Sorry, another National post! Will Also Use The Lounge!

[Maesfen]

Apologies for bringing up the subject of the Grand National again but was anyone else as pleased as us when the trainer of Silver Birch said he had been hunting all season in preparation for the race?!

What a high class hunter to have!

 

[severnmiles]

Apologies for bringing up the subject of the Grand National again but was anyone else as pleased as us when the trainer of Silver Birch said he had been hunting all season in preparation for the race?!

What a high class hunter to have!

Yes, I also heard someone else who had won a previous race say they had hunted the horse to sweeten it up. Its been the making of many horses.

 

[Maesfen]

they had hunted the horse to sweeten it up. Its been the making of many horses.

It's one reason why, if I had the money and option, Robert Walner (Kingscliffe) would be my trainer of choice!

 

[Clodagh]

I was a steward at the hunt sponsored ride this morning, therefore was bored, therefore read the Sunday Times and The Mail on Sunday. Both reports said the horse had been on 'Cross Country Rides' to sweeten him up. Having heard the interview yesterday I was gobsmacked!

 

[Maesfen]

They just don't like to admit that hunting actually benefits some horses do they?!!

 

[endymion]

Does a fox need to be involved to train the horse?

 

[Ereiam_jh]

Strangely enough I seem to have been put on some kind of animal rights mailing list by my new found friend Judi Hewitt.

As well as a letter calling for tortoises to be banned I'v received one calling for... you've guessed it, the Grand National to be banned.

 

[Maesfen]

Does a fox need to be involved to train the horse?

Not this time! He hunts with the Ward Union!

 

[endymion]

Revised...

Does a stag need to be involved to train the horse?

The Ward are the ones who hunt carted deer aren't they? Makes regular hunting look almost ethical.

Giles, if you read this I'd be keen to hear your opinion on carted hunting.

 

[Ereiam_jh]

I don't know much about it. Are carted deer captive deer? Do they kill them?

I'd suspect that under a reasonable hunt law many current hunting practices might have to change. However I am not in principle against chasing wild mammals with dogs.

 

[endymion]

Well I don't know a hell of a lot about it myself, what I do know is:

The deer are usually part of a managed herd (as such they fall under the protection of the welfare act for domestic stock).

They have antlers cut so as not to cause injury to handler/hounds.

More than one deer is caught (in case the first is caught too quickly) and transported (i.e carted - hence the name, I think) to an area which may be unfamiliar to the animal and then set loose for the hounds to chase.

When the deer has finally been exhausted and caught it is taken back and may be used again in another hunt.

Now this seems exceptionally cruel to me as the deer is run to exhaustion on possibly more than one occasion, as well as risking injury and heart attacks when being chased.

It's an Ireland thing (is it banned now? I don't know). A dept of Agriculture Vet deemed it inhumane. However, by your logic this would be perfectly acceptable.

 

[Ereiam_jh]

However, by your logic this would be perfectly acceptable.

How do you come to that conclusion?

 

[endymion]

As you advocate chasing wild mammals with dogs.

I admit that you have never said you agree with chasing individual domestic stock on a routine basis.

However, this is an example where-by chasing an animal is cruel and therefore it is natural to want your opinion on such an issue.

 

[Ereiam_jh]

I thought you'd already told me what my opinion was?

 

[endymion]

So was I right?

Or are you dodging the question?

 

[endymion]

Just found out it has been banned.

Seriously though, carting the same animal around the country to be repeatedly hunted is sick.

Even most pro's have to admit that.

 

[Fantasy_World]

So far as I know the horse was not hunted this season. He has been running in cross country events including the one's at Chelt. He is a former ptp horse though back in the days before he joined Paul Nicholls. He won a point in Ire before joining Nicholls for the 2002/03 season.
He then went on to win over hurdles at Chepstow and Plumpton before going chasing.
He won over the national fences in the Becher chase in 2004 followed by the Welsh National. He missed 2005 through a leg injury and had sore shins and as a result he was fired.
He was finally sold through vets advice last year at Doncaster where his new connections picked him up for a mere 20,000g.
I would not have backed him personally at Aintree as Nicholls always thought he wanted soft ground. Despite him being fired so he would not feel the effects of the ground as much I could still not have a horse that had been competing in what is considered by many hacks as lowly grade specialist cross country chases.
I think the last horse who ran well in those races and I'm sure won the inaugural running of the one at Chelt at the November 3 day meeting in 1995, was Mcgregor the third. He won the race two years on the trot and went on to run in two nationals at Uttoxeter -Midlands and Summer National - in 1997 and 2000 respectively, finishing 5th on both occasions. So for any one's standards what Silver Birch did on Sat on ground that was perhaps far from ideal was amazing.
So far as hunting goes though, many racehorses have and still do hunt ( and that's not even including the jockeys) Kim Bailey used it as a 'sweetener' for his gold cup winner of 1995, Master Oats.
Kingscliff has also spent times hunting whilst under the care of Robert Alner. Both trainers I have a great deal of respect for, as I do any that decide to send their best charges for a few days hunting as the horses must feel they are having a holiday and a rest from horse walkers and gallops.
Anyone who has seen conventional training methods must understand how mundane life can be for some racehorses and how a day's hunting or a day at the beach can bring a welcome break from the norm.
In my opinion to prevent these wonderful animals the chance of a day in the field is far more cruel than the hunt itself especially as nowadays the quarry has been thrown a lifeline by bureacracy.
Caroline

 

[Ereiam_jh]

So was I right?

Or are you dodging the question?

Personally I thinkmit crosses the line if the animal is already captive. However I'm interested as to why you think I am always pro chasing animals with dogs. I've never said that.

 

[CARREG]

carting the same animal around the country to be repeatedly hunted is sick.

I have to agree with you on that ...............Carreg

 

[southgate1975]

carting the same animal around the country to be repeatedly hunted is sick.

I have to agree with you on that ...............Carreg

There's hope for you yet.....

 

[endymion]

Giles and Carreg,

I'm really glad to hear you both agree with me on this. Lets just be glad it's banned now (although, as with all hunting bans, it probably still occurs somewhere or other).

 

[Ereiam_jh]

Is it banned. I thought they were chasing a deer through a school the other day.

I must say I quite enjoy the stories in the press when the hunt chase their quarry through a classrooom.

I wish that had happened when I was a kid. Would have brightened up thoise dreary latin lessons.

 

[endymion]

Oooooh, check you, what school did you go to?

It was a choice of French, German or skivving both and going for a ciggie round the back of the shops in my school. Guess what I chose?