So incredibly disgusted

Jenko109

Jenko109

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Gorgeous collie cross pups for sale in Wallasey | Pets4Homes

Mum - Rough collie X Border collie Dad - Border collie Colour of pups - blue Merle Sex - 1 boy, 5 girls A very special home is needed for 5 gorgeous pups. All 5 pups are lively, playful and curious, but have sight impairments. If you feel you can offer a loving, caring home for one of these pups
www.pets4homes.co.uk www.pets4homes.co.uk

Double merle puppies for sale.

I'm enraged.
 
Cinnamontoast said:
Are double merles always sight impaired? Wasn’t there a double Merle blind collie always winning at the American version of Crufts? I’m appalled that someone would deliberately (?) breed such a litter. 😢
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It's to do with pigment I believe, so I guess there may be the odd one that gets off lightly, but generally, yes, double merles have problems with sight and hearing.
 
Omfg how could it get any worse?

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Mixed Breed Puppies for sale in Wallasey, Merseyside | Pets4Homes

Find 239 Mixed Breed Puppies for sale in Wallasey, Merseyside on Pets4Homes - UK’s largest pet classifieds site to buy and sell puppies near you.
www.pets4homes.co.uk www.pets4homes.co.uk

The bitch is also for sale. She is NERVOUS and REACTIVE. Just the type of bitch you want puppies out of then 😏
 
Cinnamontoast said:
Are double merles always sight impaired? Wasn’t there a double Merle blind collie always winning at the American version of Crufts? I’m appalled that someone would deliberately (?) breed such a litter. 😢
Click to expand...
There’s a double Merle rough collie that’s been used to sire a lot of winning show dogs that might be what you’re thinking about
 
Jenko109 said:
Omfg how could it get any worse?

www.pets4homes.co.uk

Mixed Breed Puppies for sale in Wallasey, Merseyside | Pets4Homes

Find 239 Mixed Breed Puppies for sale in Wallasey, Merseyside on Pets4Homes - UK’s largest pet classifieds site to buy and sell puppies near you.
www.pets4homes.co.uk www.pets4homes.co.uk

The bitch is also for sale. She is NERVOUS and REACTIVE. Just the type of bitch you want puppies out of then 😏
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It could get worse as that says her father is viewable as family pet… so now I’m wondering if he sired the pups…
 
AShetlandBitMeOnce said:
Sometimes I 'like' to play a game of which selfish, asshole of an owner has bred the most irresponsible litter - todays top contenders are:

https://www.pets4homes.co.uk/classi...-english-bulldog-goldendoodle-pups-liverpool/

https://www.pets4homes.co.uk/classifieds/sz9nvwfkn-rottweiler-x-presa-canario-puppies-undefined/

https://www.pets4homes.co.uk/classi...-great-dane-american-akita-pups-chesterfield/

https://www.pets4homes.co.uk/classi...ish-bulldog-x-miniature-dachshund-birmingham/
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I'm rather amazed at the prices asked! I've paid similar or less for a pedigree puppy out of health tested parents.

The other problem is the puppies are all completely adorable in the photos but no one will have any idea what they will look like as adults or even their size really. And let's not even go into temperament...
 
How does the merle thing affect them? Cooper is manily white with black spots but isnt deaf and has no sight issues, so it cant be based on colour alone can it?
 
I'm Dun said:
How does the merle thing affect them? Cooper is manily white with black spots but isnt deaf and has no sight issues, so it cant be based on colour alone can it?
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Loosely, a merle dog will only carry one copy of the merle gene. One copy is fine. A completely healthy and happy dog.

If a dog is unlucky enough to carry two merle genes (the result of a merle to merle mating) then it somehow affects the pigment which in turn affects both vision and hearing.
 
Jenko109 said:
Loosely, a merle dog will only carry one copy of the merle gene. One copy is fine. A completely healthy and happy dog.

If a dog is unlucky enough to carry two merle genes (the result of a merle to merle mating) then it somehow affects the pigment which in turn affects both vision and hearing.
Click to expand...

So has to be merle then and doesnt affect non merle white dogs?
 
