Stallion's floppy neck??????

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minime

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I have a really cute 11 year old miniature horse stallion who was highly respected in the show world a few years back. This spring his neck started to tilt and now it has completely flopped to one side. His neck is big but so are all stallions and even though he has a lot of mane, it isn't heavy.
Why has this happened and can I do anything about it???
This photo was taken last winter when it was still solid and upright.


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My friend has Section C stallions and one of them has a crest that has collapsed, he seemed to think there was nothing that could be done to revive it.
 
minime said:
Sorry you have lost me????
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Sweats are neoprene wraps that are used to shift weight and tone areas of the body, a heating lotion can be applied underneath, and quite simply, they make the horse sweat more during exercise. Think they're used quite commonly by mini producers in the US, less so over here.
I was just wondering if it was likely that your stallion had been prepped for the show ring by being worked in a neck sweat.
 
PopStrop said:
Sweats are neoprene wraps that are used to shift weight and tone areas of the body, a heating lotion can be applied underneath, and quite simply, they make the horse sweat more during exercise. Think they're used quite commonly by mini producers in the US, less so over here.
I was just wondering if it was likely that your stallion had been prepped for the show ring by being worked in a neck sweat.
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Thanks for the info, not sure if it was used with him. I have had him for 3 years now and it has only just happened. I wandered if it was his age!!
 
minime said:
Thanks for the info, not sure if it was used with him. I have had him for 3 years now and it has only just happened. I wandered if it was his age!!
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11 is hardly old age ;)

HAS he lost a lot of weight since that pic was taken? Have you got a more recent pic, with the collapsed crest?
 
No he hasn't lost much weight, he is so tiny that he looks weird in pics but I don't think he is too fat considering he lives out most of the time. i will take a pic this afternoon as the one I have isn't clear.
Thanks:D
 
LadyRascasse said:
yes i think she is, and i would have to say i agree, way to big for my liking but each to there own
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Sshhhhhhhhhhhh don't shout or he might hear you. Only kidding, he did loose weight last winter now I think about it and that is when his neck started to flop.
I don't know what is worse:
A bit too chubby or
Normal weight and floppy neck
???????????????????
Help
 
Ok, in the picture above he is carrying FAR too much weight, there's no definition to his shoulder or quarters, and living out most of the time is no excuse! Carrying that much weight predisposes him to laminitis and puts unnecessary stress on his heart & lungs and little legs! If he looks funny in pictures it's not because he's little it's because he's so overweight. (Tip for taking pictures of him, sit/kneel down low and get down to his height, then his legs won't look quite so short.)

My fatty mini is muzzled to limit her grass intake and her hay is soaked to reduce the calories. You could make his field smaller to restrict his grazing. What do you do with him? Is he in any work? Does he cover any mares?

Stinkbomb on here has a lovely stallion who lives out 24/7, is in superb condition and she is having a seriously good show season with him. I'll alert her to this thread so she can show you just how good a mini who lives out 24/7 can look!

Personally, I'd far rather he was a healthy weight with a floppy neck than 'a bit too chubby.'
 
wow, you really did kick my ass. I think I will curl up in a corner for a while.
He is out with four mares and their foals so he is a full time hubby and father. The foals this year are all boys and they harass him all day.
 
i took these photos this afternoon for you to see


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By reneejewer at 2010-09-22
 
I would be a little worried if her were one of mine, as in normal small ponies this is usually a sure sign they are about to go down with laminitis. One old livery we had always went floppier on one side of his neck about a week prior to getting it and we instantly removed him from decent grazing. I hope not but I´d be watching him carefully...
 
Now I am panicking!!!! He has been like this since spring and at the moment he only goes out for 1 hour a day as he has to keep another mini company who is on total rest. The grass is not that rich here now and there are several of them in there together. He only eats a handful of chopped carrots and a handful (literally) of hay.
 
Heres my thought on the matter.

I do think your stallion is fat in the first picture. Sorry. But i have seen worse. He has topline in your first photo and this is keeping his crest upright. however i think this topline is due to fat and not muscle.

secondly his mane IS weighing it down. You can see from your second photos he has lost weight. However he has also lost topline and muscle. He nolonger has any fat or muscle to hold it up and the weight of the mane is making it fall. i would get rid of most of his mane to start with, no matter how nice it is!!

