Suitable for a novice?

[Suec04]

Hi All,

I am looking at ads in preperation for buying a mother/daughter share in the spring. i have a very modest budget of £2000-£2500, to include buying tack.

Firstly, am i expecting too much to buy a suitable mount for us within my budget? he/she must be suitable as a first horse/novice ride?

secondly, i have spotted a few ads indicating that 5 yr old horses are suitable for a novice?! now, i am an experienced owner, if not a confident one, and i am returning to riding after a break (hence why a novice and my daughter is also a beginner), but to me, a 5 yr old is still very much a baby. surely us buying one at that age would be a bad thing and potentially spoil him /her? Ideally we want something to teach us. I do not have the experience, confidence or resources to make a 5 yr old into the type of horse that is suitable. Has anyone in a similar postion ever bought a 5 yr old and had no problems?

thank you all for your help

 

[PolarSkye]

Hi All,

I am looking at ads in preperation for buying a mother/daughter share in the spring. i have a very modest budget of £2000-£2500, to include buying tack.

Firstly, am i expecting too much to buy a suitable mount for us within my budget? he/she must be suitable as a first horse/novice ride?

secondly, i have spotted a few ads indicating that 5 yr old horses are suitable for a novice?! now, i am an experienced owner, if not a confident one, and i am returning to riding after a break (hence why a novice and my daughter is also a beginner), but to me, a 5 yr old is still very much a baby. surely us buying one at that age would be a bad thing and potentially spoil him /her? Ideally we want something to teach us. I do not have the experience, confidence or resources to make a 5 yr old into the type of horse that is suitable. Has anyone in a similar postion ever bought a 5 yr old and had no problems?

thank you all for your help

Honestly? The words "barge" and "pole" spring to mind. Obviously, it depends on the horse/pony . . . a friend of mine has recently taken on a four-year-old cob gelding having never started a youngster before and he is a delight . . . but confidence can be such a fragile and elusive thing once lost (yours and the horse's) that I think you should look at something that's been there/got the tee shirt. Your budget is actually quite healthy . . . look for something in its mid to late teens with good limbs/sound feet and a rock solid temperament.

P

 

[AdorableAlice]

I think there has been a developing habit of young cob types being sold as novice rides purely because so many novice owners equate cobs with steady neddies regardless of age. A quick look through the sales websites and there are endless irish 4/5 yr olds advertised as first horses. The reality is young, under done, just off the boat babies who, after a few weeks of good grub will turn into ignorant thugs if in the wrong hands.

Op, look in the early teenage years, done it with the t shirt and slowing down types, vet it and enjoy it.

 

[Suec04]

Thank you PolarSkye. that is my gut reaction too - a been there, done it type and also a cobby/ID type is definately more approriate i would have thought.. I was worried that something in its mid-late teens would be too old though but i guess if, as you say, he has good limbs and sound feet then he would last us a good length of time. We are planning to keep it until the end of its days

 

[Suec04]

I think there has been a developing habit of young cob types being sold as novice rides purely because so many novice owners equate cobs with steady neddies regardless of age. A quick look through the sales websites and there are endless irish 4/5 yr olds advertised as first horses. The reality is young, under done, just off the boat babies who, after a few weeks of good grub will turn into ignorant thugs if in the wrong hands.

Op, look in the early teenage years, done it with the t shirt and slowing down types, vet it and enjoy it.

thank you. anyone know of any good places to look locally within herts/beds/bucks areas?

 

[TrasaM]

I think there has been a developing habit of young cob types being sold as novice rides purely because so many novice owners equate cobs with steady neddies regardless of age. A quick look through the sales websites and there are endless irish 4/5 yr olds advertised as first horses. The reality is young, under done, just off the boat babies who, after a few weeks of good grub will turn into ignorant thugs if in the wrong hands.

