Stroppy horse

[NicandLiv]

I have had my horse 3 weeks now. Basically her background is she was brought over from Ireland to be a broodmare, she was used to give children rides, she is a bit head shy. The owner I got her from had her for two years, did parelli with her and she hasn't been ridden for a year. I'm not going to bash parelli here and I don't want to offend anyone, but she was fed treats ALL the time, even for unwanted behaviour.

So for the first week I let her settle in, I caught her every morning, tied her up and groomed her (although I couldn't groom her for nearly a week as she isn't used to being tied up and standing still!), then put her back out into the field. I ride once a week in company. Last week I decided to start lunging her, upon when I attempted she kept turning into me and sniffing my hands for treats (that is how she was lunged). I tried again the day after, and held the lunge whip at her shoulder. We had a fair number of kicks, snorting etc when I wouldn't let her turn into me. I tried again two days later, she was brilliant, no snorting, no kicking, no cantering, she was having a nice walk and then a nice controlled trot. I tried again today (again two days later), I had a hard time catching her, then when I got her in the school to be lunged, she cantered off in a circle very uncontrolled, snorting at me and throwing a few kicks. I thought it would be safest really to just do some transitions with her in the field, so I made her stop (so she wasn't stopping of her own accord), and just walked around the school with her giving her voice commands and getting her yielding to me.

Now I know it's going to take a while, and I am not expecting miracles, I am expecting to go one step forward and two steps back until we've built a bond and some trust between both of us.

What I wanted to know is:

a.) Would it be useful if I could have a stricter routine, i.e. one day lunge, one day rest with just grooming and stroking etc.
b.) lunge every day and be more forceful with her when she is being very stroppy (could potentially be dangerous, although I don't think she'd purposely hurt me, she is the type of horse to react if you react and you end up in a big fight)


Someone suggested I feed her Stroppy Mare in her feed every morning and see how it goes. (Alongside still lunging etc and working through it)

Any advice is greatly appreciated.

 

[YasandCrystal]

OP you don't say how old she is, which may have a bearing. To me it sounds like she needs a good consistent routine. 3 weeks is no time and if you keep reinforcing what you expect from her she will soon comply - it's in horses natures to want to please. If the lunging is scary then I think your leading and aiding through voice is a very good idea - I would be building on that doing 10 minutes or so close in hand work and then try a little distance lunging or how about long reining that may be much better in her case?
I have a 4 year old mare who came to me pretty much unhandled. She was a nightmare to lead and very headstrong and stressy, but through regular handling and long reining she soon settled and actually really enjoys work. She is less stroppy worked than not - an attention seeker who likes to be kept occupied - yours may just be the same. Mine is food aggressive so no tit bits for her either - they work on some horses but not others. I can reward my WB all day and he never seeks them, but will really try hard and so appreciates the reward of a polo.
Just to add OP - remember lunging is hard work for a horse and stresses ligaments and joints. I would never lunge everyday - long reining is a different matter as it is not constantly on a circle. I never lunge more than twice a week.

 

[AmyMay]

Personally, I'd be riding her.

 

[NicandLiv]

I can only ride her once a week at the moment, as she can't be ridden on her own - she bolts. I found that out

She is 14.

I will try long reining, and establish a bit more of a routine with her and see how she gets on. I haven't long reined before so I will probably call an instructor out to show me how to do it properly

 

[YasandCrystal]

I can only ride her once a week at the moment, as she can't be ridden on her own - she bolts. I found that out

She is 14.

I will try long reining, and establish a bit more of a routine with her and see how she gets on. I haven't long reined before so I will probably call an instructor out to show me how to do it properly

Longreining is fun in my opinion and you can easily turn longreining into lunging - so adding variety to the session. It also mimics the ridden aids well and gets the horse used to your hands. Good idea to get a trainer out - they can offer some impartial advice too.
I have this book on longreining which details the different methods clearly:-

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Art-of-Lo...1051153376?pt=Non_Fiction&hash=item1e8341e7e0

here is another:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Long-Rein...1045002670?pt=Non_Fiction&hash=item1e82e40dae

 

[NicandLiv]

I'm going to ask a really stupid question but... I have a long lunge lead, do I just buy another and use them on her ?

 

[YasandCrystal]

I'm going to ask a really stupid question but... I have a long lunge lead, do I just buy another and use them on her ?

Yes you can or buy a long reining set they are not expensive and you can decide the length you want. I would recommend a minimum of 20ft long lines for safety and versatility - they are around 10 pounds for a pair. I have a set and I also use a continuous rope long line like this":-

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-HANDY...t=UK_Horse_Wear_Equipment&hash=item257af18cbb

 

[NicandLiv]

Thank you. I might try starting with me standing at her withers as I don't know if she has been long reined before. It will be interesting to find out
Not entirely sure what education she has, all I know is that she can stand, rein back, walk and trot.

