So to scrape or not?

[MagicMelon]

Ive just read the news article on here about sweat scraping after washing down after exercise. So... is it better to NOT scrape and just let them drip dry naturally? Im thinking especially after XC, unsure whats best. Ive always done the usual wash down then scrape off.

 

[Pearlsasinger]

It must surely be more cooling to allow the water to dry naturally, rather than scraping it off. I imagine that you need to make a judgement on the day as to which course of action is best.

 

[Roasted Chestnuts]

I don’t scrape in the heat I’ve always left to drip dry, in winter I scrape then stuff straw under the rug and leave then to dry.

 

[be positive]

I always wash, scrape then wash again until the water being scraped off is completely cool, not such an issue when weather is cooler but in the hot weather washing alone rarely gets them cooled quickly or effectively enough.

 

[BBP]

When I was grooming the advice of the NZ team Vet was to wash and scrape, but as a continual and repeating process, so one person applying cold water the second another has scraped the last lot off, so there is a continual heat transfer from hot horse to cold water. If you leave to drip dry ok the water won’t insulate as previously thought but you also won’t get further immediate heat transfer away from the horse. So repeat until horses temp is down.

With my leisure horse who gets a bit sweaty but never gets a super hot body temp I’d be happy to just wash off and leave.

 

[Sussexbythesea]

I always wash, scrape then wash again until the water being scraped off is completely cool, not such an issue when weather is cooler but in the hot weather washing alone rarely gets them cooled quickly or effectively enough.

This - the quicker you remove the heated water and replace it with cooler water the quicker the horse will cool down unless of course you are hosing continuously.

 

[Follysmum]

http://davidmarlin.co.uk/portfolio/to-scrape-or-not-to-scrape-when-cooling-hot-horses/

Thought this may be useful

 

[SmartieBean09]

 

[sollimum]

To cool down my cob after an endurance ride. I wash and scrape and reslosh. If I just left the water on him and did not scrape and replace, he will not cool down as quickly as is covered in warm water.

 

[Follysmum]

Quote
If I just left the water on him and did not scrape and replace, he will not cool down as quickly as is covered in warm water.

This is not the updated advice from
Dr marlin if you read his research and advise things have dramatically changed over the years

 

[sollimum]

Yes, I read his research some time ago. I respect him greatly but it does not work on my big muscled cob - I have tried as suggested and it has not worked for me but may do for others.

 

[ihatework]

Depends how many pairs of hands you have available and what amount of water!

For an overly hot horse you need to keep applying cold water non stop. So if you are limited on hands, then just keep applying cold water - don’t stop to scrape. If you have plenty of people then it’s fine to have someone scraping as you go.

Essentially scraping wastes time that could be spent applying more cold water.

However, in reality for most of us we aren’t bringing horses in hyperthermic and so it won’t hurt to wash-scrape-wash-scrape.

 

[Tihamandturkey]

If I don't scrape Madam hates it - the drops make her very twitchy 🙄

 

[windand rain]

water, water and more water for mine no scraping water evaporates quicker than sweat so just keep washing off has always been my way. I do scrape after bathing in cool or cold weather then rug as I dont want them to lose more heat by evaporation

 

[Mule]

I don't know how the scraping idea started. It makes no sense.

 

[Boulty]

Scraping is not required, just keep applying cold water continually. I did used to eventually scrape once cooled with my old pony as he hated the feeling of water dripping off him (he was very ticklish)

 

[Lois Lame]

Ive just read the news article on here about sweat scraping after washing down after exercise. So... is it better to NOT scrape and just let them drip dry naturally? Im thinking especially after XC, unsure whats best. Ive always done the usual wash down then scrape off.

I once had a long conversation with a friend about this.

She told me how she and the other grooms had cooled down the horses after the cross country. There were limited hoses available, so they used buckets. As one groom applied the water, another groom came along behind and scraped off the water. This process was done several times, until the horses were all made comfortable. (This happened at an Olympic Games, where my friend was head groom of the Australian team.)

I said, "Surely it is more cooling if the water is allowed to evaporate instead of being scraped off?"

She patiently explained that the water gets too warm, and no longer cools the horse. It is better for it to be scraped off and (if necessary) more water applied.

Finally it made sense to me. But I really had to think about it.

 

[Lois Lame]

I always wash, scrape then wash again until the water being scraped off is completely cool, not such an issue when weather is cooler but in the hot weather washing alone rarely gets them cooled quickly or effectively enough.

Exactly. And at that Olympic Games that I mentioned above, the heat was appalling. The Australian team was congratulated on how they had dealt with it.

 

[Lois Lame]

http://davidmarlin.co.uk/portfolio/to-scrape-or-not-to-scrape-when-cooling-hot-horses/

Thought this may be useful

Is he the same guy who was so rude to some posters on here last year? I must say, I don't like the way he writes. All those exclamation marks and emphasised words make him sound arrogant.