I see you've met my friend ASBO cob then AA. 5 years old and safe as a safe cob.. Er.. Well no actually. More green as the green grass he's so fond of.
My friend fell for the same sale patter and what she got wasn't what was advertised. We got there in the end with him but only after lots of tears and bruises.

 

[hnmisty]

Some people seem to just stick on any old thing to make their horse sell. "Suitable for a novice" when it's 4, "event prospect" when it would make it around a 2'3" and that's about it.

The absolute minimum age I would look at is 10, although ideally 12+. I gold my first pony at 24 (we thought she was 17), she stayed with us til the end at 35, and she taught me so much. So don't be scared away from a golden oldie. When Misty was 25, I took her to senior camp, which involved 4 hours of riding a day and she coped fine! The only reason I retired her when she was about 27 was because I'd outgrown her. She was 13.1 and faster than a lot of the 15h+ horses who were almost 10 years younger than her

I would watch out for ads that say "suitable for novice", "can be ridden by total novice" etc if it's in a reasonable amount of work with a competent rider- it might be ok with a novice on its back when it's otherwise in fairly hard/demanding work, but if you then reduce that to trotting round the arena for half an hour twice a week, you might find it's not...

Good luck

I'd see if anything is for sale in your local pony club area, some tend to stay in the area and get ridden by tons of kids, plus have really been there and done it all.

 

[Suec04]

Some people seem to just stick on any old thing to make their horse sell. "Suitable for a novice" when it's 4, "event prospect" when it would make it around a 2'3" and that's about it.

The absolute minimum age I would look at is 10, although ideally 12+. I gold my first pony at 24 (we thought she was 17), she stayed with us til the end at 35, and she taught me so much. So don't be scared away from a golden oldie. When Misty was 25, I took her to senior camp, which involved 4 hours of riding a day and she coped fine! The only reason I retired her when she was about 27 was because I'd outgrown her. She was 13.1 and faster than a lot of the 15h+ horses who were almost 10 years younger than her

I would watch out for ads that say "suitable for novice", "can be ridden by total novice" etc if it's in a reasonable amount of work with a competent rider- it might be ok with a novice on its back when it's otherwise in fairly hard/demanding work, but if you then reduce that to trotting round the arena for half an hour twice a week, you might find it's not...

Good luck

I'd see if anything is for sale in your local pony club area, some tend to stay in the area and get ridden by tons of kids, plus have really been there and done it all.

Thank you

Wow! 24! thats a really good age and to still be doing loads too! ok, i'll expand my age bracket then as i had dismissed anything over 14! didn't think of the pony club either....i had assumed they would be mainly kids ponies and we would be looking for 16hh plus ! :/ very exciting but terrifying too!!! When i was a kid, my dad did all the worrying, i just told him whether i liked it or not and he did the rest! now, i'm doing it with my own daughter in mind and its so much more worrying. thanks again

 

[hnmisty]

Thank you

Wow! 24! thats a really good age and to still be doing loads too! ok, i'll expand my age bracket then as i had dismissed anything over 14! didn't think of the pony club either....i had assumed they would be mainly kids ponies and we would be looking for 16hh plus ! :/ very exciting but terrifying too!!! When i was a kid, my dad did all the worrying, i just told him whether i liked it or not and he did the rest! now, i'm doing it with my own daughter in mind and its so much more worrying. thanks again

I did think you were looking for something a bit smaller (I'm not sure I'd recommend a 24 year old 16hh horse, but then they are all indivduals!). The pony club should still turn up lots, these are all over the UK, but I expect if you enquire more locally there will be more PC horses up for sale that aren't on the main site http://classified.pcuk.org/category/for-sale/16-o/ Of course, it's not a be-all and end-all way of finding one!

I know what you mean- I bought my first horse myself back in May (I'm 25), my last two ponies were bought with the help of mum, even though she only got into horses through me and so doesn't know much about buying!

