class, she was placed 2nd of the juniors (she was aiming for best junior rosette in a mixed size class), despite pony being spot on perfect as far as I could see in the individual show, and came in below a girl who let her pony canter lots on the wrong leg, both in the ring and individual show.

However I suspect that as the class was 'to be judged on pony's conformation, manners etc etc' there being no mention of riders ability as it might be in a 'Second Pony' or a 'Best Junior Rider' class she's doing later in the summer, that because the judge didn't like various aspects of the pony as much in terms of the specification of the class, she was placed lower. So I guess we've got poor conformation, terrible movement, shocking manners - well we knew that, but she was sooo good and obedient on the day I was surprised the judges noticed
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We were pleased anyway, as daughters pony isn't the best as doing as told (and sometimes likes to canter on the wrong leg)
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Showing in general seems to prefer morbid obesity and flashy paces over anything else...........

I have seen 'hunters' that struggle to canter round the ring!

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and that's not just the horses...
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Funnily enough most of the grown ups in this class were umm quite well built too.
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Mind you I can't really talk, being 2 st overweight at the mo - just as well I don't ride currently!
 
I see being on the incorrect lead as not necessarily a rider problem (though no attempt to correct is) and I think it can sometimes be more difficult with children. But it could also be indicative of a physical problem or at least limited balance/schooling.

L+J there wern't really any flashy paces in there today, not a medium or welsh trot in sight. one gallop (started on wrong lead). I picked 1st, 2nd and 3rd, everthing else could have been in any order. I was low standard to what this show often has as it clashes this year and I have competed against some lovely types and certainly never mind being beaten by them but we are not usually far away. I have several friends who do county with their natives and they were surprised today.
 
I don't think they do cause when someone i knew was showing hers they didn't get placed due to the horse being too over weight and that was a shetland
 
I have heard of occasions where judges send fat horses out of the ring but this is the exception rather than the rule.

I saw the show hunter pony and cob championships at HOYS and most of them were wobbling round the ring!

You would think that general manner of going would be important, after all a ridden class is not just a beauty contest.
 
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Definately move them down if they canter wrong unless the horse is absolutely AMAZING. Not the best judging from the sound of it.
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Ditto. A show horse should be impeccably schooled and even if it strikes off on the wrong lead should be capable of changing to the correct leg without too much fuss. It's not that hard!
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Said judge works at a showing yard........ but I need to keep her on side but I did mention it to the sec who judges herself.

nothing amazing, nothing that would look good in a county ring if you know what I mean (apart from maybe the 2nd and am not sure what current connie fashion is). though I am not that good on judging exmoors.

Just felt gutted for the sis as she rode him brilliantly and I wouldn't have done much better myself.
 
Daughter has dabbled in showing (WH) but got so frustrated at things like you mention, that she soon gave up. Horses were placed that had done awful shows on wrong leg etc, and some were carrying so much weight, no way could they have done a days hunting. You just have to put it down to experience and hope that the next judge does a better job
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To me a good show horse is well mannered, nice to ride, does a tidy show AND has good looks and conformation.

However, the current fashion with sec D's seems to be keeping them cooped up in a stable for 23 1/2 hours a day so they are bug eyed and insane going round the ring.

Sure, it looks very spectacular, but would you want to ride one?
 
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However, the current fashion with sec D's seems to be keeping them cooped up in a stable for 23 1/2 hours a day so they are bug eyed and insane going round the ring.

Sure, it looks very spectacular, but would you want to ride one?

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Mine lives out 24/7 on a bare paddock with no feed and does this anyway. I'm mad enough to ride her, too.
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Point taken, though! I also hate to see M&M show ponies rugged to the eyeballs all the time.
 
I go round the ring insanely... but that's from lack of brakes even in a pelham!!! She's out at night and in some days to keep the weight off, getting fed a handful of happy hoof to get supplements into her. One judge said that she's 'exhuberant, as Welsh D's should be'!
 
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One judge said that she's 'exhuberant, as Welsh D's should be'!

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I like to call it 'native spirit'.

Sounds better than 'being a little shitbag', anyway.
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Hmmm, I mark down anything that is overweight, misbehaves, canters on the wrong leg, and I am very particular about what bits people use as I think a good show pony/horse should be well enough schooled not to need strange ironmongery in its mouth
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If a horse is in a double bridle, it should look like it is sufficiently trained to accept and go in it properly (not just that the rider has shoved one in for the class).

I also couldn't care less "who" people are (or think they are
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).

Do you think I am a popular judge?
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Haha, popular - guess not
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Correct and Fair - yes!! At the end of the day I know which one I would rather have judging my class! Its such a shame about the politics involved with the show ring
 
RR is a bit of long way though just to do a showing class fi, am not sure what frank would think of a ferry!
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if it cantered on the wrong lead, unless there were only 4 horses in the show they should not be placed up there!
Unfortunatly in the showing world if the judge is really attracted to one horse they often let it do what it wants and still will place it highly! (which is annoying as hell if your horse does well!)

Keep your chin up about it, dont give up, and just accept that was one judge with the wrong frame of mind about her job!
 
A showing class is not a dressage competition and not soley judged on performance. A M&M class is looking at not just the ridden section but also if a pony meets the breed standards.

If the judge is marking you would lose marks for cantering on the incorrect lead but canter is not the only gait being judged. Say it is marked out of 80 - 40 marks for conformation and being to breed standards - 40 for the ridden - pony goes well in walk, trot and gallop but canters on the wrong lead. Could still get 30 out of 40 if disregarding the canter.

Said pony is perfect to breed standard and conformation and gets 40 in that section total mark 70/80.

A pony that is obedient but does not meet breed standard could get a very low conformation mark which would place it under the pony that made a mistake.

Just as a comparison you could still win a dressage competition even if you canter on the wrong leg as it is just one movement you score low on - if you get 9 or 10's in everything else it will pull up your score.
 
I may shoot myself in the foot here, but at a local show the other week we did the LR hunter class. In said class we were expected to strip the ponies off
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then for the KIDS to trot them out (bear in mind most of the kids were age 3 or 4).

Our shettie was being a little monkey so i had him in grass reins, but once the grass reins were off he kept sticking his head down. Daughter would never have been able to trot him up herself so had OTT help from me. Pony was carrying too much weight (for my liking) and I expected the judge to comment on this.

Friend had her shettie and her daughter in same class. Her shettie had impeccible manners, was almost able to be trotted up alone by her 3yo daughter... becautiful little chestnut, turned out to a high standard too.


she was placed below us
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(we came 3rd) and the judge said to me "you got placed here for manners and conformation" WTF???
I can hand on heart say my friend and her daughter desrved our placing, not us. I was embarrassed...

The same judge put my friend's stallion down the line in the WH class because, despite doing a clear round and being of perfect conformation and weight, apparently was "Unable to stand still" (he stood in line and pawed a little because he was stood next to a mare). The judge told various other people different reasons for him being knocked down the line (from weight to conformation) and absolutely no-one could fathom why she'd done it...
No-one minded though because being young it was all experience for him and anyway he won the SJ and the games trophy
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Jeez, I've never done showing and with all the comments that appear on this forum I don't think I ever will! Inconsistent marking, politics, 3yo children having to trot up ponies - it sounds like a crazy thing to do!

Anyone got good things to say about showing..?
 
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