 

[TheMule]

The two different approaches work in two different ways, and both are fine- either wash, scrape, wash, scrape and keep repeating or wash and let evaporation of the water do the same job.

Once the water heats from the skin it evaporates which takes the heat energy away from the skin. The water feels warm, it is supposed to, it then evaporates. That's how the body is designed to cool down.

 

[dogatemysalad]

I scrape enough to stop the trickles of water running down to their bellies. It's the same sensation when it rains. They're happy enough being wet, they just don't like the ticklish sensation of little streams of water. If I don't scrape, they sort themselves out by rolling in the mud.

 

[Tiddlypom]

Is he the same guy who was so rude to some posters on here last year? I must say, I don't like the way he writes. All those exclamation marks and emphasised words make him sound arrogant.

Yes, that’s him.

I was hosing several times a day last week in the heat wave just to keep the horses comfortable. They hadn’t been worked. I hosed and scraped, and was surprised at just how warm the water got in the very few minutes that it was on the horse.

 

[Sussexbythesea]

The two different approaches work in two different ways, and both are fine- either wash, scrape, wash, scrape and keep repeating or wash and let evaporation of the water do the same job.

Once the water heats from the skin it evaporates which takes the heat energy away from the skin. The water feels warm, it is supposed to, it then evaporates. That's how the body is designed to cool down.

But for example if when you’ve got a temperature if you apply a cold wet flannel to your forehead then when it becomes warm it feels much better to rinse it in cold water again and reapply than it does to now have a warm wet flannel on your head whilst waiting for the water to evaporate. In addition if it is humid then there is little evaporation. Also why applying a fan increases the rate of evaporation like scraping it off does.

So either you continuously supply cold water to the area but in limited water supply scraping off the warm water and reapplying cold would seem to make sense unless of course you’re continuously applying cold water from a hose.

Probably a physics question rather than a veterinary one - does the differential between the heat of the horse and the temperature of the water on it affect the rate of cooling?

 

[joosie]

There's a big difference between cooling off a horse who's just been XC or in a race and is really hot and sweaty, and a horse who's just done a hack or schooling session and needs washing down. For the latter, hose/sponge and no scrape. For the former, the procedure is different.

 

[Rowreach]

There's a big difference between cooling off a horse who's just been XC or in a race and is really hot and sweaty, and a horse who's just done a hack or schooling session and needs washing down. For the latter, hose/sponge and no scrape. For the former, the procedure is different.

Yes, and generally speaking (yes I know it's been hot in the UK this week) we aren't dealing with very high temperatures and most of us don't compete abroad. The rapid cooling thing only began to be looked at, iirc, before the Atlanta Olympics, when people realised that conditions would be out of the ordinary for most horses. But it was the bad publicity that racing got when they had horses collapsing in the winner's enclosure because little was being done to them after a race, and it was televised, that resulted in even more research being carried out.

On the whole, in the U.K., I don't suppose it makes much difference either way.

 

[Trouper]

On a sweaty horse that has just worked under saddle I like to scrape the first lot of water off to help get rid of the salts from his skin as quickly as possible. After that, just water, water, water as necessary.

 

[ihatework]

There's a big difference between cooling off a horse who's just been XC or in a race and is really hot and sweaty, and a horse who's just done a hack or schooling session and needs washing down. For the latter, hose/sponge and no scrape. For the former, the procedure is different.

This precisely!

Humidity is also a consideration in other countries (not UK) and where you have very high humidity there is likely benefit to scraping as the rate of evaporation not scraping would be lower?

 

[Sussexbythesea]

This precisely!

Humidity is also a consideration in other countries (not UK) and where you have very high humidity there is likely benefit to scraping as the rate of evaporation not scraping would be lower?

It’s been pretty humid here recently which is why everyone feels hot and sticky as their sweat isn’t evaporating very quickly.

 

[catkin]

Depends upon the individual horse too - our nearly-black pony appreciates a bath more than his bright bay fieldmate. He seems to feel the heat more, especially if there's a sudden change in temperature.

 

[Ambers Echo]

There are no situations in which scraping cools the horse down quicker. If you stop to scrape a very hot horse you just waste time when instead you should be sloshing more cold water over or continuing to hose. If you have run out of water and the water on the horse is very warm this means the water has taken the heat from the horse. It does not mean the water acts as a super-heated insulating layer like pony club was telling my kids a year ago!! (I was told as camp helper that my job was to make sure all the kids scraped. I researched it then because I was not happy teaching an old wives tale).

In that situation then you have a wet warm horse.... if you scrape you have a dry warm horse with little chance to cool further via evaporation If you leave wet you have a wet warm horse who can continue to cool down via evaporation. In humid conditions the difference between dry &warm and wet & warm will be lower as the rate of evaporation will be lower but there are no circumstances in which the water actually heats the horse back up again. I scrape once horses are cool enough in mild conditions for the horse;s comfort. After Frickley on Friday I left them both wet.