 

[Suec04]

I did think you were looking for something a bit smaller (I'm not sure I'd recommend a 24 year old 16hh horse, but then they are all indivduals!). The pony club should still turn up lots, these are all over the UK, but I expect if you enquire more locally there will be more PC horses up for sale that aren't on the main site http://classified.pcuk.org/category/for-sale/16-o/ Of course, it's not a be-all and end-all way of finding one!

I know what you mean- I bought my first horse myself back in May (I'm 25), my last two ponies were bought with the help of mum, even though she only got into horses through me and so doesn't know much about buying!

Thank you hnmisty. That link is great but they do seem to be out of my price range at the moment but i will certainly have a look at our local one to see if anything crops up there.

i think i just need someone more experienced to come with me. i have lots of offers but when it actually comes down to it, my instructors are too busy or its too far to travel for them (mind you, one was in wales! lol). Going it alone is very daunting and i think just need someone else to say i'm doing the right thing! plus, the thought of negotiating the price fills me with dread! i'd hate to offer the wrong amount and for them to think i was being cheeky/naieve. sometimes i prefer it when the ad says 'no offers' then i know where i stand!

 

[PolarSkye]

Thank you PolarSkye. that is my gut reaction too - a been there, done it type and also a cobby/ID type is definately more approriate i would have thought.. I was worried that something in its mid-late teens would be too old though but i guess if, as you say, he has good limbs and sound feet then he would last us a good length of time. We are planning to keep it until the end of its days

A sound, clean-limbed horse that hasn't been hammered into the ground should last you a good while . . . a former fellow livery has a TB (ex racer) who is nearly 31 and still jogs round the mounting block and is plenty spritely on a hack.

Natives and native crosses do tend to be hardier - as do ponies . . . just do your homework/shop carefully and you could certainly pick up a diamond. You may need to look out for cushings, etc. but with proper management, "older" horses do just fine and can last a long, long time.

P

 

[henmother]

Don't know if it's something you've already considered but I'm looking at getting my own horse next year and have been looking at blue cross/RSPCA rehoming. The horses are reschooled and they do their best to match owner with rider, they want the horses to stay happy in a forever home after all. I'll be looking for a horse suitable for a first time owner and to be quite honest I've heard & read so many horror stories about horses not being as advertised and the heartbreak and hassle that ensues. I know not all sellers are dishonest but weeding the honest sellers from the liars would be difficult. I wish you the very best in your search.good luck.

 

[Suec04]

Don't know if it's something you've already considered but I'm looking at getting my own horse next year and have been looking at blue cross/RSPCA rehoming. The horses are reschooled and they do their best to match owner with rider, they want the horses to stay happy in a forever home after all. I'll be looking for a horse suitable for a first time owner and to be quite honest I've heard & read so many horror stories about horses not being as advertised and the heartbreak and hassle that ensues. I know not all sellers are dishonest but weeding the honest sellers from the liars would be difficult. I wish you the very best in your search.good luck.

i know exactly how you feel about the horror stories! I had a quick look at Horse4Homes and other such sites but there didn't seem to be many available that were suitable for riding, most of them were Companions or such like. i will try the BlueCross and RSPCA as had't thought of them, so thank you and good luck yourself!

 

[hnmisty]

I agree on PC prices (on the website at least), a bit jealous of the kids whose parents can afford to buy them a £10k pony. Or, as I suspect the case may often be, whose parents are prepared to put a £10k pony on their credit card!

If you really can't find anyone to take with you, then ask your daughter (I presume she'll be going with you) to video you riding it (and vice versa if she goes along, if not ask the seller to), and likewise, get a video of the seller riding it. Get lots of photos of the horse stood squarely, I'm sure there will be people on here who will have a look and let you know their thoughts

I too am awful at price negotiations- I asked if they were open to offer for the first one I looked at earlier this year. The answer was categorically "no". Horse failed the vetting and seller still owes me my £200 deposit. Barry's seller said she was open to reasonable offers when I asked her, I got about £250 off him. I wish I'd tried a little bit lower

 

[henmother]

i know exactly how you feel about the horror stories! I had a quick look at Horse4Homes and other such sites but there didn't seem to be many available that were suitable for riding, most of them were Companions or such like. i will try the BlueCross and RSPCA as had't thought of them, so thank you and good luck yourself!

although i'm not in a position to rehome yet, need to get winter done and spent a little more time adjusting to my new situation, I have seen some beauties on my local rspca website, £500 adoption fee. Think blue cross has an online application form, good luck.