 

[Auslander]

Do you know how to long -rein? Your posts suggest that you don't, and if she doesn't either, this could be a recipe for disaster, particularly if she's a bit bolshy/handy with her back legs. It would be worth getting some help from someone who is experienced at long reining to assess her, and, if necessary, teach her how to long-rein correctly, whilst you learn the technique with an established horse. There's an art to long-reining correctly, and it can be pretty dangerous if done badly

 

[TrasaM]

As Auslander says. My friend tried long reining someone's horse a little while back assuming that it had been done before. Horse panicked and took off trailing the reins as she couldn't hold him. He galloped the full length of the field then wheeled and came back. I was leading another horse back to his paddock and lucky for me he stayed calm and didn't try to join in and that other horse didn't tangle up in the lines.
There's a whole desensitising process to go through first using one rein before you try both. I've got a Ben hart video I took back in summer that might help but not sure how to link it.

 

[twiggy2]

the parelli method does not use lunging in the same way, the horse are encouraged to turn in to face you when they stop, you can teach both methods (my mare does both) BUT you need to be very conscious of your body language at all times, it may help you to research the parelli circle game so you can understand the other method and control your body language and therefore your mare

 

[Mince Pie]

the parelli method does not use lunging in the same way, the horse are encouraged to turn in to face you when they stop, you can teach both methods (my mare does both) BUT you need to be very conscious of your body language at all times, it may help you to research the parelli circle game so you can understand the other method and control your body language and therefore your mare

I agree, I also think that the horse may be acting out as she is confused about totally different handling practices? It may be worth finding out more about Parelli so you can slowly transition her back to 'normal' handling methods

 

[Goldenstar]

Do you know how to long -rein? Your posts suggest that you don't, and if she doesn't either, this could be a recipe for disaster, particularly if she's a bit bolshy/handy with her back legs. It would be worth getting some help from someone who is experienced at long reining to assess her, and, if necessary, teach her how to long-rein correctly, whilst you learn the technique with an established horse. There's an art to long-reining correctly, and it can be pretty dangerous if done badly

I agree with this if she's kicking at you on the lunge I would be cautious about long riening .
I would definatly have a second person to help .
You are safer lunging , lunging daily is not ideal but sometimes life is not ideal can you ride her in the school in walk ?
Things can go very wrong very fast longriening .

 

[NicandLiv]

Thanks for all your replies.

I had her front shoes taken off on Monday so currently haven't done anything with her. I have however got a friend who is a riding instructor and she is going to teach me how to long rein correctly, and I've asked her to watch me lunge as well so I can make sure that is done right.

I did try riding her once in the paddock school, she cantered out and jumped the fence. The reason for this, is that when under saddle and you ask her to slow down or stop, she panicks and her "out" is just to run away and hope the problem goes away.

I have been doing in hand work with her in the paddock, just walk to halt transitions and turning, about 10 minutes every morning before her breakfast and things are improving.

I have a physio coming out this month and dentist at beginning of January, so until then I'm just going to do in hand things with her int he school and also take her out on little walks. She is absolutely brilliant being lead, lots of very good manners, can't fault her on that at all. I was told she hates schools, is very nervous in them, previous owner didn't know why (she had her for two years, before then we don't know her past). You could blatently see she wasn't a happy horse in a school environment. However since doing all this in hand work with her, and with my 7 year old helping (horse is a lot more responsive with my daughter), her ears are no longer back and she even tries to lead me into it!


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ba57H-NwssQ

This is a video of her lunging with her previous owner, at 25 seconds ish is what she started doing with me when I was holding her back from going into a trot, but then she would canter around until she calmed down. However last time I lunged on saturday she was very good, we had no kicking, no trotting and no turning in. Granted I had to have the lunge whip pointed at her shoulder, but she didn't seem as ''uptight'' about it this time and didn't throw a paddy when I asked her to go "out" if she tried to turn in.


I think deep down, she is a very genuine horse and I don't think she is aggressive. I just think she has been taught so many different ways she doesn't know which way is up.

As I was leading her to her field yesterday, her ears went right up, some horses in adjoining field were chasing galloping kicking and screaming at each other and I knew exactly what she was going to do. Run to her herd for safety. So I did get a bit nervous as she doesn't really have a care for me, so wouldn't give two hoots if she kicked/hurt me. I got into the field, unclipped her, and moved to the side - she had waited for me to get out of her ''way'' before she went running off to her herd. Now, I call that progress considering she never had a problem turning in to kick me, try to kick me when I ride her, and tries to bite me when I tack up.

 

[AmyMay]

That's a pretty appalling way to lunge a horse.

OP - just get on and ride her. Get some lessons and crack on with her.

 

[NicandLiv]

can't actually wait to get back on her...I must be crazy.

just waiting for her feet to heal

 

[YasandCrystal]

OP I am sorry but after seeing that video that has to be the reason the poor horse has some behavioural problems. I have never seen such a weird way to lunge a horse - well actually that's not lunging is it - the owner is acting as a pivot point and incredibly the good little horse is continuing to circle. The whole point in lunging is to use body language - voice and stance to get the horse moving at a tempo you wish. Lunging should be constructive and interesting for both horse and handler.

The owner makes for a cheap human 'horse walker'