I will now address some of your comments:-

1. "His neck is big but so are all stallions " - NOT TRUE. My stallions neck has never been big, neither has those stallions i compete against. We just would win in the showring.

2. "I don't think he is too fat considering he lives out most of the time. " - living out 24/7 does not excuse the "larger horse"

3. "I don't know what is worse:
A bit too chubby or
Normal weight and floppy neck
???????????????????

- A mini doesnt have to be chubby to have a decent neck. Its all about exercise and feeding.

4. "He only eats a handful of chopped carrots and a handful (literally) of hay. " - You dont say whether he gets any exercise?? If he is this isnt enough to sustain a horse in exercise.

Now my belief in order to get his crest back upright is to firstly cut his mane :) secondly get him on a decent exercise and feeding plan. This will help build muscle in order to help his neck hold his crest. You need to make sure they get enough protein and feed to help sustain the amount of exercise they are doing. I have my minis in summer on restricted grazing but they do get large feeds, consisting of lo cal alfa a and grain. most would cringe at the thought of feeding grain to a mini but as long as its controlled and introduced slowly and fed according to amount of exercise it can be a great tool for building muscle.

I will try and explain in pics.

This is Inky after wintering out 24/7. No feed. No exercise. just plenty of grass and hay.

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No topline and no muscle!!!

This is after a structured feeding and exercise plan, including plenty of protein and fed acording to exercise...

mhcgbchamp2010003-1.jpg


This is how i like him. He has developed topline and muscle. NOOO big necks :)

Spot the difference??

This was all done whilst he was out 24/7. NOT stabled.

What im trying to say is that yes your mini has lost weight. But its his muscle that has gone too. Build that muscle up and his neck will strengthen and his crest will rise. It may not ever be perfect but it will be better. Its not all about having a chubby horse, just a well muscled and developed one.

It depends on what you want to do with your mini. Do you want to show?? Dont get me wrong. After next week inky will be left to get hairy, fat and under muscled over winter till we start all over again in february!!

I hope this helps and doesnt offend. :)
 
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I do feel a little offended with all these attacks against me and my little man who I love dearly but if it all helps to get him healthy and looking handsome then bring it on.
To be fare in the first pic it was the end of winter and he had been closed in for several months as we had about 2 meters of snow that year.
He usually lives out this time of year and doesn't do any "real" work other than cover the mares.
Stinkbomb
1)What type of exercise would you advice to get him in shape? (I do not have a pony trap for him)
2)what and how much food should he eat?
P.S Inky is beautiful
 
I would also add exercise should help. He looks a better weight in the more recent pictures but if he is only getting 1hour turnout i imagine he has lost a lot of muscle. I have no experience of mini's but could you try a bit of lunging or long reining or even pole work?
 
I have started lunging him now he is in the stable nearly all day but I am taking it steady as he hasn't worked for a long time. It is tough here in Italy as the summer is boiling hot and it doesn't cool down until around 20.00 and then I have kids and hubby to feed etc and in the winter we get loads (1-2 meters) of snow. I am not trying excuse myself but I just need to find the right routine.
Thanks for all your help so far.Pleasssssssssssse keep it coming as it is much appreciated.
 
I certainly didn't intend to offend you, however your flippant responses to earlier comments on his weight did make me think you weren't taking the issue seriously.

If he's only getting an hours turnout per day then he needs some form of exercise to maintain muscle and keep him moving. My 3 year old is currently going on half hour walks 3/4 times a week, as although she's out for 9/10 hours a day, she spends that entire time eating (muzzled) and gets very little in way of exercise, so in order to maintain her weight she is walked out, at a fairly brisk pace. If I was showing her, her exercise would be increased to build muscle and topline and trim her barrel.

I take it as he's in most of the time atm he's getting more than a handful of hay to keep his gut moving and avoid him standing for long periods of time with nothing to eat? If you were to soak his hay for 12 hours it would reduce the calories meaning he can eat more of it (better for gut) without putting on weight.

