sorry i know another bit question,.... but im desperate! LONG POST

[serena2005]

Atfer speaking to the physio about my green 6yr old TBX she said carry on with his eggbutt snaffle as what hes doing is because he is green and not because hes being naughty.

So, riding on monday with 3 other horses in the school and horse is napping like theres no tomorrow, went into canter on a 15m circle nice and collected, saw a horse coming along the centre line and he goes for them!

i had NO control! he totally ignored my leg so i pulled his head in the oppisit direction out of pure desperation, even with his head bent at a 90% angle he was still going for them, got him back in the direction i wanted him in and he goes bronking off....

Jumping, we have just started to teach him to jump, if there is a horse on the oppisit side of the jump he totally runs away with me if i try and stop he goes faster, i just kept cantering in circles to slow him down.

today one other horse in school, we were both doing a 10m circle and as we pasted each other i was heading for the fence, trying to turn him left, again ignored my leg and i had to let him go right as he practally ran in to the fence.

out hacking is the same story if we go any faster than a walk, even stopping at junctions he tosses his head in the air and leans against me.

i know hes still learning so i dont want to gadget him up, but i am out of control and hes taking the piss out of me.

please help

 

[rrose]

are you wanting to keep your snaffle, as you could use a hanging cheek snaffle, this may help.

 

[serena2005]

i do want to keep the snaffle as i have always been taught to train in a snaffle, but its getting to the point when its not working for us.

everything iv been reading about bits hasnt really given me much information, my physio said to maybe try a dutch gag, but i dont really like them so i was thinking of a running gag, would i be right in saying its slighty softer than the dutch gag?
other bit i was considering was a loose ring frence link snaffle, just to see if it was just the bit he didnt like.

When riding alone he accepts contact, and is quite happy to work in an outline, but hes also getting fitter and is quite full of him self and doesnt know how to use his energy constructively

 

[tigers_eye]

Hey, got your pm! I think a fulmer snaffle may help with the turning issues, especially if he's locking on to something else like another horse. Traditionally they are worn with small leather loops going from the top of the arm to the cheek piece - this provides a vey slight poll action, but it also prevents the bit from rotaing and this can produce a very severe action with a single jointed bit which some horses react badly to, however it might be a solution with him. Best would be to borow one of someone, I have one but I think it will be too big for him. Will measure it tomorrow and let you know how big it is.

 

[serena2005]

ahh didnt think of that! im pretty sure one of the girls has one at the yard, im sure i had one for zeus when we broke him, cheers ill have a go!

Im pretty sure Herbie is 5" 1/2

 

[AmyMay]

A few things come to mind.

No. 1 - Keep the snaffle, and put a standing martingale on him.

No. 2 - Don't attempt to school a nappy horse whilst others are in the arena with you.

No. 3 - Do get the help of an experienced trainer.

 

[pottamus]

I am with amymay on this one and would also add that you may need to go right back to basics before thinking about jumping and cantering. He clearly has to get the basics right and listen to you as his rider first. I would tend to go for loads and loads of walk, trot, halt transitions to get him listening and behaving and moving off your leg. Do 5 strides of walk then 5 strides of trot then 5 strides of walk all round the school and doing circles with changes of direction on a regular basis. That will get him listening to you and concentrating and then when he behaves, increase it to say 8 strides and then 10 etc. Good luck but I don't think you need to change the bit, just get him working with you more.

 

[SSM]

What type of noseband are you using?

My girl was going round with her mouth wide open avoiding any contact until we put a flash on her and stopped her doing this, I actually feel as if I have more control now than in a gag where she would just stick her head down and avoid that way.

 

[hotpot]

hi i would not go stronger yet as he is still green i agree with the other girls that maybe get your instructor to ride him a few times and i would not jump him yet it sounds like he gets to excidted re the bit the nutcracker bits i think dont suit young horses as it goes up to the roof of the mouth which sometimes brings the head up or sideways i woud try a kk training bit it has a lozenger which goes on the tounge and it not at all strong it has loose ring action so helps with the bending, i as others have said not ride in the school with others, pick a quite day if poss and hack out alone or with someone that has a horse that is quite and sensible, good luck .

 

[serena2005]

iv never used a standing martingale, why would that stop him napping?

 

[serena2005]

i have gone back to basics with him, but he is the type of horse thats gets bored easily, so im trying to keep in interested by doing different things.

What i mean by just starting to teach him to jumpim basicly just doing canter pole with a ting cross pole at the end. doing this on him own he listens perfectly.

 

[serena2005]

im using a caverson nose band, i recently tried using a flash but brakes, steering and any sort of contact went out the window, he hated it, i thought i would carry on using it just to see if he was just testing it.

Physio assed him ridden and i told her about the flash she saw me ride with it and without and told me never to put a flash on him again

 

[serena2005]

ill try the loose ring french link snaffle, it was one of the first bits i was going to try, i just wanted to see if you all suggested it also

 

[AmyMay]

A standing martingale won't stop him napping - but will give you more control over his head when he is napping - ie. he wont be able to get his head hight etc.

 

[lise]

try a fulmer snaffle for additional stearing aid. Preferably with a french link to reduce the severity found with a single joint. Then add a puller strap which fastens to the front of the caveson and to the bit rings. This transfers some of the pressure from the mouth itself and encourages the horse to flex at the poll allowing the bit to then work correctly on the mouth. Its a great training aid for youngsters and does not involve strapping the mouth shut or trussing them up like oven ready chickens.

 

[filly190]

You havent said if he is opening his mouth to gain extra strength, if so get his mouth shut as the bit you are using will be inefective.

A french link snaffle has more control for using either rein. but if you buy a loose ring, it can pinch his mouth and so I would suggest have the normal fixed rings on it.

My young horse has gone through this bad behaviour and sounds very similar. I went to a very good instructor and she told it to me straight. I had owned since she was two and now at six is horrid.

I have been too kind. She told me to forget about trot and work in circles going from walk to canter, canter to walk, as soon as she started to take control, haul her up quickly and sharply and make her walk.

After sweating and huffing doing this for one hour, thinking the instructor was a looney, it began to work. The battle of
wills went my way. This is not a nice way to treat a horse, however it is an effective way, that after a few sessions you can drop off completly and begin again.

The instuctor I am using has seen a different horse. When my mare went in all the wrong directions etc, I had to swing her head round to my knee, knock her off balance and if I could hit her nose the on the railings. You dont need to do this more than twice, they soon learn.

I was horrified to begin with and had sleepless nights over how I was treating my baby, I have never believed in this type of riding, but I was desperate enough to give it a go.

I had to put a lot of trust in my instuctor, who is very high up in the dressage world and well respected. I mention no names, but I felt that if she could'nt fix us, I would have to sell my mare.

I suggest that you find a person like this, it's worth spending the money and I could only afford one lesson every couple of weeks and had to get up at 5am in the morning to travel there. Good luck,