strangles

[heatwave]

just read the strangles article with much interest
19 out of 24 horses who had been vaccinated still caught the infection ,so is it worth having ?

 

[spaniel]

Im glad you posted about this HW, saw the piece in HH yesterday and felt totally vindicated.

When the vaccine first came out I looked into it quite deeply as I really wanted to do the best I could for my horse. The more I looked the more I realised that its not really the answer and didnt want it done as it seemed that after injecting the horse is actually MORE vulnerable

.

Even more interesting to see that this 'payment' was made without recourse to the law....makes you wonder.

 

[xkatiensaracenx]

hmm really didnt know that.
i personally wouldnt waste my money on it and if thats the case whats the point!
kate x

 

[spaniel]

I believe its because its a live vacccine. I may be wrong but the period between 1st and 2nd jabs they are quite vulnerable which is why I wouldnt consider having mine done especially if there was a local outbreak at the time.

 

[heatwave]

i agree it would seem that if your horse is vaccinated it may be more vunerable,i remember going to your horse live two years ago and they talked to me and my friends about it ,they were certian it would prevent your horse from getting the virus,it would seem they are wrong.

 

[Ashf]

A yard on the far side of our town had it since sept, they have been clear for 4 weeks now, but it killed one horse there, and they have been made pariahs with all the kids being stopped from attending the local PC events with their ponies.

All the horses are in a big barn, and it ran from one end to the other.

 

[nelson]

Very interesting article, I have not had mine done as I wanted to wait for feedback, and had read that horses could still carry it, and that it would not necessarily prevent the horse getting the disease.

Looks as if I may have done the right thing and saved a lot of money as well.

 

[Marquire]

I spent 10 years working in animal vaccines with a competitor of intervet.

The Intervet vaccine for Strangles is a based attenuated bacteria (bacteria selected for the fact they do not cause disease but still resemble the original pathogen). However, one of the bigest problems with attenuated vaccines is the the bacteria can 'revert' to the pathogenic form and actually cause disease in the injected animal. It needs close monitoring of the vaccine batches to make sure the bacteria are not disease causing. I guess something went wrong in this case.

A number of people have lodged patents for sub-unit vaccines against strangles, where individual bacterial proteins are used to inject the horse, and the advantages of these is that there is no chance of the horse developing the disease as only a small number of bacterial proteins are injected. However, the down side is that in sme cases this is not sufficient to give protection from the disease.

I don't have either of my horse vaccinated against Strangles at present but I'd be keener to do so if a sub-unit vaccine was available.

 

[spaniel]

Thanks for the clarification Marie!

The sub unit sounds more promising to me but its still a bit of a lottery and Id certainly want to wait until Id seen research on the effectiveness before making a decision.

 

[KatB]

My yard had strangles at the beginning of the year, and It coincided with when i was meant to be shipping the lanky one over from Ireland. Obviously wanting the best for my horse, and with him being a youngsterI looked long and hard into getting him vaccinated because of the small risk he could catch it if an area of the yard had been missed out when sterilized.
After speaking to my (then) vet, he was all for the vaccination (at £70+ with call out). I then spoke to my contacts in Ireland, and the vet who I dealt with over there, and he said under no circumstances do it. Its a waste of time, and can sometimes cause side effects in its self.
Then contacted my vet again, who admitted its no actual safeguard, some horses can have some sort of immunity from it if treated with it. Neddless to say I left it.
Strangles is of course a serious condition, but alot of scaremongering goes on about it, it is only a v.small percentage that get the "serious" case of it, and generally it is just shaken off like a bad cold. Only old and unhealthy animals are likely to be seriusly afected, same as flu hits humans.

 

[Niamhy]

Just read the article, and found it was very interesting indeed. There hasnt been much talk of getting this done in Ireland, so i had been following the stories posted with interest.

This case seems to be very unusal, it seems to have been a big yard, with around 50 horses? 19 out of 24 that had been vaccinated got it, while only 8 out of 21 unvaccinated horses got it.

Surely this has to be a pretty good test case for it if i ever saw one. These Intervet people say all horses in the yard should be vaccinated, yet the first case was in a vaccinated horse, and while they suspected strangles, but as it had been vaccinated they ruled it out. (As you would naturally enough I suppose).

For me this is clear proof that it is a waste of time, what really got me was [ QUOTE ]
majority of the vaccinated horses infected with strangles were clinically more ill than infected unvaccinated horses

[/ QUOTE ]

Says it all really!

 

[lordflynn]

I agree with what you are saying (am a microbiologist) did the article said that the outbreak originated from a vaccinated animal?
I know strangles is (to put it mildly) a right pain but coming from Newmarket, where its fairly endemic but not serious to the individuals that contract it, I was surprised to see a strangles vaccine. I suppose they wanted in on the market before an effective subunit vaccine is manufactured in the states.
If only we could get isolates from this current outbreak and compare!(sorry, microbiologists get excited about this sort of thing!). Its a worry that vaccinated horses were affected more-it seems something is missing from the vaccine that is obviously important!

