Silly question, how much is adlib hay/haylage?

[emfen1305]

Treating my lad for ulcers (again!) and am going down the adlib haylage route in a desperate attempt to help him! My question is though how much do people feed when they feed adlib? I fill a big net and put it in his haybar so it's as full as it can be without overflowing too much which is about 7-8kg roughly. He is in from 7pm - 8am and sometimes has some left and other times he's eaten it all depending on whether he is having a piggy day or not! What do other people do when they feed adlib?

 

[Orangehorse]

Well ad lib is as much as they can eat! You should aim that they should have a little bit left in the morning, but if your horse is a pig then you have to slow down the feeding or they will eat you out of house and home and get fat. Some horses will realise that they are not going to run out of hay and become more relaxed and eat less after a week or two and find their own comfortable amount.

There are various ways of this - small holed haynets (not everyone likes haynets due to t he pulling action on the neck, particularly if the holes are very small) or some sort of hay feeder that restricts how much hay can be pulled out at a time.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

We feed hay loose/in a haybar depending on which stable the horse is in. We give them enough that they have a small amount left by breakfast time. If you would rather not give so much hay, you could supplement the forage with plain oat straw chaff. I did this when my mare was on a diet (when she first arrived here), the key is that they can eat all the time, if they so wish. I think that restricting access to forage can lead to stress/exacerbate ulcers, as, of course, can standing in the stable for hours with nothing to eat. It sounds as if your horse gets adequate hay, so maybe oat straw chaff would be the way to go. They will only eat it if they are hungry.
I find that when intake is unrestricted and they get used to that, horses will self-regulate, rather than stuffing themselves until they burst.

 

[emfen1305]

That's part of the problem I guess, some days he has half a haybar left and other days it is empty. Like tonight he was eating what he had left of this morning's like he had never eaten before and my friend told me his haybar was empty but most of the time he comes in he has his breakfast shoved on what is left from the evening and then when he comes in he doesn't touch what is in there and has a little snooze until I get there so I can't fully keep an eye on how much he is eating. I suppose the only way I would know is if i went down at 2am to see how much he had left though from the two recent experiences of going back down later at night, he seems to eat until it goes quiet then has a little sleep! I suppose I can't be forcing him to eat constantly!

I suppose I could start putting it back in nets to see if that helps but he's not particularly greedy, he likes to dig around for the good bits and the haynet stops him from doing that as it's tied into the haybar and so I think he gets frustrated and ends up leaving more!

 

[emfen1305]

We feed hay loose/in a haybar depending on which stable the horse is in. We give them enough that they have a small amount left by breakfast time. If you would rather not give so much hay, you could supplement the forage with plain oat straw chaff. I did this when my mare was on a diet (when she first arrived here), the key is that they can eat all the time, if they so wish. I think that restricting access to forage can lead to stress/exacerbate ulcers, as, of course, can standing in the stable for hours with nothing to eat. It sounds as if your horse gets adequate hay, so maybe oat straw chaff would be the way to go. They will only eat it if they are hungry.
I find that when intake is unrestricted and they get used to that, horses will self-regulate, rather than stuffing themselves until they burst.

That's interesting about the oat straw chaff - something like TopChop zero? I did used to leave a bucket of it but he never used to eat it, he can be a bit fussy! Do you feed it in a bucket or just add to the haybar so that they don't feel like it's something different? Or does it all just fall to the bottom?

 

[SEL]

My mare never self regulated, so I go down the soaked hay route now. She can eat until she pops but it won't add much to her waistline. Boy horse gets 2 very large hay nets overnight and usually has a bit left in the morning - prob about 12kg (he's 700kg ish)

I tended to find oat chaff got thrown around the stable in disgust unless it was mixed with beet!

 

[emfen1305]

My mare never self regulated, so I go down the soaked hay route now. She can eat until she pops but it won't add much to her waistline. Boy horse gets 2 very large hay nets overnight and usually has a bit left in the morning - prob about 12kg (he's 700kg ish)

I tended to find oat chaff got thrown around the stable in disgust unless it was mixed with beet!