 

[SadKen]

I bought a 5 year old after a long break. It didn't pan out well for me and for him. Admittedly he was a lot more sensitive than any youngster I'd had before, and hadn't had a very good start in life. I kept him for almost a year before giving in and selling.

I am sure there are 5 year olds out there who are novice rides, but the chances are slimmer and like others have said, confidence is fragile. When I started looking again, I said I wouldn't go under a 10 year old; you will get a lot more choice if you go for one a bit older and has been there/done it. The pony club website is a great place to start (they aren't all 10k - a lot are though!).

Also don't negate your previous experience. In my heart of hearts, I saw the warning signs when I went to view my first boy. He was spooky on mounting, girthy when being tacked, his owner seemed frightened of him, and he was flighty in the school. I just ignored all of that because he was pretty and I wanted a horse. His sad story made me feel sorry for him. I wasn't bad at buying, I just ignored my own common sense! As others have said, videos, lots of consideration, and if anything - ANYTHING strikes you as off at all, don't buy. The right one will find you!

 

[FestiveFuzz]

I honestly wouldn't be put off by an older horse at all. My last horse was 19 when I got her, yet people were always surprised when we entered veteran classes as she certainly didn't look or act her age. She was a fantastic dressage schoolmistress and had one heck of a jump on her (when you could channel her excitement!). She could still be an absolute madam when she wanted to be but I absolutely adored her and no horse has even come close to comparing to her since.

 

[cobgoblin]

I would look for a ride and drive cob, perhaps 10-12yrs, not too young and not too old.Also should be good in traffic if it has been driven, which is always a plus.

 

[AdorableAlice]

I would look for a ride and drive cob, perhaps 10-12yrs, not too young and not too old.Also should be good in traffic if it has been driven, which is always a plus.

You would be very fortunate to pick up an all rounder cob in the prime of his life for £2000.

 

[Suec04]

I agree on PC prices (on the website at least), a bit jealous of the kids whose parents can afford to buy them a £10k pony. Or, as I suspect the case may often be, whose parents are prepared to put a £10k pony on their credit card!

If you really can't find anyone to take with you, then ask your daughter (I presume she'll be going with you) to video you riding it (and vice versa if she goes along, if not ask the seller to), and likewise, get a video of the seller riding it. Get lots of photos of the horse stood squarely, I'm sure there will be people on here who will have a look and let you know their thoughts

I too am awful at price negotiations- I asked if they were open to offer for the first one I looked at earlier this year. The answer was categorically "no". Horse failed the vetting and seller still owes me my £200 deposit. Barry's seller said she was open to reasonable offers when I asked her, I got about £250 off him. I wish I'd tried a little bit lower

taking videos is a great idea! I hadn't thought of that. thank you. my daughter has come with me on the 3 occasions that we looked at horses back in the summer. none of them were right for one reason or another and she did get very depressed about it all, so I am considering doing the first viewing in future on my own so that she doesn't keep getting her hopes up. then she can come along to a second viewing if I think it has potential. not always possible though if the horse happens to be more than 2hours away :-/

 

[Suec04]

although i'm not in a position to rehome yet, need to get winter done and spent a little more time adjusting to my new situation, I have seen some beauties on my local rspca website, £500 adoption fee. Think blue cross has an online application form, good luck.

thank you. I will definitely check them out!