 

[druid]

I really, really didn't want to have Sparky done but we are obliged to have them done if we want to hunt this season

Having seen Sparky's reaction to the shot I would never, ever have it done again - I felt like the most awful horse owner in the country seeing her off food, with a lip so swollen she had to try and hold her bpttom lip away, really really down in herself and cold sweating.

 

[Autumna1]

Our vet actually warned us about the nasty side effects that can occur from this vaccine, and I wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole I'm afraid.

It doesn't seem to be tremendously effective anyway.

A.

 

[jackpalfreyman]

The whole of my yard is vaccintaed against strangles, its a really tricky situation......about 6 months ago we were all told that every horse on the yard was to be vaccinated againast strangles becasue of recent local outbreaks, and becasue we run unaffiliated shows. At the time we all felt fine about it(alothugh some people refused and were subesquesntly asked to leave) and the ayrd owner even paid for the first vaccine (for over 50 horses!!!) none of the horses had any major side affects as a result of the vaccine, however a few horses have come down with viruses and have blamed it on the vaccine. not entirely sure what point im trying to make.....i think it is that thinking back on it now i was totally uninformed of the risks involved with the vaccine, even though nothing has come from it i would have been devistated if one of my horses had got strangles.

 

[jackpalfreyman]

forgot to add, no new horse is alowed to come on the yard unless it has had the first strangles vaccine, think we might be one of the only yards with this policy.

 

[henry-]

What concerns me is whether various organisations, venues even, will insist on strangles vaccination, a bit like flu.
I've ummed & ahhed and reading these threads alleviates some of my guilt. But in any event, since mine would be the only horse vaccinated against strangles on my yard, I don't think it advisable to have it done. Plus, when your horse can be struck down by grass sickness, without warning, it puts things in perspective, though I'd might not take this stance if I had a very young horse.

 

[Nuttymanxmare]

Apparently there is an outbreak of strangles not far from where my horse is stabled.

 

[madabout2]

When you say endemic and not much cause for concern to the individuals can you explain further please.
A yard near mine has been plagued with a virus - not strangles it seems - and I wondered whether it might just be one ofthose things that most horses are unwell for 24 - 48 hours and then get better?

 

[burtie]

Hi madabout2, I don't know about Newmarket, but strangles is effectively endemic in the New Forest due to the ferral ponies. We have not had any outbreaks near us this year, but 2 years back we had ponies stood at our farm gates with strangles. The verderers (sp) are very good about informing yards, and we are actually very careful about not letting it get on to the yard, but if you have ferral ponies roaming free, you can't really avoid the problem.

 

[Tia]

I haven't read this article, but I get the gist of it and I totally agree. The claim is that because the vaccine, although Live, is not viable and therefore cannot cause infection.....wrong! Look what happened to me! I had a nice healthy closed herd and then a horse who had recently been vaccinated came to live here and within the text-book case timeframe, my horses (who have never been off our farm or been in contact with other horses for a year) in this field contracted it.

After my recent experience, I would NEVER allow another horse on my farm who had been vaccinated against this virus. My opinion has never faltered on this belief that this is an unstable and unreliable vaccine, not only to the horse injected with it, but also to all the other horses on the yard.

I have found a lot of stuff that would make your hair curl on the Internet about this issue.

 

[PapaFrita]

With regards the strangles jab in Canada, Tia, is this the same jab that is in use in the UK, that goes in the lip?
I was curious because the strangles vaccine is routine here, and has been for several years, I believe, but is done either IM or sub cutaneously (I forget which as when PF had it done, she had a couple of jabs together) I wonder if this is the same jab that is done in the US? I don't think there is a booster, but I could be confused again... comes with age, don'tcha know!

 

[Tia]

They do all types here; IM, intra-nasal and sub-mucosal injection. The sub-mucosal lip injection appears to be by far the safest vaccination as from the research I have found, there rarely appears to be side-effects and does seem to cover most horses from either contracting it from the vaccine AND when in contact with other horses who have it.

Vaccinations and side-effects

 

[PapaFrita]

Thanks for that link Tia. So, basically it's the same jab, in different locations?
PF's jab DID cause an unsightly but painless swelling on her neck (as described on the webpage), the size of a golf ball. Has very nearly gone now, but it has been at least a couple of months I think.

 

[Tia]

There is such a lot out there that it can all become very confusing as to what is best. But from what I can gather, there are different structures of Streptococcus used in these vaccinations and it is only the Live sub mucosal injection that safeguards the horse from complications.

Now interestingly, I am sure that the girl said that her horse had been given the Intra-nasal vaccination - this appears to be the least stable of all the ways to give it; both for the horse and others around it.

 

[Guinness]

i didnt have a choice in giving my horse the vaccination as he is on working livery at college, and they insisted due to the amount of other horses coming and going
the vets came in to give us a talk about it, but to be honest they were def for it, and also suggested that as the horses were high risk that they needed it every 3 months!
a friend of mine who has 2 horses doesnt vaccinate them against anything, a few years ago at pony club most of the horses came down with flu, hers was the only horse that didnt get it, and it was the only horse that wasnt vaccinated
i wish i knew more about how these things work so i could make a more informed decision

 

[xxxchloexxx]

There is a breakout of strangles near my yard and most of the horses there go to shows <span style="colorurple"> </span>