Tried the soaked hay (think I mentioned on the ulcer post) and honestly if looks could kill! I did it for 2 days but was borrowing from a friend and don't think she liked entire nets going on the muck heap! I think Toby does know how to self regulate, the night before his scope i left 1kg for him to munch on then went back 4 hours later to check he had eaten it all and he still had half the bloody net left and was asleep!

That was my experience last time with oat chaff! I wondered if mixing a couple of handfuls with his haylage might help bulk it out but maybe he'll just chuck it around and let it all fall to the bottom.. I suppose at £7 a bag it's worth a try!

 

[Pearlsasinger]

That's interesting about the oat straw chaff - something like TopChop zero? I did used to leave a bucket of it but he never used to eat it, he can be a bit fussy! Do you feed it in a bucket or just add to the haybar so that they don't feel like it's something different? Or does it all just fall to the bottom?

I fed it in trugs, she got through 2 bags of Halley's oat straw chaff per week when she was eating the most. Tbh if he doesn't eat the chaff, he isn't hungry. They don't actually need to eat all the time but they need to have forage available all the time to mirror what happens in the wild. It is generally accepted that horses eat for 16 hrs per day but the time they don't spend eating is broken up into small chunks, interspersed throughout the 16 hrs.

 

[emfen1305]

I fed it in trugs, she got through 2 bags of Halley's oat straw chaff per week when she was eating the most. Tbh if he doesn't eat the chaff, he isn't hungry. They don't actually need to eat all the time but they need to have forage available all the time to mirror what happens in the wild. It is generally accepted that horses eat for 16 hrs per day but the time they don't spend eating is broken up into small chunks, interspersed throughout the 16 hrs.

OK thanks! I'll try him on another bucket of it just to see if he eats it, if not then I guess you're right, he is getting enough! Just totally baffled with why the ulcers have come back given the vet can find no cause of pain, so just assumed it was that he can't be getting enough food!

 

[claret09]

my boy has totally adlib hay or haylage we mix it up depending on what he feels like eating - some days the hay is better than the haylage and sometime it the other way round. at night he has two large net full and always has some left over. I also always tie him up with a net to munch at. he is 20 and looks amazing so it obviously works for him (it definitely wouldn't suit every horse) but he doesn't "stuff" and self regulates. he is out on a five acre field during the day with loads of grass and has never had a problem.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

OK thanks! I'll try him on another bucket of it just to see if he eats it, if not then I guess you're right, he is getting enough! Just totally baffled with why the ulcers have come back given the vet can find no cause of pain, so just assumed it was that he can't be getting enough food!

What do you feed him on, in addition to the hay? I was reading a report recently in which vet research seems to show that alfalfa is not good for ulcers, as it was previously thought to be, because it is acidic.

 

[emfen1305]

What do you feed him on, in addition to the hay? I was reading a report recently in which vet research seems to show that alfalfa is not good for ulcers, as it was previously thought to be, because it is acidic.

Before i found out he had them, he was on Readymash fibre but then i discovered it's NSC was higher than I thought so was looking to move him off that anyway so he is now on pink mash as his base and then he has a lite balancer, linseed and Equishure while he is on the Peptizole, once he is off the peptizole i'll be looking for an ulcer supplement and something for his hind gut.. He gets a handful of healthy tummy in each feed to help him chew more but that's the only alfalfa he gets and he has only just started back on that.

Vet recommended that i feed a scoop of chaff before and after riding to help mop up any acid as before he was getting haylage so going to try chaff this time and was planning on using healthy tummy or Alfa A so that's interesting about the article - do you happen to know where it is? I know some horses can't tolerate alfalfa but Toby seems OK, it doesn't make him loopy or bring him out in lumps!

 

[Pearlsasinger]

Before i found out he had them, he was on Readymash fibre but then i discovered it's NSC was higher than I thought so was looking to move him off that anyway so he is now on pink mash as his base and then he has a lite balancer, linseed and Equishure while he is on the Peptizole, once he is off the peptizole i'll be looking for an ulcer supplement and something for his hind gut.. He gets a handful of healthy tummy in each feed to help him chew more but that's the only alfalfa he gets and he has only just started back on that.