I'm Dun said:
So has to be merle then and doesnt affect non merle white dogs?
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From what I understand, white animals have a higher prevalence of deafness, however this would be completely unrelated to the merle gene.

A double merle, producing puppies who are likely to be both deaf and blind, must have been bred from two merle parents.
 
Cooper and his brother must have been lucky then! I did check for hearing and sight when I viewed him just in case but didnt really think much of it. They are both anomalies as mum is jet black and dad blue and no one is sure why out of 3 litters over the years in this litter out popped 2 white going spotty pups who look like lurchers not whippets! All the other pups have been black or black with minimal white and very typey whippets.
 
If anyone wants to geek on it…
There are 7 different alleles (unless anyone has found some more) + mosacism, and it’s not just the traditional double Merle that have issues with sight and hearing

Merle phenotypes in dogs – SILV SINE insertions from Mc to Mh - PMC

It has been recognized that the Merle coat pattern in dogs is not only a visually interesting feature, but it also exerts an important biological role, in terms of hearing and vision impairments. In 2006, the Merle (M) locus was mapped to the SILV ...
pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

And yes it’s the inner ear cells lacking pigment that’s the issue.
 
Not species specific either, similar issue in people breeding spotted or patterned hamsters, rats, mice etc which produces blind and extremely fragile pups. And you have lethal white syndrome in horses which is also coat-pattern related. I suppose merle dogs suffer for it not being lethal, just disabling.
 
Ah yes, there was a time when people (incorrectly) referred to double merle puppies as 'Lethal Whites'

There was someone local to me who bred a lethal white foal some years ago. I remember it being posted on the NFED forums (New Forest) and it did not go down well at all. Another completely preventable tragedy. The result of frame overo to overo if my memory serves me well...
 
Jenko109 said:
Ah yes, there was a time when people (incorrectly) referred to double merle puppies as 'Lethal Whites'

There was someone local to me who bred a lethal white foal some years ago. I remember it being posted on the NFED forums (New Forest) and it did not go down well at all. Another completely preventable tragedy. The result of frame overo to overo if my memory serves me well...
Click to expand...
The "pretty spotted pattern" is only interesting to colour focused back yard breeders of all species because it's rare, but it is rare for a good reason.

Speaking of cats, don't get me started on breeding manx (who also have a heterozygous lethal gene!), munchkin and folded ear cats on purpose.
 
I'm Dun said:
Cooper and his brother must have been lucky then! I did check for hearing and sight when I viewed him just in case but didnt really think much of it. They are both anomalies as mum is jet black and dad blue and no one is sure why out of 3 litters over the years in this litter out popped 2 white going spotty pups who look like lurchers not whippets! All the other pups have been black or black with minimal white and very typey whippets.
Click to expand...
Don't want to worry you, but the issues with white pigment around eyes and ears isn't necessarily apparent at birth/while the dog is young. My terrier who I lost last year started having the occasional slight discharge from and soreness in her white eye when she was about 9. I would take her to the vets but there was never anything particularly significant found (higher end pressure reading but still in 'normal' band). Then one day she had sudden onset glaucoma. There was about 15 hours between a pressure reading in her white eye that was 'normal' (but the eye looked sore), and a reading the following morning that was 4 times the upper limit and she had gone blind in that eye. The bad eye was removed and she lived another 15 months or so. She was also stone deaf by the end.

Not that she suffered much, she was mid teens before having any issues. But as she became aged it was the hearing and sight that packed in and the failing sight was the main reason for PTS in the end.Screenshot_20250605-121247.png
 
ester said:
If anyone wants to geek on it…
There are 7 different alleles (unless anyone has found some more) + mosacism, and it’s not just the traditional double Merle that have issues with sight and hearing

Merle phenotypes in dogs – SILV SINE insertions from Mc to Mh - PMC

It has been recognized that the Merle coat pattern in dogs is not only a visually interesting feature, but it also exerts an important biological role, in terms of hearing and vision impairments. In 2006, the Merle (M) locus was mapped to the SILV ...
pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

And yes it’s the inner ear cells lacking pigment that’s the issue.
Click to expand...

Thank you, I'll have a read later on when I'm not rushing round
 
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