 

[ifandbutwhynot]

Friend of mine paid £3500 for an RDA Irish cob who she still loans out to them during the week. He's 7 and he won't hurt a fly on the ground but as soon as you ride him off the lead rein he's like something posessed! On the other hand I have a 5yo TB that, admittedly, wouldn't harm a fly, although she does teach you what you're doing wrong!

From the amount of people I know who've bought first horses I'd look for horses 9+yrs, ask for videos, go and try the horse out a couple of times before buying (if it's genuinely what the horse is advertised as, the owner shouldn't be too annoyed about a couple of visits - that's the rule our yard play by anyhow). Depending on your and your daughters level of confidence and what you want to do with the horse, but perhaps look for people in your area and friends of friends etc (people you know would potentially know the horse)? I know a few people who have joined 'buying and selling' facebook groups in their areas and found horses they (or friends) know that have proved suitable and trustworthy.

Not sure if any of that helps but good luck!

 

[Suec04]

I bought a 5 year old after a long break. It didn't pan out well for me and for him. Admittedly he was a lot more sensitive than any youngster I'd had before, and hadn't had a very good start in life. I kept him for almost a year before giving in and selling.

I am sure there are 5 year olds out there who are novice rides, but the chances are slimmer and like others have said, confidence is fragile. When I started looking again, I said I wouldn't go under a 10 year old; you will get a lot more choice if you go for one a bit older and has been there/done it. The pony club website is a great place to start (they aren't all 10k - a lot are though!).

Also don't negate your previous experience. In my heart of hearts, I saw the warning signs when I went to view my first boy. He was spooky on mounting, girthy when being tacked, his owner seemed frightened of him, and he was flighty in the school. I just ignored all of that because he was pretty and I wanted a horse. His sad story made me feel sorry for him. I wasn't bad at buying, I just ignored my own common sense! As others have said, videos, lots of consideration, and if anything - ANYTHING strikes you as off at all, don't buy. The right one will find you!

Thank you SadKen. the ones I have been to see so far, my gut feeling was that something wasn't right and so I didn't proceed. but then I began to think that I was being too picky and so lowered my 'must have criteria'....not a good move! thankfully, some very good advice from a dear friend has put me straight and told me that there is no rush to find our perfect friend, hence why I am now waiting till the new year to start looking again. as you say, hopefully the right one will find us

 

[PolarSkye]

I think part of my hesitancy in buying an older horse is that I have never owned one older than 13 and so I wouldn't really know where to begin, management wise. I am willing to learn though, after reading such lovely posts about the golden oldies

My boy is 14/15 . . . he DOESN'T have good feet but he does have clean limbs . . . he events, he hunts, he hacks, he does "airs above the ground" and he generally behaves like a five-year-old . . . he was diagnosed with navicular late last Spring (see bad feet) but he is sound with good management and my vet reckons he will continue to do what he currently does well into his twenties.

P

 

[Suec04]

Friend of mine paid £3500 for an RDA Irish cob who she still loans out to them during the week. He's 7 and he won't hurt a fly on the ground but as soon as you ride him off the lead rein he's like something posessed! On the other hand I have a 5yo TB that, admittedly, wouldn't harm a fly, although she does teach you what you're doing wrong!

From the amount of people I know who've bought first horses I'd look for horses 9+yrs, ask for videos, go and try the horse out a couple of times before buying (if it's genuinely what the horse is advertised as, the owner shouldn't be too annoyed about a couple of visits - that's the rule our yard play by anyhow). Depending on your and your daughters level of confidence and what you want to do with the horse, but perhaps look for people in your area and friends of friends etc (people you know would potentially know the horse)? I know a few people who have joined 'buying and selling' facebook groups in their areas and found horses they (or friends) know that have proved suitable and trustworthy.