You can take him for walks, lunge, long rein, do polework, jump him, loose school him, but as you say take it very slowly as he's done nothing for a long time, and has little muscle which will take time to build.
 
I didn't mean to be flippant at all, I haven't written in english for ages. I will try walking him daily for 30 mins as well as lunging him for 15 mins. he goes out for about an hour whilst I medicate the sick mare but he just puts his head down. I will also start wetting his hay.When you are showing your mare what exercise does she get? I will also buy a weighing scale so I can check the amount of hay more precisely. He weighs about 50kg, so am I right in thinking that he should eat around 500g/day of hard food and 500g/day of hay. (considering he will be doing 30 min walk, 15 min lung)
Thanks for your time and patience
:):):)
 
I would imagine he weighs more than 50kg. Inky is 4 yr old now and 32.5". When he was a 2yr old he weighed 100kg exactly on a weighbridge.

I dont do any exercise over the winter with him. About february ( our shows start end of April ) i start to lunge him. Starting on 5 mins each way in trot. he now does 10 -15 minutes each way a day in a constant trot, but must be working trot in order for it to be effective. He does this 5-6 times a week. I also walk out in hand for about 30-45 minutes a day if i get time but this is usually only about 3 times a week or less. When its alot drier i also loose school him then he's not constantly going in a circle.

feeding is very specific to the type and nature of your horse. Inkys feeds do fluctuate through the year depending on how his weight is doing. At the start of the season he gets around 4 big scoops of alfa a oil, baileys outshine ( oil nuggett ) 2 small scoops stud mix and 2 small scoops of beet split into 2 feeds a day. Initailly he has no topline so i need to build this up. This feed contains quite a number of calories and protein but this help with the topline and helps distrubute the weight he has already. There will come a time when his weight is just about right and his topline is coming along nicely and then i cut the feed back. If i dont his weight just goes over too much. Although he is on restriced grazing around July the grass seems to get richer and the weight starts to creep up. Its then i cut the oil chop out and change to a lo cal one. My grazing is poor ( my choice ) so he does have big buckets of chop so i can be sure he gets the right amount of fibre. I dont feed hay but substitue for chop. Bearing in mind he is out 24/7 and has enough grass to nibble on 24/7. i also cut out the beet once his topline is perfect. Feeding too many Calories to a mini can be dangerous but as long as you limit them and do the exercise accordingly you should have no problems. They need some calories in order to have the energy for exercise.

like i said his feeds chop and change. if i think hes putting alittle too much on i cut back, if he starts to loose his topline i increase.

Grass is the big downfall when it comes to minis. people would be amazed at what little they can survive on. My minis have little grass but do get supplemented feeds. i have shown a picture of my grass so you can compare. ( excuse the shaggy looking shetland :) )

InkyTySeri012.jpg


However if your mini is stabled most of the time he would have to have more hay. Mine only don get hay becasue they are able to nibble constantly.

Hope this helps.

Anyway do you have more pictures?? I ,ove seeing pics of minis!! Whats his breeding??
 
Thanks for the help Stinkbomb. We went for a nice brisk walk yesterday which he seemed to enjoy and today I lunged him as it is pouring with rain here today. I am starting to increase his food intake slowly but he wont eat wet hay, maybe he just needs time to get use to it. I will load him on the trailer this weekend and take him to be weighed.
His name is "Eagle's sandokan of Asschatt" eagle for his friends. He is the son of "Dent painted Eagle" an American import. I bought him from the Asschatt stables in Holland with a beautiful brood mare called "Sebastopol's Kim"
This is kim


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These are last years boys


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These are a few of Eagle's babies


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Hi seem to remember reading of a Welsh A if not on this site one of the other popular ones that had this very same problem but even more pronounced. Vet was called to look at it but after the neck collapses there is nothing that can be done. The pony was a little grey & was working as a small childs pony as the collapsed neck caused no issues it was just a cosmetic issue.
 
I have unfortunately met several geldings with this problem. It is due to obesity, rather than having muscle they have fat along the crest of the neck, as soon as any weight drops the fatty neck just flops to one side. Sorry OP, but it makes me feel really sad when I see it on a horse.

I remember being told that the neck would never recover as it was effectivly wastage? Could be wrong though :)
 
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