Vet recommended that i feed a scoop of chaff before and after riding to help mop up any acid as before he was getting haylage so going to try chaff this time and was planning on using healthy tummy or Alfa A so that's interesting about the article - do you happen to know where it is? I know some horses can't tolerate alfalfa but Toby seems OK, it doesn't make him loopy or bring him out in lumps!

Sorry I wish I could remember, I should have bookmarked it! But I followed a link from a thread on here. I can only think of searching ulcer threads within the last month.

 

[claret09]

my boy is on happy hoof, speedy beat and top chop zero. he also gets linseed and lots and lots of carrots and apples. I am sure he did have ulcers when I had him but he hasn't had a problem for years now. I don't ride him on an empty stomach either

 

[Old Speckled Hen]

We feed hay loose/in a haybar depending on which stable the horse is in. We give them enough that they have a small amount left by breakfast time. If you would rather not give so much hay, you could supplement the forage with plain oat straw chaff. I did this when my mare was on a diet (when she first arrived here), the key is that they can eat all the time, if they so wish. I think that restricting access to forage can lead to stress/exacerbate ulcers, as, of course, can standing in the stable for hours with nothing to eat. It sounds as if your horse gets adequate hay, so maybe oat straw chaff would be the way to go. They will only eat it if they are hungry.
I find that when intake is unrestricted and they get used to that, horses will self-regulate, rather than stuffing themselves until they burst.

Hiya Pearl

I know that this is a old thread but I was hoping for guidance relating to how long it would take a horse to self-regulate ?

My mare is on restricted haylage (she gets about 7kilos) at night, she has a tendancy to be a porker though - so I am going to get some Honey Chop Chopped Oat Straw with the hope of exending her eating time.

However I do believe now that my fault for having restricted her, her body gone into "EAT AS MUCH AS I CAN WHEN I CAN" mode ... which then makes me further regulate her intake... Now I suspect she has ulcers/hind gut issues ... (she's not insured - and I am currently paying off a huge lameness - right hind lameness -- which I have read is also a symptom of ulcers/HG -- so scoping currently out of the question financially )

I'd LOVE to feed her ad-lib, but how long would it take for her to realise that ?

Thank You in advance

 

[Follysmum]

Mine all have the big shire nets 9.5kg and if they have finished that they will get another half filled net with it.

My 17.2hh will eat 15kg easily in the thick of the winter and my 15.2hh ones will not have much left of the 9.5kg

 

[be positive]

Hiya Pearl

I know that this is a old thread but I was hoping for guidance relating to how long it would take a horse to self-regulate ?

My mare is on restricted haylage (she gets about 7kilos) at night, she has a tendancy to be a porker though - so I am going to get some Honey Chop Chopped Oat Straw with the hope of exending her eating time.

However I do believe now that my fault for having restricted her, her body gone into "EAT AS MUCH AS I CAN WHEN I CAN" mode ... which then makes me further regulate her intake... Now I suspect she has ulcers/hind gut issues ... (she's not insured - and I am currently paying off a huge lameness - right hind lameness -- which I have read is also a symptom of ulcers/HG -- so scoping currently out of the question financially )

I'd LOVE to feed her ad-lib, but how long would it take for her to realise that ?

Thank You in advance

In my experience some do struggle to realise that they will not run out but others regulate their intake more quickly so there is no definitive answer to the question but if you are concerned she may have ulcers I would risk a bit of weight gain rather than continuing to restrict her as they will get worse and the vets bills will, unfortunately, be the consequence, increase her haylage, give a big tub of straw as an option and make sure everything that she eats is ulcer friendly, she may surprise you and slow down fairly quickly.

 

[Old Speckled Hen]

In my experience some do struggle to realise that they will not run out but others regulate their intake more quickly so there is no definitive answer to the question but if you are concerned she may have ulcers I would risk a bit of weight gain rather than continuing to restrict her as they will get worse and the vets bills will, unfortunately, be the consequence, increase her haylage, give a big tub of straw as an option and make sure everything that she eats is ulcer friendly, she may surprise you and slow down fairly quickly.

Thank You Be Positive. I am slowly upping her haylage currently! At lunch time today purchased some Top Chop Zero, so plan to start introducing that tonight too. Now to work out which supplement (Protexin/Equishire/Pink Mash) to put her on to help her hind gut. Phew.