Not sure if any of that helps but good luck!

thank you very much. shockingly I am not of FB anymore (unheard of I know! lol) but I am tempted to go back on there just for all the groups that people have been telling me about! . both my daughter and are novice riders, although I have owned, worked and ridden horses for the best part of my life, I am returning after a 10yr break so consider myself to be novicey again. I certainly don't bounce as well as I used to! lol. my daughter is also a nervous rider but improves when she trusts the horse she's riding. we want to have lessons, hack out, do some local showing and maybe some fun rides in time. I would definitely prefer to buy word of mouth

 

[ifandbutwhynot]

If you don't have facebook might not be worth making a new one although would you be able to ask friends to keep an eye out for anything they feel might be suitable? Also another thing that's just popped into my head, before I loaned my (other) 17yo TB I had a handful of riding lessons on him at the place where he is kept (he was bred and lived there before too but it might help?), not sure if that would be possible in many cases but it certainly helped me because he seemed to have a better idea of what was going on.

This might also help your daughter if she would build her confidence by riding the horse a few times? Or perhaps a loan with a view to buy?

Going to watch local shows might also be an idea for you, getting to know people who go a lot and who might know of suitable horses?

Once again, best of luck finding your perfect horse!

 

[CBAnglo]

It really depends on the horse. When I was looking, I had a budget similar to you and ended up with a 4 yr old CBxTB that had been backed and broken (badly) then rebacked (even worse) and was a nightmare - biting, kicking, couldnt lead him etc. He was my first horse and I have to say he was my horse of a lifetime. He taught me so much (mostly how creative I could be when crying outside his stable writing for sale ads).

Last year I bought another 4 yr old (connemara) as a confidence giver after my sister's TB put her in hospital and she decided she didnt like horses anymore. Within 2 months she was out hacking on her own, cantering in open fields etc. She hadnt ridden in 2 yrs before that (but obviously handled the horses on a daily basis) and she hadnt hacked out in the year after her accident, let alone cantered (in a school or otherwise).

If you get something with a good temperament, then age doesnt matter. Our scatty TB is 14 and is as temperamental now as he was as a 7 yr old.

 

[Suec04]

"This might also help your daughter if she would build her confidence by riding the horse a few times? Or perhaps a loan with a view to buy?

Going to watch local shows might also be an idea for you, getting to know people who go a lot and who might know of suitable horses?"

A loan with a view to buy would be a good idea.
I am a regular at all of our local shows I hang around the stewards and happily put jumps back up and hold horses for those walking courses etc. BUT, DOH! I didn't think to ask them or put a notice up asking for help with buying a horse!! Thank you

 

[Penumbra]

I think part of my hesitancy in buying an older horse is that I have never owned one older than 13 and so I wouldn't really know where to begin, management wise. I am willing to learn though, after reading such lovely posts about the golden oldies

In my opinion, most horses can manage at least until their late teens without anything in the way of special management. If they develop specific health conditions, obviously they need to be managed for their condition, but if/when you reach that stage, you can get specialist advice from a vet. Many, many horses and ponies are perfectly capable of working into their twenties, without much in the way of specialist management.

I think you will get a bit more for your money if you look at slightly older horses. I do agree with looking carefully at how the horse is managed. If it is currently in a lot of work, but at your home would be only in light work, then issues may start to develop.

I think it is also important that you look for a horse that is well mannered on the ground if your daughter is not experienced with horses. Something that is difficult to lead, or is difficult in the stable may worry her just as much as something that has problems ridden. This is an area where people do get issues with youngsters, even if they are perfectly save to ride.

 

[moosea]

Hi,
Just wanted to point out a few things about older horses.
Firstly, not all older horses are sane, quiet or suitable for novices!
Insurance can be a problem for older horses and it's worth checking out a few companies to see if they have an upper age limit and/ or restrictions on the type of cover offered to oldies.

When I started out in horses a horse of 7 years was considered 'aged' and should have been fully educated, 15 was old and 20 was ancient! These days 7 is young, 15 is 'aged' and 20 is mature!

Older horses have a lot to give, and with your budget I'd think that you would get the best value from one.